A Very Special Q&A with Siena Castellon, founder of Neurodiversity Celebration Week Mon, March 3/21, 7-7:45pm PST, on Zoom REEL hosted an inspirational Q&A session to honor Neurodiversity Celebration Week 2022 with founder Siena Castellon. Learn about her experiences at school and life and why she created this special week to honor the neurodivergent. (transcript below) Please join us for a Q&A with Siena Castellon, founder of Neurodiversity Celebration Week, and Stanford student. Learn about her experiences at school, why she founded this special week, and her books (The Spectrum Girl's Survival Guide and The Spectrum Girls Survival Toolkit). "My name is Siena Castellon. I am a multi-award-winning neurodiversity advocate, author, Young Leader for the SDGs, and the founder of Neurodiversity Celebration Week. I am also a teenager who is autistic and has ADHD, dyslexia, and dyspraxia. As a student with several learning differences, I know that there is still a stigma associated with having special educational needs and that there are still many misconceptions about what it means to have learning or thinking differences. I want to change this." You Can Make a Difference With One Small Step Ask your school to take the Neurodiversity Celebration Week pledge Send this template email to your school's leader: Dear School Leader, Did you know that 1 in 5 children has a learning difference, and these neurodiverse students often have negative school experiences that focus on their challenges. It doesn't have to be this way. Together, we can change the narrative. Instead of focusing only on the drawbacks of being neurodivergent, we can acknowledge the many strengths and talents that come from thinking and perceiving the world differently. By celebrating the strengths of neurodivergent students, we can begin the seismic shift in the way neurodiverse students are perceived and treated, including how they feel about themselves. Please sign our school up for Neurodiversity Celebration Week and bring one of their suggested activities to our school. Celebrate With Us Share our list of books featuring neurodiverse themes with your school library or visit our local partner bookstores ( Kepler's , Books Inc , Reading Bug , Linden Tree ) to pick up a book for your classroom or home Visit Palo Alto's Mitchell Park or Rinconada Libraries for their neurodiversity book displays and virtual story times or ask your local library to create a display Forward our blog post: Using Picture Books To Teach About Neurodiversity: Better Understanding Ourselves and Each Other Read the transcript here diana here um we are reel2e.org you can visit our website and we are helping twice exceptional students thrive in schools by creating resources and events for parents and educators so you can check us out at reel2e.org for more information and this week we're celebrating neurodiversity celebration week and the founder of this week sienna is here to speak with us tonight. sienna castellon is a 19 year old multi-award-winning neurodiversity advocate best-selling award-winning author and a un young leader for the sdgs you'll have to tell us about that she is the founder of neurodiversity celebration week an international initiative that challenges stereotypes and misconceptions about neurological differences by highlighting the strengths and accomplishments of the neurodivergent community. sienna is the author of the spectrum girls got survival guide how to grow up awesome and autistic love that title which won a 2021 silver nautilus book award and the first place 2021 purple dragonfly book award sienna is also the author of the spectrum girls survival toolkit the workbook for autistic girls. sienna has won over 25 national and international awards for her advocacy including the 2021 commonwealth youth award and the campaigner of the year at the european diversity awards we are so excited to have her here and this is going to be a q a so we have some questions pre-prepared and then sienna would love to get questions from the audience as well. so i'll kick it off with a few questions of our own and then we'd love to have you guys either unmute and ask or you can ask through the chat so sienna we would love to start off just hearing about your experience in um you know your elementary and secondary education uh what was it like as a neurodiverse student and what inspired you to start neurodiversity celebration week. so i was diagnosed with my learning differences throughout my education so my first diagnosis was when i was eight years old and my last was when i was 15. and it was just a journey throughout with my dyslexia diagnosis there were a lot of challenges that came with that. i have an uncle who's dyslexic and so my mother saw my symptoms very early on and identified it as dyslexia and she went into the school really to just say how do i get her diagnosed and the school told her there's no way that she can be dyslexic because she can read. teachers weren't educated on dyslexia so they were actually just using like the misconceptions and stigmas that they had just picked up from conversations or wherever they found this information from but it wasn't through teaching or training and so i ended up not getting diagnosed at that young age i think i was five when my mother first identified it um i instead had to wait till i was 11 to get that diagnosis. and because of that delay i wasn't able to get extra time i wasn't able to get the support i needed i had to go through a system where teachers would constantly critique me on my spelling. i remember there was this criteria for one of the exams i was taking that you had to have perfect spelling to get the top grade and so the content of my essay was a top grade but because of my spelling i ended up getting a c and it was just things like that where i was constantly being shut down because of my dyslexia. and then even when i got the diagnosis teachers said okay well you can get extra time but then we'll still grade you on your spelling but the problem is extra time doesn't make me spell correctly you can give me all the time in the world and i'm still going to have spelling challenges because that's the nature of dyslexia. and so i had to spend you know it was very challenging to be in a school system that is fundamentally discriminatory against you and that was just in the dyslexia department. you know within dyspraxia dyspraxia is a motor coordination disorder that makes you clumsy and disorganized i would have teachers who knew about my dyspraxia diagnosis and they would paint me out as a liar that was one thing that happened regularly. what would happen is i remember i was 11 years old and i didn't have my pleasure and so i came into school and my teacher said to me where is your blazer and i said to her it's in my locker and then i went to my locker and it wasn't in my locker. and so another teacher said to me where is your blazer and i said it is at home and so these teachers ended up talking to each other and they said siena just lies about all these different things and they contacted my parents and they said she has a lying problem. because what would happen is i just wouldn't know i wouldn't know where my blazer is i'm dyspraxic i have organization problems i lost my blazer i lost my workbook i lost whatever it was and so i would come up with guesses as to where it could be and then you know i would get more information along the way and realize that guest was incorrect i would check my locker and it wouldn't be in there. and so instead of teachers saying okay well this kid is dyslexic this kid has some organization problems that support her with this organization they just kind of gaslit me and came up with these narratives to explain something that was very easily explained through my diagnosis. and so i was actually bullied by teachers a lot along the way and i had to move schools very frequently. and when i reached 13 i just got very fed up with it and i thought i want to create something so the teachers can educate themselves and i also want to create a resource so that children can be supported. because i was trying to find help online to see you know how i could work with my organization how i could um improve you know my spelling in the school system how i could get by and a lot of the resources were designed for parents it would be things like you should pack your child's backpack before school all directed at the parent instead of the student. and some of the advice because it wasn't directed for me wasn't helpful and so i am i created qr mentoring which was a website to support and mentor children with learning differences but also to provide some resources for teachers. and then from there i realized that i wanted to do more within the school system i wanted to really create something that would educate teachers but that would also educate the neurotypical peers of neurodivergent students and so i created neurodiversity celebration week. and it's a week run into schools where you flip the narrative and you focus on the positives of learning differences instead of the negatives and you also just educate yourself on the benefits of neurodiversity and the empowering message of neurodiversity. and so i have been running my event for a couple years now and i've really seen it grow at the beginning it was just schools that would take part but then i found that a lot of the principles of neurodiversity celebration week aligned with what some businesses were trying to achieve and so i opened it up to businesses. and now we've got schools organizations charities all involved in neurodiversity celebration week. that is an amazing story i you really took something so difficult and turned it into something so positive um i'm curious you talk so much about strengths and neurodiversity which is something that we really believe in. what do you feel your neurodiversity what strengths have they given you and how have they helped you achieve all that you've achieved until today. definitely um with my dyslexia i found a lot of creativity that comes with that um and it's helped me kind of create my week there's a lot that goes into it with coming up with ideas and i will i'll have to create all these different activity plans and like lesson packs and assembly packs and so my finding that my creativity really helps me do that. with my autism there's a logical thinking that comes with it which really helps me in the sciences i wanted to do math and physics and i got a place at imperial actually to study material science because i was very much into the the stem focus um because that really aligned with my structured way of thinking. i like with the my autism was definitely a superpower in that field um i soon started at stanford and took a cs class and now i've found that i'm very interested in that because it's really just following rules like you're just given like a set rules for like syntax and the way you structure things and that's perfect for the way that my autism works. i just i just love it it's so i mean occasionally like you'll get a bug and you'll have no idea what's going on but then you'll find like oh i i broke this rule and it's all about just kind of memory i i love it i love just the format of it and i it's completely due to my autism. and then with my adhd individual they did this study and they found that individuals with adhd have more beta waves in their brain and these beta waves help you to stay calm under pressure. and so if you look at um individuals who work in the emergency room surgeons firefighters police officers and actually i'm astronauts they're a very disproportionate number of astronauts who have adhd along with all the other professions i listed very disproportionate number of individuals with adhd because of this ability to stay calm under pressure. and i really found that when i was running my week and running all the campaigns that i've done in my five years of advocacy i would just be able to focus at the task at hand and not get stressed out when you're writing a speech for an event that's in an hour and you're only on like page one and you need seven more pages or when you're presenting in front of hundreds of people. i found that i was always able to to stay calm and focus on what needs to be achieved rather than you know panicking or stressing about what was going on and i attribute all of that to my adhd. wow that that i mean really highlights the strengths and we don't talk about them enough and so i'm so um happy to hear all those things i think i definitely want to talk about them with my own neurodiverse children um so you have such a positive energy and so much enthusiasm given all the things that you know the teacher bullying and everything you went through where do you think that comes from. is it something because we had a lot of questions about you know what can parents do to support their neurodiverse children. yeah i think it came from educating myself and really learning about neurodiversity and understanding that these individuals were wrong you know there's there's a big difference between being dyspraxic and being a liar very big difference. and i at the time he really focused on what these teachers these teachers um when my mother went in and said you know she can't spell i think that it could be dyslexia they said no and the way that they explained it was she can read and so she's not dyslexic she's lazy she just doesn't care about her spelling and that's why she has bad spelling. and i would do horribly on spelling tests and they would say it's because she's lazy she just doesn't care about her work and it was really hard to hear that but when i educated myself on dyslexia i realized i'm not lazy you know i'm putting all this work into doing these spelling tests. you know i remember i would stand outside the classroom and i had a kid come up to me and say hey i haven't studied can i take a look at the spelling test words and he took a look at my list went into the exam and got 100 just by looking at my list ahead of time i was studying those um words every single day for 20 minutes but yet i was the one who was painted out as lazy and he was the one who was painted out as oh you got 100 so you must have prepared well done here's a coke sticker. and so i in educating myself and understanding the way that my neurodiversity affects me and then looking back and realizing okay this is why this event happened this is why um this spelling test went this way this is why i was constantly forgetting my blazer i was able to rewrite that narrative in my mind that these teachers had painted at me. and i was able to rewrite it in an empowering way and uh okay well this was because of my dyslexia this is a challenge that i have but here are all the strengths i have. that's amazing one of the questions that we got um that was pre-submitted was do you find diagnostic labels helpful or limiting and we get a lot a lot of parents ask us should i tell which i reveal my child's diagnosis um to the child and so i'm curious what you think about that it sounds like it was super helpful for you to understand your diagnosis. a hundred percent it's very important to tell your child about their diagnosis um for me with my autism diagnosis i was diagnosed at 12 and i was told like my parents made it were very open with me about it and it meant that after i was diagnosed i gave myself a lot more grace when it came to some social blunders i would make because of my autism. i really wondered why i was the way i was there were children in my class you could just have these natural conversations you could come up to them and you could say anything and they would be able to give you some kind of response whereas with me i would script conversations um i would come up with answers to how was your day what did you do over the weekend because i found it very difficult to think on the fly in these social situations and come up with something that my peers would appreciate. and so i would watch tv shows and i would write notes on things with certain characters would say and i would memorize these things and then you know conversation is natural it goes in so many different directions and so there were times when i would be talking to somebody and it would go really well and then they would mention what they did over the weekend and then a conversation would start over some topic that i hadn't prepared and i would really struggle. i also didn't have natural facial expressions and people would comment on it i remember parents of children in my class would say why aren't you smiling when i was in the playground and i always i remember saying to my mother do you have to think about your facial expressions or do they just come naturally and she just said to me i've never had to think about them. and i was over here having to be like okay you say how are you doing and then you smile i would have to kind of tell myself when to do it like put a cue in for that facial expression and i always knew that there was something different i always wondered what's going on with this because this is not normal. and it caused me a lot of anxiety knowing that i was different and not knowing why and feeling like there was something wrong with me and when i was told oh it's autism i no longer felt alone because then i realized there's a community of people who were going through this with me. i think that if my diagnosis had been kept from me i wouldn't have had that moment and i would have continued to feel like what's wrong with me and it would have created some some mental health problems. and so definitely i would say being very open with your children about the learning differences or neurodiversities that they have. thank you that's a super helpful answer we got some all caps super helpful in the chat um and so given you taught you said you spoke to your mom about this can you tell us a little bit about how your parents supported you and what advice you have for the parents on this call and supporting their own neurodiverse children. my mother would she was like my advocate so i would um she would help me to understand my neurodiversity she would go online and she would research different um tips for dyslexia dyspraxia when i was like very young when i was eight years old and i was diagnosed with dyspraxia she would go online and she found these organizational tips like these post-it notes and so we had post-it notes all over the house with all the tasks that i had to do. we would take the post-it note off once i achieved them and she would help me organize myself she would contact the school sometimes and ask for clarification on homework assignments when she thought that i might have written out the homework assignment wrong. she would help me understand my neurodiversity and then she would advocate for me so i would tell her yeah i need the teacher to email me the homework assignment so i don't write it out wrong and then she would be the one who would go into the school and ask for that. or i remember there was a time at school where i'm i'm twice exceptional and so at school i was considered gifted but i also had these learning differences and i had a teacher who said it is not fair for you to have extra time because extra time is for the kids at the bottom of the class and you're at the top of the class if you get extra time you'll have an unfair advantage. and she fundamentally misunderstood the importance of extra time extra time isn't to give me an advantage compared to somebody else and extra time has nothing to do with other people extra time has to do with my potential. when you look at whether somebody needs extra time you say okay if this person didn't have dyslexia dyspraxia adhd how would they do on this test and for me i have a slow reading speed because of my dyslexia and so when i have to do an english comprehension test if i didn't have dyslexia i would do it a lot faster and i would be able to finish it. and so extra time gives me the ability to be at the same level as my potential to be at the same level as i would be if i didn't have dyslexia hypothetically it doesn't quite work that way in practice because extra time doesn't help with spelling problems but that's the idea behind it. and she misunderstood that and so she was saying oh well compared to joey in the class you're now going to have an advantage and so my mother went in and explained that to her and had a long conversation about why i need extra time. and because of her advocating on my behalf i was then able to get this very valuable adjustment and so she um she did all of that for me as i grew up i was able to take on that role and so now at university she has no involvement i advocate on myself all the time but it was very important for her to do that for me when i was eight nine years old. that sounds like an amazing mom i'm glad that she did that for you and um you know it really helps um a lot of parents today hear what she did and what we could be doing for our kids because sometimes pictures. i was thinking what a powerful statement about the time and the fairness because that comes up so much such a such a powerful story sienna about a lot um there was also our friend that danielle that talked about how one day when she was in school her friend broke both wrists and came into school with both broken wrists and the teachers made accommodations in writing for them. and she's like just because there's invisible sort of equivalent of broken wrists you're not giving these kids what they need did you expect the broken wrist child to continue to write like all the other kids in the class no you didn't so anyway i yes i think the way that you put it is a really powerful way to say it. so what what do you hope that schools will change so hopefully they will more embrace um strength aspect of neurodiverse students and that peers will be more understanding of students with learning differences um what do you hope schools will change in order to support nerd over students to reach their full potential feel confidence in who they are. i wish that teachers would listen more um one of the challenges that i have with teachers even well-intentioned teachers is they like to maintain that power dynamic of i'm in a position of knowledge and you have to learn from me. and so when that's kind of inverted when a student comes to them and says let me explain some adjustments that i need let me effectively teach you how to teach me teachers don't like that. and so a lot of the time and this is an experience that i've had a teacher might have taught a class with another individual with adhd or they might have taught a class with another individual with autism and so you go to them and you say oh i need some adjustments and they tell you yay i know what i'm doing i i've been teaching for years i've been teaching for 15 years i've had all these students come through my class with adhd i know how to support them. and whenever i hear that i just think oh no because if you've met one person with autism you've met one person with autism we have very different experiences. i am very sensitive to touch i can feel the wind when i go outside and so there are times where i have to um dress in a way that i don't get distressed from the wind that's how sensitive i am i have a friend who broke her arm and she didn't know she walked around with a broken arm for a couple of days before she was able to before she realized that something was wrong and that was because she was under sensitive she couldn't feel that that it was broken. and so we have two of vastly different experiences and so if he had had my friend in the class she would have needed very different adjustments and the adjustments that she would have needed if applied to me could have even been detrimental. and so it's really important that teachers are open and listen to the unique adjustments that each student needs because you can share a label but it have very different implications on your life and you have very different presentations and need very different adjustments. and so i would say for teachers to never assume that they know everything about an accommodation even if someone were to come to me and ask me for adjustments i would not say oh i know all the adjustments i know what i'm doing instead i would say what do you need what would be helpful for you and so i wish that more teachers would do that. i'm going to edit that little segment and send it to some teachers in my life we have a question in the chat that i thought was really good and that's um how do you deal with people who doubt your autism because you don't fit what they imagine autism to be. um we uh get a lot of that just women in general um don't always fit the diagnosis diagnostic criteria for some of these diagnoses and get overlooked under diagnosed or misdiagnosed or never diagnosed or diagnosed really late um i don't know so this person's asking how do you deal with people who doubt it because you don't fit the image of what they think autism is. this is something that i really struggle with um it hasn't happened recently because of zoom but there was a time oh it was the biggest challenge every single event i would go to where i would speak somebody would come up to me afterwards and say oh you gave this speech you were so eloquent you can't be autistic. and it would be the most frustrating thing in the world because what people don't realize is there's a difference between maybe what you see when i'm on stage and what you might see in my personal life. i remember i had to go to one event where i had to go on the tube it's um like the subway in england and i had multiple panic attacks i had a panic attack thinking about having to go on the tube because i'm hypersensitive and very sensitive to touch to sound to light and so being on a loud tube that's packed with other people it's just a sensory nightmare. and so i had a panic attack thinking about doing this i had a panic attack on the tube um which was awful and so i had to leave before my stop continue my panic attack on the tube station and then get back on while having all of this anxiety and then i end up finally getting to the location. and i was just so frazzled i felt like i couldn't give my speech because i'd had this really hectic morning but i end up going on stage anyway give my speech and then maybe seven people come up to me afterwards you know like you can't be autistic and i just thought not today you cannot give me that today i have had the morning i've had. and so my response to that is i would just try to educate them i would try to say look there are very different presentations of autism there are some people that with their presentation they are mute or selectively mute there are some people that with their presentation they cannot make eye contact. but with my unique way that my autism affects me and also the way that i was raised i was raised as a girl and so i had to deal with a lot of societal pressures growing up people would pressure me about my facial expressions you know people would come up to me and say why aren't you smiling. growing up because of my sensory processing disorder i wanted to wear one outfit but because i'm a girl people expected me to take pride in my appearance to have a fashion taste to want to have varied outfits. and so when i would wear this same um clothing combination people would comment on it people would give me a lot of grief i would effectively be bullied by adults over and so i ended up doing what is called masking i hid my autism symptoms and i conformed to the expectations of a neurotypical. and so that meant that i don't present in the way that one might expect because in i'm instead of embracing my autism traits i've been raised to hide them and so that's what i will tell people who doubt me. i will say naturally i do not behave this way when you look at how i presented when i was younger i didn't make eye contact um but now because of all these pressures i mask and so i explain it that way. and and i say you know you can't judge an autistic person based on their behavior on one particular day the thing with autism is it's not like dyslexia that's a constant my autism changes day to day. there are some days where i cannot leave the house because of my sensory processing disorders whereas those are other days where i'm happy to do so and so you can't take a good day or you can't take one particular moment of my day and judge and and use that to extrapolate on how i am every day and so i explain it that way. wow amazing answer and since you brought up um masking there's a question in the chat um given that we are in a world that still has so much misunderstanding and biases against neurodiversity do you recommend those that can to mask it or die at or to disclose diagnoses when applying to schools colleges and jobs. i would say i'm not an advocate of mastery i didn't really have like a choice in the matter i just ended up masking as a survival mechanism but it causes a lot of anxiety um especially growing up when you force yourself to do something that is not natural to you it can be very draining and it can be very stressful. so i wish that i had been raised in an environment where my autistic traits were embraced and where people were supportive of me not making eye contact and was supportive of other behaviors that i had because hiding them is very exhausting. it's you you just have to kind of act all day and now it's become so natural to me that i can't turn it off but at the end of the day you get very worn out by it because and a neurotypical person they can just have a conversation and not think about their body language and their facial expressions and their voice intonation they can just talk naturally. whereas when you're masking you have to worry about all of those things and it's draining to have all of those added pressures on you. and so when i say like when possible you know do not pressure your child to mask or if you are autistic yourself i would say if you can do not lost but i do recognize that there are a lot of social pressures that mean that sometimes you don't have the the choice to do so. i always recommend disclosing there was a time where in applications i wouldn't disclose because i felt like it would be held against me but i've since changed my mind because i felt like would i want to work for an organization that would hold it against me is that a dynamic that i want to be a part of. and so for me i'm very happy to disclose and so i will make them aware of all of my adjustments that i might need and i will make them aware of all the neurodiversities that i have and then i will see the way that they respond. if they respond with okay we're really happy to make these accommodations in the interview we're really happy to support you then i'm very comfortable going forward with accepting a role from that place if they choose to offer one to me but if instead they say we're not willing to offer you these accommodations then i know that that's not the the place of work that's not the university for me that's not the school that's not the job for me. and so that is one thing i do i always disclosed music is just a test to see what it would be like if i accepted a role at that organization. someone is asking if you disclosed when you applied to stanford if you are comfortable sharing i wrote my application on my uh neurodiversities um because it asked me kind of about my extracurriculars and so i talked about how i was an advocate kind of my whole application was like revolved around my my advocacy and so i was very open about it. um but one thing that i did is instead of disclosing just by saying i'm autistic full stop i disclose by saying i'm autistic and this is how it affects me this is my unique presentation because people have a lot of misconceptions around autism. oftentimes people would have met one person with autism or maybe watch a television show like big bang and seen one presentation of autism and so when you say i'm autistic they think of sheldon or they think of that person that they know and they expect you to behave in that exact way. and so it's important to say i'm autistic and this is how it affects me so that then you don't get judged by whatever um by you know whatever standard that they have. and so i talked about my unique presentations of each of my differences in my application and i talked about it in a positive way and how i consider it a superpower. i love that um that comes up a lot for people applying to various schools at different levels here so um super helpful to think of it that way um cali would like to know do you ima how do you imagine combining your interest in computer science and neurodiversity if at all. i if there's an opportunity to combine them i would be happy to i'm not sure how i would do it but i plan on kind of keeping it separate um you know computer science being my job and neurodiversity celebration week being kind of a side project that i do. um currently that's the way it's going with i prioritize my education and my schoolwork and then in the time i have outside of working on psets and going to classes i work on my neurodiversity celebration week. so um start jumping back to um the masking questions someone says when i think of my three the one with more social anxiety masks the best when you think of yourself as a kid did you care what others thought or you were forced. i was forced by necessity to think about what others thought because i was bullied a lot so i would be in school environments where kids would call me a robot kids would there were a lot of challenges that came from the fact that i didn't make facial expressions and i didn't have voice intonations um a lot everybody wanted to comment on that i had teachers parents kids commenting on that um and. with students with like kids they're kind they're vicious they'll notice that you have some difference and they will hone in on that and give you all this grief for the way that you behave. and so for me i was forced to care about the way that people perceived me because i would transfer schools and when i would transfer into a new school i would think this is a new opportunity for me to give a different impression i cannot let this group of people think that i am a robot and be bullied for it because i don't want to move school again. and so in the social environment i would constantly be thinking about how i was perceived i would think after every interaction i would have i would analyze it i would think okay do they think i'm weird do they think that i'm robotic did they think that i am fake do they think that i'm putting on an act with my facial expressions. um i was this was something that really bothered me i was bullied for my facial expressions and then i worked on making facial expressions but the thing is i would cue them and so i would have a flat affect and then i would think okay you've got to smile now and then i would smile but there would be no kind of lead-in it would just be this on and off switch. and so i ended up getting bullied for not making facial expressions and then getting bullied for making facial expressions um and so i ended up very much caring about the way i was perceived. it's heartbreaking to hear that and it's so inspirational how what change you're making in the world given the experiences that you faced so if any if other people have questions feel free to post them in the chat i'll read some another one that came in the rsvp form. what advice would you give to caretakers on how to best support neurodivergent teens that want to hide their differences it's hard to know how to help them when they internalize their struggles and dismiss any attempts to highlight their strengths. i would say that just never give up on highlighting the strengths just always keep bringing it up and even if this the the teen kind of rejects them and maybe disagrees with these strengths it's important that they continue to hear them because they may eventually start to internalize um the the message of positivity. for wanting to hide um traits i do recognize that for some people that is advantageous for me it was very advantageous when i was in a mainstream school environment where i was being bullied. and my mother supported me in doing this i would have conversations with her and i would tell her you know if i do something that you think is different or that you think is maybe um a bit weird or that you think one of my peers would perceive as weird let me know and so she would occasionally stop me in conversation and say you know maybe you could have said this instead um because my mother is neurotypical. the other thing that my mother was incredibly helpful with is preparing for job interviews um she would tell me okay this is how you shake somebody's hand. and for me as an autistic person i'm very logical and so the way i think is i'm going in for a job interview i only need to focus on the skills that are needed for this job and showing the person that i have the skills needed as an autistic individual i do not think oh they are going to ascertain how confident i am based on the strength of a handshake like that logically doesn't make sense to me but that is the way the world works. and so my mother is neurotypical was able to be that bridge in between and so she would show me okay this is how you give a proper handshake this is you need to look the person in the eye you when you respond to questions like this is kind of the way to do it. and so she was um incredibly helpful in that and when she would give me advice it was always from an empowering way it was always from a let me teach you and support you not let me highlight your challenges. and so she would she would phrase things as why don't you try doing it this way instead of the way you are doing it is wrong and so that was always something that i really appreciated about. i love that we actually have a question from a student um and i think this is gonna be our last question for the evening i know we could ask you questions for hours this has been amazing but i know um sienna has had non-stop calls from 3 a.m so we're so lucky she's still able to be awake with us. um do you have any advice for advocating on a learning difference for example dyscalculia and this is a student asking how to advocate for themselves. i would say um before you go in to make your make your points and advocate for yourself it's really important that you understand your neurodiversity so what i do when i advocate for myself is i think what do i want to achieve what accommodations do i need. and so i think of all of the accommodations that would be helpful to me and then i think of why i need them and so then when i go in i'm able to say this is what i need and this is why i need it as opposed to i'm just calculate i'm going to need a bit of support full stop. it's important to be able to say this is exactly what i mean because there are some teachers who won't know how to support you if you go in and you just say this is my diagnosis. and so if you're able to tell them clearly what you need and why that's the important element you need to be able to justify it because there are some teachers who will feel like oh well giving you this accommodation will give you an unfair advantage that's something that i get a lot teachers thinking the accommodations give you unfair advantages. but if you're able to say but this is why i need it this is why it will level the playing field and not elevate me you have a much higher chance of getting that adjustment. thank you so much and maureen thank you for asking a question i love that we have students here um so just to wrap this up we'll let you um go as you've had three days in one today. i wanted to share the link to neurodiversity celebration week in the chat everyone can ask their schools to sign the pledge and sienna has an exhaustive list of activities that your school can do to promote neurodiversity and strengths and understanding in your school. there's a lot of amazing resources and posters and many things available there so thank you so much sienna and thank you everyone for coming this evening we recorded the evening and we will share it um i don't know a lot of people wanted to be here couldn't make it they're very excited to watch the recording and we wish you the best of luck um at stanford and with everything you do. we look forward to seeing what comes next with all your superpowers um you're really an inspiration to so many people so thank you so much now thank you so much it was lovely to be here today and to talk with you you too good night everyone.

One of the top concerns from our REEL community is how to support anxiety in 2e (twice-exceptional) learners, with 65% of survey respondents sharing that their child struggles with anxiety. With so many treatment options available, how can parents decide which path to take? Join our expert panel of psychologists and therapists to explore several effective approaches. Dr. Kari Berquist will discuss the SPACE program, Dr. Bradley Siu will introduce DBT (Dialectical Behavior Therapy), and Toni Ratzburg, LMFT, will share insights on integrative perspective therapy, , where therapists interweave different approaches based on the specific needs and personalities of the client. This approach is focused on the relationship, collaboration, and the strengths of the client and clinician. The panel will also cover when to seek professional therapy versus techniques that can be implemented at home. We'll leave ample time for your questions to help you feel confident in choosing the best support for your child. Read the transcript here Welcome everyone to the final real Speaker series. Event of 2024 navigating anxiety into e-learners, therapy options and home strategies. We're so excited to have our guests here and to have you here just in case you're not familiar with real. We are a local nonprofit that strives to ensure Silicon Valley. Twice exceptional students thrive in school, and we host events such as this for parents. And we also do professional development for educators. So if you're here. You're probably familiar with twice exceptionality. But just in case we'll talk about the definition we like to use that comes from bridges. We think of 2 e. As learners who have both distinguishing strengths, high abilities or potential in one or more areas and complex challenges, such as dyslexia, adhd autism, and anxiety among others, and these combine with what we like to call to make a green learner. So they are exhibiting the strengths and the challenges at the same time, and you can't teach to one or the other. You have to meet the learners at both ends of their of the spectrum, and so it makes them quite a complex learning profile which can cause anxiety. And so we'll be talking more about that tonight. If you visit our website at real 2 e.org. We have recordings of all our previous events. We have a lot of articles that were written by various experts. We have downloadable guides and many things all organized by topic for you, so that you can learn more about whatever interests you about twice exceptionality. and just to let you know about some of our upcoming events. We have a bi-monthly parent support group that the dates here are the next ones that we will be meeting in. We are going to have a panel of writing experts talking about writing solutions for 2 E-learners in January we will celebrate neurodiversity celebration week with an amazing student panel. and we are also going to have someone speaking about executive functioning at home and in school. About specifically for twice exceptional learners. You can Rsvp for all these events at real 2 e.org. We are also part of a group of organizations that is hosting the Neurodiversity Speaker Series, who is going to host an event about thinking differently, about social uses of media for neurodivergent youth. You can attend this talk and see all the recordings of the previous talks that have been hosted. There's some really amazing speakers on there at neurodiversityspeakerseries.org. In addition, real hosts, a Google group that now has 800 parents in it who ask and answer questions for each other, suggest resources, and vent and commiserate together, so you can feel free to join our group. I think Kelly will put the link in the chat for you. You can also follow us on Facebook, Instagram, Linkedin, and all of our previous recordings are on our Youtube Channel real in partnership with our educational advisors. Created a model that talks about how these 4 petals can help your 2 e-lear learn at school and thrive, and we bring this workshop to school. So if you'd like us to present at your school about this, or learning different simulations, or many other topics related to 2 E learners. Please let us know. We also wanted to let you know that we have a free 46 page guide to Iep specifically for twice exceptional students. It is for the California Bay area, although most of it is applicable anywhere, and it has a lot of great resources to overcome the challenges in getting ieps for twice exceptional learners. And we are very lucky tonight to have 3 amazing speakers. And so I would like to just give you a brief bio of each one, and then we'll get started. So Dr. Carrie Berquist has worked with neurodivergent children and their families for over 20 years. She is a pediatric, developmental behavioral psychologist with training from Uc. San Diego, Claremont, Graduate University and Stanford School of Medicine. She is a licensed psychologist in the State of California and a Board certified Behavioral Analyst. She's a private practice in Menlo Park, and is an adjunct clinical assistant professor at Stanford University School of medicine in the Department of Psychiatry and Behavioral Sciences. She's also a former consultant and advisor to technology based companies in the area and on the editorial board for the Journal of Autism and Developmental Disabilities. Her clinical work focuses on teaching parents of autistic children and those with neuro differences of all varying lived experiences how to facilitate meaningful change in the home, at school and community settings across the lifespan. Her approach to therapy is an individualized, strength-based approach that combines developmental theory and naturalistic teaching strategies based on the principles of behavioral science. Dr. Berquist believes in collaboration with children and parents to develop meaningful goals from a neurodiversity, affirming lens whenever possible. Dr. Berquist uses children's passions and interests to learn and grow. Dr. Bradley, Su. Is a licensed clinical psychologist and owner of gifted support services in San Mateo. He brings the compassionate and healing approach to his work with individuals, couples, and families of all ages, with his wide range of experience and inviting style. Dr. Su. Creates connections that resonate with clients from children to seniors. He has a deep understanding of the complexities that individuals face, particularly those related to neurodiversity, minorities and trauma. Dr. Sue's training in neuro and biofeedback nutrition, coaching and cultures emdr. He strongly understands the dynamic interplay between biology and experience which he incorporates into his therapy practice. This knowledge is a crucial aspect of his work, helping him to understand how our biology and our experiences influence our development. and Toni Ratzberg is a marriage and family therapist who focuses on supporting gifted and twice exceptional individuals. She is the founder of beacon wellness team, a consulting group based out of San Jose and Redwood City, that brings like-minded mental health professionals together in order to empower children, teens, and parents and families through tailored, affirming, inclusive and creative therapy beacon wellness team also focuses on providing a healthy and supportive environment where clinicians can learn, grow and heal, so they can live an authentic and fulfilling life and be better able to support their clients. Tony has helped create therapist training programs, school-based therapeutic programs and is passionate about advocating for the use of sensory-based interventions within therapy. In addition, she is one of 4 gifted siblings, and the proud mom of 2 Tui children, ages 12 and 9 years old. So thank you all so much for joining us tonight. and I believe that Dr. Brad is going to kick us off. So we. Awesome. PIN, spotlight, you. Oh, okay, I get this. Okay. Well, thank you all. Thank you for the introduction. I really appreciate being here. Okay. And as we jump in. We're talking about anxiety. There's so much to cover, and I just want to take a moment for everyone here who is just taking the time to spend with us, to learn, just to take a deep breath. to become a part of the moment. And this breath is also for me, too, as I'm about to jump in. And as we talk about taking a deep breath, I just want to highlight. One thing is that oftentimes, when we say, take a deep breath. Our breath in is only as good as our exhale. So I like to help people understand that exhaling is actually more important than the inhale. So take a deep exhale and a big inhale. Okay, so I'm excited to launch into this. And as I talk about anxiety with 2 EI want to bring together 2 critical areas of focus that can help us understand the landscape of anxiety in twice exceptional children and teens or twice exceptional individuals of all ages. These are young people who not only have exceptional cognitive abilities, but also face unique neurodevelopmental challenges, and this creates a distinct profile that makes them more vulnerable to heightened anxiety. Okay, so the 2 perspectives that I'm going to be jumping into is, first, st the underlying physiological mechanisms that shape their nervous system and the neurological responses. And then, on the other end, the broader social, cultural, and existential factors that contribute to their anxiety. So hopefully, this offers a holistic understanding of why this population might be struggling with how struggling with anxiety, and and maybe some avenues, and how we can support them, or at least just understand them better. So when we think about anxiety and twice exceptional kids, it's easy to focus on their cognitive strengths and challenges. But to truly grasp what's happening. We need to dig deeper into their physiological and neurological aspects. So the 1st thing I want to talk about in terms of their physiology and neurology that's wired differently is that they respond more intensely to stress and stimuli. So, for example, we know that we so 1st thing I want to leverage is Dr. Dabrowski's work on over excitabilities. So in many 2 E. Individuals that exhibit this over excitability, there's a heightened response across various domains, such as intellectual, emotional, and sensory overexcitabilities. So these heightened sensibilities, sensitivities can be a source of strength. but they can make them also really susceptible to anxiety, so intellectual sensitivity. So they have a relentless drive for knowledge, constantly thinking through complex problems, anticipating potential issues. But the flip side is that with this ability to think quickly and think deeply. It leads them into a cycle of rumination because their minds work. So spark so quickly. Okay, then emotional sensitivity. So they might be more emotionally reactive. And this is just all wired within. You know their nervous system. So with this over, maybe over expressiveness of emotionality, without the emotional self management skills that you know, really, executive functions are required to execute on a self management skills. Then what happens is that they become overwhelmed easily. So this intense feelings start to escalate into anxiety. and then sensory sensitivities or sensory overexcitabilities, being hyper, aware of all their sensory stimuli from what they hear what they feel. What they, what what's touching their skin can lead to, you know, quickly to overload, or their nervous system. So there's a couple of other things that are important to think about in terms of what's unique about this population when it comes to anxiety, is that there's a negativity bias. Now, we all know that that the brain naturally skews towards noticing potential dangers. This is the. This is more prominent in twice exceptional kids as they're amplified that this is amplified because of their ability to recognize patterns, their ability to have internal algorithms that memorize anxiety, notice the patterns and conditions that that created this unwanted event. And then, when that when when they put those things together, they're quickly able to recognize. Oh. you know, 3 years ago this was something that led me into an unwanted situation, or I was embarrassed, or I felt bad, and I, recognizing this pattern again. So, in order for me to prepare. you know. For this danger. my nervous system is going to start to react. And also with the analytical mind, it unfortunately also means that they're analyzing themselves, and analyzing usually means self judgment, self criticism, self evaluation, that oftentimes just continues to go and go. And again, it requires executive functioning to put the brakes on this type of analytical self, evaluative cycle. I am. Let's see, one of the other things that that's important to talk about is the vagal nerve and vagal nerve tone. So for many twice exceptional kids, they have lower vagal nerve tone. So that's the 10th cranial nerve that is responsible for relaxing and calming the body. Okay, so it makes it harder for their bodies to get out of fight or flight, and it leaves them stuck in this state of anxiety. The other thing about the vagal nerve tone is this gut brain connection is the information from the gut. So what's happening in the abdomen? The tension, the discomfort. It sends the messages up to the brain. Okay? And then telling them that they're in an uncomfortable situation. Further triggering anxiety. And the way the vagus nerve is is that the vagus nerve communicates in both directions. So it's 1 of the few nerves that actually goes up and down where there's there's a lot of like sensory information where it'll send information up this way from my body to my brain. So the vagus nerve is also responsible for sending information from my brain to my body. And that's basically in the form of it's okay for me to relax. It's okay to calm down right now. Okay, so if that's a little bit underactive or less developed. Okay, then it's harder to to, you know, to get those messages down to the body. Okay. The other area that I want to talk about that is particularly important when it comes to gifted twice exceptional individuals is that they have a heightened sensitivity and awareness. Okay, around the social, cultural, global influences, political influences, political happenings all around, you know, not only in America, but all around the world. So they understand that this world is is really. you know, well connected. They have information from, you know, all across the planet right now. So, with easy access to real time information. Today's twice exceptional kids are constantly exposed to global news that includes climate change, political situations that I mentioned, or systemic and social injustice. And as they're absorbing all this information and also internalizing it, and it's hard for them to process or to make sense or to make meaning out of this. So this awareness, so the gifted ability to understand complex ideas leads them to feel really helpless. And of course that turns into anxieties that I understand all these things that's happening. I'm absorbing all this information. Maybe at a rate that's, you know, vastly accept accelerated compared to their their peers. So therefore they're they're experiencing and just much greater amount. The other thing is twice exceptional. Individuals have this ability to contemplate. Okay, and that's to think. to think deeply and with contemplation comes also questioning. So they find it difficult to make meaning out of their lives. So they're searching for meaning. But of course, with all the stuff that's happening globally. So how do I make sense of this? And their minds for seeking information and seeking resolution, continues this pattern of of I want to continue to think about it. All right. So as we bring all these pieces together, okay. we have these physiological mechanisms that are inherent in the twice exceptional individual. We also have this intersection now of their ability to think deeply, and to contemplate, to absorb information, and to receive information all around the world that makes them really powerless and helpless. And it really pulls from meanings like, what what's going to be left of this planet? and these are deep things that they spend a lot of time thinking about. So with all those things. Their susceptibility to anxiety is just. You know, that much higher I am. So that's those are my thoughts on why, twice exceptional individuals, you know, you know, fall into this anxiety category much more readily. Alright. So I want to hand it back to you guys. Thank you so much. I all of the things you said really resonated with me and my own children. So thank you. And then next up we have. We are already starting to get some interesting questions in the chat, and next up is Tony talking about when to look what to look for in a therapist when you might need a therapist, so I will let Tony take it away. And, Tony, you are still muted. Just so, you know. There we go. Forgot to click that button is everything sharing. Okay, can you guys see it? Okay, great. I just 1st want to thank everyone for being here tonight. Real for inviting me and it's an honor to get to be part of this tonight. My goal tonight is to share a few different ideas that can really help on that journey. When you're trying to figure out what to do to help support your child and what to do in the moment when they're feeling anxious. So I'm going to 1st look at a little bit of what can you do for anxiety at home. And then what do you start looking for in a therapist things that might be more successful than others, and then share a little bit about the perspective that I take in my practice, which is what I call integrative therapy and kind of like Dr. Brad. I thought I could use a little bit of calming myself a little grounding. So I thought we would start with an activity. This one is a very classic grounding activity that we do a lot with clients and a lot of times it's called 5, 4, 3, 2, 1 but what you do right now is just kind of look around. Notice 5 things that you can see in your space that really you weren't paying attention to before we started talking. And before I brought this up. you know. Following same kind of idea is 4 things that you can feel or you can touch. and 3 things that you can hear. This one might be tricky, depending on where? Where you're doing the meeting. But 2 things you can smell and then finish up with one thing you can taste, and you don't have a taste in your mouth. You can always take a sip of water, and just kind of notice what that feels like as you swallow it. So Hi. go ahead and see. There we go. Okay, I thought we should start with just things to do at home. I will tell you. My slides have a lot of text in them, because I just couldn't figure out what to take out. But they're they're definitely very wordy. So I can share. So people can look at it later. It's I don't want to talk all the talking points, but I'd love for you guys to be able to to look at it more closely in the future. So one of the things I really think is important to hit on 1st is you've got to take care of yourself. If you're not taking care of yourself, you can't take care of your child, and yes, you can, soldier on for a long time, but you're also not modeling healthy management and self-care. So if you take care of yourself, you're better able to take care of them. and you can also use yourself as a tool to let your children overhear you working through your emotions or your challenges, that lets them start to play with ideas, internalize it, just start to think about it, and they learn from what you're doing. They also realize that, hey? Some of these emotions I'm experiencing actually pretty normal. They're not so scary. So that's kind of you. You start, you start with it, you take care of you, and then you can start thinking about what can we do to help with their anxiety, and an easy thing you can do is take one of their interests and try to connect it to it. My favorite example of this is, if they love Harry Potter, Ron, and Hermione are fantastic anxiety characters, and there's seen in the movie scenes in the books, and a lot of times. They'll talk about it if they like the characters. You can also relate a lot of the pokemon pokemon to different anxiety and feelings as well. So something I want to share, which actually, I think I did share in a previous talk we did with real. But it's something I love to do to help kids and teens practice in social anxiety, coping and learn advocacy skills. And it's taking them out to hot cocoa. And so you start where they go in and you model how to place an order. They get this fun delicious time in connection with you. And then they start to learn. Okay, what do I do? How do I? You know, how do I do that? They start to practice it. You have them start to order it, interact with the Baristas, you know. Say hello to people, and then get them to where they can make their own order and build on it where they actually you know, make purposeful mistakes, or they can make changes while they're ordering it. Just, you know things where they have to go. Okay, it's not always exactly the same way, but I can handle it a lot of times. You can get their buy in for something like that, because it's fun. They're going out, and they're doing something with you. The other thing I like to stress is to use play and humor when you can. You can help them make it fun to, you know, or more fun to confront emotions or to talk about them. But you have to be really careful. You don't want it to fall into the part where they feel like you're teasing them. But a lot of kids really respond to, you know something lighter and like, you know oh, here, you know, here's anxiety again. Decided to show up today. so keeping it light helps. See? I'm trying. I don't want to spend too long, because I know we have a lot of great stuff, but when you're supporting your 2 E. Child with anxiety, focus on their strengths first, st and then that helps them feel safer to take risks and to practice things, but it also honors who they are. And you can kind of take any information you find out there from these kind of presentations or from books and say, You know, what is it that my child needs? Okay? And I just want to take a moment to focus a little bit on. 2 things, I think, are very important for our children, and that's connection and co-regulation with connection. It's something they all want. They all want to have a connection with their parents, and that might look different sometimes it might be a 2 second Hello, and other times. It's like a couple hours of here we are. We're playing together, and we're doing activities. If you help with connection, they're going to feel safer. They're going to feel like they belong. They're going to learn a lot more, and they're going to learn to adapt to things. If they have that secure attachment with you. It's easier to get them to try uncomfortable things with you. And also, when things are really hard and you don't know what to do. Go back to connection. Say, what can I do there? And that can help your child? Co-regulation is also an incredible tool that parents have. But it's a really hard tool, because it's often at the end of the night when we're stressed and we're tired that our children need us to be the most regulated to help them. But if we do our own work we take care of ourselves. it can be fantastic. Co-regulation is really letting them borrow your regulated feelings so that they can learn to cope and manage with their emotions. I've got a QR. Code here in the slide, but I also think I sent a link over. I think you can get that into the chat. It's just a short article that I created with Gina Garcia, another marriage and family therapist, and it's more details of how can you do co-regulation? Okay, now, I'm going to jump into therapy, and I think it's important to acknowledge that everybody here is probably at a different space. You know, if you're a parent, you are might be in a season of parenting where you're like, okay, noticing this is happening. Thinking about it. I think it's hard for my kid. I want to think you know, what can I do? And then others might be on this other side where they're going. I just did an assessment, and I have a million recommendations that I have to sift through, and I just don't know where to start which one to prioritize. And there's probably a few people, too, who are kind of like, Hey, been through all this stuff, and I'm just sure not what else. You know. What else do we do? How else can I help my child? Because it still still needs some adjustment? So when you're starting to think about what to do. And you're considering therapy. You want to consider a few different things, how they're experiencing anxiety. What is that physical experience of it? Has it changed? Is it impacting their quality of life, keeping them from being able to do things they like? It's easy for us as adults to guess what they might be feeling. But we want to engage and really ask them how they're feeling with it. And I think I put it there first.st Yeah is, if they ask you for therapy, please please follow up with that. A child doesn't ask for therapy unless they think that it could help them, and on the other side of it. If you say my child would benefit from someone other than me a safe place, a person that they can talk to. That's another good reason to move towards finding a therapist. And the most important thing, if you're ever concerned about your child's safety. So whether it's self harm, suicidal thoughts. Anything like that. You've got that. That's a big indicator that's a huge green light to say, go talk to someone, try to get some more support around them. You think I'm gonna there we go. I just want to touch on the fact that there's a lot of different approaches to therapy. And everyone. even within, like, maybe the same approach puts their own spin on it because we're all unique individuals. And it's also important to remember that not everyone has training or experience, with twice exceptionality or neurodiversity, and they might look at things in a very different way. So when you get recommendations or you're looking, what should I do for anxiety? How to help my child? Something I know, I hear in my practice a lot is that the 1st thing parents find is. Cbt, that's what everyone tells them. Go, do. Cbt, go do. Cbt, and what I actually find with Cbt is, it can be great for some people, but it's not always the best approach for someone who is neurodiverse, and that's because it might encourage them to mask. It might bring up a huge, strong resistance from them, so they either want to write off therapy. They don't want to talk about it, or they're just kind of like. No, don't go there, and I don't want to spend my time trying to get someone to want to do the method. I want them to do the work that they want to do. So be careful when you're going with things you want to think about, who's making recommendations, research things research. If you if you find an approach, and you know, throw it into Google and say, how does this work with someone who is twice exceptional or ask another professional? And they can tell you like what they have seen, what they've noticed and what they think about it. There's no simple answer for what the best treatment approach is. But I think neurodiversity, affirming care is essential. If you have a twice exceptional child, this is what you need to be looking for, because it really looks to empower your child. Let them know their strengths, and then that can help them navigate their challenges and affirming care really looks as neurodivergent. It's like a natural variation of our human brains. It's not a disorder, it's not a deficiency. And you're going to see interventions that will emphasize acceptance, strength, compassion, and support, because that's the root of what this is. It's tailored to their needs. It's tailored to who they are, and it considers how they access information and how they experience their world. So if you're looking for care, also try to consider finding what neurodivergent voices recommend and what they've thought. So this might be your child if they've had some experiences, or you can find great articles and blog posts and conversations from neurodiverse people who say, Hey, when I was a child, this is what I went through, and this is what it felt for me. And so just, you know, slow the process down when you're trying to figure it out and take a little bit of time to research it and think about who your child is and what they would feel best with. Okay, I need to take a breath. I'm sorry, you guys, I'm talking fast. So when we're trying to find a therapist, it can be really hard and really frustrating, especially right now. There is a mental health crisis. We don't have a lot of availability of professionals. And I keep hearing from people that they don't even get phone calls back sometimes when they're trying to find someone and just ask to say, like, Do you have availability? So it's hard. And then that might make you want to just jump and say, Okay, the 1st person who does have space. Let's get my kid in there. Let's just get it going. Let's make progress with it, but I think it's really important to find the right fit for your child. If it's the wrong fit, it can have heavy consequences. And you know that might be that they won't go back to therapy, or they won't engage with it. So trying to find the right one is so important, and they best way you can do that is, you ask yourself and your child if you can feel connected, this person, and you can trust them. If the answer is, no, they're not the right person for you. And that's okay. There's a lot of people in this world, and there's a lot of therapists in this world, and so finding someone who does connect and that you can trust is very important. It's also important that if you don't trust the therapist, but you feel like your child does or might work. You've got to really stay mindful of that, because you don't want your child to pick it up from you, and then start to question therapy or question their trust of the therapist is incogruent. If you can be with your child the better. It is the other thing you want to think about is a therapist who will listen and collaborate with you, not someone who's going to tell you everything that you should do so when they're listening and they're responding. You also want to make sure they're communicating in a way that works for you and for your child. It's really important as parents that we have access to the therapist. Even if we're we're not in the room every time that they're together, we need to know that we can pick up that phone. We can send an email. We can call them. And you know, there's a long list here of other things, too. But I do want to mention that if you get through all of this you find a therapist and say, Okay, I think this checks the boxes. They're affirming they're listening. They seem to get this. This feels really good. Then I would honestly start to consider, okay, what are their experiences and what are their accomplishments. I wouldn't even go there until you check off the other things, because I think that is so important to find someone that you can trust and can build that relationship. The other thing to think about when you're finding a therapist is you want your child to be able to go in and not be masked. and yes, there's times they might protect themselves. They may not be fully open. That might be a session that might be a season, but if they want out of therapy. They're going to figure out how to do it, and if they can figure out what the therapist wants to hear, they can make that happen. The therapist is going to say, Oh, all is great. You don't need to be here. And then your child actually probably in a worse space. Because now they're like, Okay, well, I went to this professional. They didn't get it. Now who can help me? What do I do? So that's another reason, looking at someone who you can connect with you can trust, and that gets it. A few red flags to work to look at. I'm kind of laughing, because there's a lot of these on here that I took off. But there's so many things to to think about. But one of the big things is, if someone dismisses your child's experience or your experience. The classic example would be like, all children are gifted. So I don't take into account giftedness or you know I don't deal with this. I don't think about this. You just want to make sure that you agree with what they're saying. You also want to check yourself. It says someone who says, I've seen it all. I know how to do it, or they're really rigid in their approach. They may not provide the flexibility that your 2 child needs to be successful in therapy. You, if they're not willing to get, take feedback, or they start to get defensive. If you ask questions, or you kind of push back share some ideas. That's another red flag to say, Okay, this might not be the right person for me. Once you've found a therapist, then you've got a couple of steps that you do, and this will be, you know, unique to your situation, but also the professional that you're talking with. We all have our own process, but in general it's going to start with an intake or a consultation conversation. You're going to share some information. There might be some assessments and questionnaires. the professional gathers information and you share information and you ask information about them. You go. This feel, does this feel right? Is this aligning correctly? And if it is, and you say, Okay, this is a good fit. Let's go forward. Then you're actually gonna also start to do more paperwork and get to do a little bit more historical because a lot of times we like to know a little bit, but we like to get to know the child for who they are and what they bring into the room. We don't want the entire download history of who they are the 1st time we meet them. so you also need to take some time to decide. What is this going to look like? Is it going to be individual therapy which would be a therapist? And your child is family therapy as a group of peers. And then what's the frequency look like? Is it once a week, once a month, or do they actually need a higher level of care of that? And the therapist should guide you through this process. They should give you a recommendation. They should talk about it, and ideally you do what's in the best interest. Sometimes scheduling is an issue trying to make everything work. And so you have to get around it. But if you feel like this person is hearing the need, and being present with you, they'll let you know if they need to adjust anything with their frequency. See if there's anything else I wanted to share with this part that's pretty good. Oh, I did want to mention with parents involved in therapy. It's really up to you. You can talk about it. Some therapists will naturally include you. Bring you in, for some check-ins have regular parent meetings, others won't, and others will kind of let let it roll out and play out, depending on what's going on and what your child likes. So if you have a preference, if you say I really want to be involved. Talk with the therapist before you start, define what that is, or if at some point you have like kind of a question like, Hey, I want to change this up. That's okay to ask, too. Sometimes we just don't know if therapy is working. And as a parent we go. Is this the right approach. What are we doing? You know? And we feel like, Okay, well, we've invested a lot. We want to stay the course. But is that the right thing to do. So when you start to feel like that, I always recommend talk to your child. See how they're feeling about it. If they're feeling similarly, or if they're completely different, that's going to inform what you do. It's also a great time to have a meeting with the therapist, and just say, What do you think? Here's what I'm hearing? Here's what I'm seeing, and if you've chosen that right therapist, they're going to be open to having that conversation with you. They're going to want that conversation because we don't want to waste your children's time. We want them to get the skills that they need, and to feel confident and be able to go out and do their life. Something to please keep in mind is that with twice exceptional individuals, therapy can sometimes look different. The pacing might be different. It might be slower. There might be some times where things are going, really, really, intensely. And then they pull back. And that. That's okay. That's a normal part of the process. But if you do start to feel like you need to make a change. And you've gone through things. You talk to everybody. That's okay, start looking for a therapist or start exploring it. And also consider, is there something you could do? Could your own therapy. Help your child. If if you were to engage in that. then just a few more thoughts to share with you guys is integrative therapy. So this is an approach that I use in my practice. And really what it does is, it interweaves different elements of therapeutic approaches, so that I can create a tailored experience for my client. So it's not just, hey, what are their interests? But it's what makes sense to them. What do they relate to? What do they like. It's very strength based. It's client-centered. And so there's a strong emphasis on the therapeutic relationship. And the connection, I see it very aligned with neuroaffirming practices because it's really honoring who the person is. It's leaning into that instead of the mode of operation. We, when we're working like this, we're going to observe what are their reactions. We're going to kind of test things out, or we're going to present them with ideas. And we're going to ask them what they need, what they like, so that they get the most time or the best use out of their time with us. Oh. okay. And let's see, so integrative therapy. It's affirming it's inclusive. It's culturally sensitive. but it also really leaves room for both the client and the clinician. And often parents that you know, just acknowledges we're all learning, and we're all growing. And it requires some vulnerability and everyone to be able to do that because you have connection and trust things happen, and sometimes we have to talk through that. And it's a great, it's a wonderful learning experience for everyone, but especially the child. That's part of it, because it's part of being human is to normalize our strengths and our challenges. So one of the reasons I think this approach works really well with twice exceptional people is because it really helps reduce their masking in the sessions. It lets them be them. It lets them have some control, or some say they're guiding it. They're co creating what their treatment looks like with us, and we're providing information for them. It also honors who they are. A few ways I've used this approach would be use like a walk and talk where I've got them outside of the office. And we're able to not only process or talk about skills. But we're out in the community. And so there's a lot of different elements that are going on. And so we can use mindfulness to help them increase their self awareness. We can help them do some self soothing or grounding when they're in a public setting, and we're doing it in the moment while it's happening. it can also sometimes look like a client is getting their own coping skill development happening by looking at their motivation and their values. So then we can bring in some sensory based activities that help them self soothe. They start creating some habits around that. And then, as therapy continues, we give unconditional positive regards that they feel really safe to be encouraged to explore anxiety. And so we're pulling all these pieces in different ways. And we're pacing along with where they are. One fun way I've combined this is with a very active people who come into my office. I will have them take like a ball that can stick to the wall. I don't even know what you would call that, but they would throw it, and it will stick to the wall and they love it. It's fun. And so there's this play element. But then I'll combine like, Okay, I want you to think about something. And so we'll think about an emotion, or we'll think about an experience that maybe they haven't been able to or haven't wanted to process with words yet. So say, okay, think about what happened at school last week, what your mom was talking about. Now I want you to throw the ball as if your emotions were coming out of that. And so now they're using it. So it really can pull in the play therapy as well for children. Okay. that's all I've got for you guys here. But I know you got Dr. Brad and Dr. B. Who are going to follow up some amazing approaches that also work great for twice exceptional people, and I just thank you for taking the time to be here and look forward to hearing the rest of the afternoon. Thank you so much, Tony. That was amazing. very helpful. Lots of questions come up in the chat. and Dr. Brad is back up next, and then Dr. Berquist. Okay. so I'm going to talk about Dbt, and that's dialectical behavioral therapy. And Dbt is so big. And there's just so much into it. I just couldn't possibly cover everything it is. So I'm just gonna go over some highlights and and hopefully land on some takeaways for you guys. 1st of all to introduce Dbt, it stands for dialectical behavioral therapy. It's a type of cognitive behavioral therapy, and it's originally designed to help individuals who were experiencing intense emotions that were difficult to manage. And it's particularly helpful for those who are 2 E, it's a structured approach with a lot of skills and tools. It's actually a skills based approach. And it's almost to a fault where, if it's a pure Dbt it, the therapy is really talking about only about skills and how skills should have been implemented? Or how can we expertly implement a skill in a given situation or future situations or past situations? Okay, but let's jump back in to to Dbt. So, as I mentioned, Dbt comes out of Cbt, that's cognitive behavioral therapy. and one of the basics of cognitive behavioral therapy is that cognitions and behavior. So that would be challenging the way we think with cognitive distortions or thought distortions. So that's Cbt dbt. focuses and integrates dialectical thinking that is balancing the opposite. So dialectics are opposites and the big opposite for Dbt is balancing acceptance and change. So, holding 2 truths. Any 2 truths simultaneously opposed to seeing one thing as as interfering with the other thing, just simply understanding that both things are are true. Okay, so as I mentioned, is balancing acceptance and change, which I'll I'll I'll talk a little bit about that. But let's talk a little bit about some. you know, dialectics that we hold just in everyday life, and the dialectic might be so say I've eaten dinner of. I've had a number of slices of pizza the pizza tastes great. I want. I'm really full. And I want another slice of pizza. Okay, those 2 truths. Okay. in a more in a more therapeutic context. That might mean the dialectic might mean that I am really wanting to succeed. But I'm really and I'm really. you know, paralyzed by fear. So I said. But but with Dbt we replace the but with, and because we're holding both, not seeing both as opposites, so we can understand that there's for many of us, you know, in in our lives. We really want to do well. But there's so many things that are getting in the way that we're things that we're afraid of, things that we think might be you know, in opposition to wanting to do well in traditional therapy. We would think that. Well, if you are afraid of doing well, we really need to spend a lot of time just working through the fear, and once we work through the fear, the pathway would just all of a sudden appear. And that's not true. Right? With dialectical behavioral therapy, it's like you want to do. Well, we can talk about that. And you're really afraid about it. We can talk about that because those things are you know can exist perfectly together. And that's how actually, reality is. So let's talk about some so that's dialectics. Okay? So as I mentioned, Dbt is about skills and the core skills are mindfulness. Okay? So that's awareness becoming more aware. And another way of of talking about mindfulness and awareness is just noticing. Okay, it's just increasing our ability to notice things distress, tolerance. And that's a real big one. It's big in Dbt and and why it's so helpful now is because in the current in the current you know, the current thoughts is that we've become as parents. We've become really concerned that distress equals trauma. So if I have a lot, if my allow my child to experience distress, I might be allowing them to be traumatized. So then we have a multiple generations of parents saying, Well, maybe I should really just remove distress. So at least I can solve for potential of trauma. So so we have. You know. you know so many children and teenagers now. kind of not really experiencing as much as much everyday distress or or age appropriate or developmentally appropriate distress. And when I talk about distress in this way, I really do also mean Hermetic Stressors right? And Hermesis. The idea that this stress stressor or strain is actually going to make me stronger. So distress tolerance is really appropriate for this population. And emotional regulation is another big core area is what skills can we use to emotional, emotionally self-manage. And I replaced the word regulation with self-manage, because self-management is really our management of emotions is such a more active approach than regulation. Like we, we regulate like we create rules. That's where we have regulations around the the city, county and state and the country. We create regulations. We don't create regulations with ourselves, we create management. The only thing we can do with emotions is manage our emotions. Regulations like really sounds so constricting. And then it leads into all these other things around the you know, around the the misuse of the word regulation. But a big core principle is emotional self-management, and the other core principle is is interpersonal effectiveness. Okay, so I'm going to jump in a little bit into Let's see, I just want to talk about 2 things. because I want to make sure we save time for all the other speakers and the and the questions and the 2 things I want to talk about. That might be great takeaways that come out of Dbt is is the the skill called riding the wave and riding the wave is where, just just as it sounds when you're in the ocean. Okay, maybe on a on a boat, and the wave goes up or on a surfboard, and the wave goes up. and then what happens is, the wave goes up as the wave passes. Then you just go back down. Okay. So riding, the wave is about allowing emotions to come through. Okay, observing these emotions and then allowing it to pass. So 1 1 key principle that I teach. you know I teach regularly. That's related to this, for parents is is simply, as as parents are. you know, practicing distress, tolerance, practicing, riding the wave. One thing that we want to do is to allow time for the wave to come up and the wave go down is just one simple concept, and that is under react. Okay. What? What happens often is that when it comes to. you know, parents and parenting, you know. Of of course, our children are under a lot of distress. They might be struggling. We, we think they're dysregulated. But in reality, what's happening internally is they're seeking regulation. So what we want to do is under react so that they could get to regulation themselves. Okay. As parents, we only think we only see the dysregulation. But we're missing. That piece is that the dysregulation is and attempt at getting to regulation. So if we jump in so quickly to support or to maybe even empathize, then we're gonna throw off that you know that that ability to learn self management. Okay, so riding the wave. okay. underreacting is important. and those things both fall into the category of increasing distress. Tolerance. Alright. Okay. let's see. Okay, was there another one? Let's see. Okay. okay, all right. I think I'm gonna hand it over to Carrie. Oh, wait. I'm going to talk about. Oh, medications real quick. Right? Okay. So I just want to acknowledge I was just going to be a brief portion about medications. You know it's understandable that so many of us have questions about medications and and medications really pose this hope right? This hope that that we think that we're gonna be able to just reduce the, you know. You know. Just reduce the symptoms, create a better lifestyle. So it's natural, for you know, almost everyone to consider the possibility. Okay. But but, as was mentioned in the very beginning, just to clarify our roles as therapists, we don't prescribe or manage medication. So it's really outside of our scope to talk very specifically about medications. But you know I can talk a little bit about you know when to seek medications. And it really is when when we think about, you know, as a holistic and integrative provider, we think about, you know, medic. Considering medications. If all the foundational strategies don't seem to be really producing, you know the results along the journey. Okay? And and that means optimizing for sleep, optimizing nutrition, optimizing therapy. And if it doesn't reduce the severity of symptoms now, when we're talking about severity of symptoms, we're not just saying, oh, that we hope that my child's going to feel better. Maybe we hope that my child's just going to be happier. We're really looking at this this one piece is that are the symptoms getting in the way so much that it's causing an impact to everyday functioning? Is it getting in the way so that a child's not able to do what they what they are capable of doing for for their age. So if it's going to school that the symptoms are getting in the way of of going to schools, the symptoms getting in the way of of interacting with with friends and family. Now this is very. This is a little bit different from my kids able to do all these things. They're just not enjoying it, and that that because they're not enjoying it, I'm really nervous or concerned, that it's going to turn into this, this and that other thing. So therefore, we're thinking about medication. It's really, if it's getting in the way to the degree that it's impairing those things, not just comparing the enjoyment. Okay. of course, there's so many things to to consider, and I don't want to just take that my statement there, and saying, That's you know, the bar which we should we should have. It's really also to do with the length of time. Now, if someone is, you know, having those symptoms that I'm describing, but it's over many years. Then I wouldn't just say, Oh, well, you know, Dr. Brad said. There, it's fine that they don't enjoy it. We we really want to think about a big picture here, too, and a long term trajectory. The other thing that I just want to validate in your consideration is that everyone has personal beliefs about medications. Everyone has personal fears about medications. You could have religious or cultural values or belief. You should work with a psychiatrist or a pediatrician that's going to honor all those things. One of the things that. you know that's disappointing to see is that is that where where families get arm twisted, say, well, you know, depression's like a broken leg, and you have to kind of believe that that, you know. I don't think that arm twisty thing is kind of really a good way to kind of join around the the possibility that medication is going to be really helpful. But but really a person that's going to be able to honor. Say, I get it. I understand you should be concern. You should be hesitant any you know any in a, you know, empathic or validating psychiatrist to be. I understand, too, I would be in that same place, and all the questions and concerns that you have, you know, are valid. So it's a lot to navigate. Those are just some of the thoughts of you know of, what I have and how I've you know, helped families kind of navigate through the decision making process about. When is it time to to add this to? You know the the you know the toolkit? Alright. So let me. Thank you so much, Doctor. Welcome! Was super helpful. And next up we have. Dr. Burke was speaking about space, and there's been a lot of questions in the real group about space recently. So it's starting to get more popular. Thank you. Let me just figure out how to alright my gosh, my desk! Oh, I don't want that. Bye! Bye! Alright, I'm gonna talk about space. I'm really excited to talk about space because it is a new treatment that I've been doing over the last 2 years. And I really, I'm a parent trainer, parent, educator by trade, and this, I think, is, you know, especially going after and we talk about surfing the urge and riding the wave. You know, that is basically what space is. Is helping parents learn how to ride the wave and help their child learn how to regulate themselves. and I think it's been really helpful for kids who have definitely not responded to more of the like Dvt or Cbt. Or some of these more traditional like individual therapies. no, of course, it's not gonna wanna work. Okay, there we go. All right. So what is space treatment? So space stands for supportive parenting, for anxious childhood emotions. And it's an evidence-based treatment developed by Dr. Ellie Leibowitz of the Yale Child Study Center. It's as effective as cognitive behavioral therapy or Cbt, which, as you've been hearing tonight, it's actually one of the gold standards for child anxiety treatment. I would say, Dbt, and acceptance and commitment therapy are also very much in play, and those are the more individual based therapies. But this is different because it's a parent-based therapy. So, and space has been shown to be effective. For anxiety. Ocd arfid restrictive. That's the restrictive eating and failure to launch. And parents are the ones that actually go to the session. So chat children do not participate. and it focuses on actually changing the way parents respond to their child's anxiety. So the child does not have to be a willing participant, and I know this is a big issue. That and I think I saw this in the chat is, you know, and I think tony spoke to this as well is that you know, if the child is not willing to participate in therapy like therapy probably won't be very effective because they're not bought in and they might not want to. Maybe they they don't think there's anything wrong, or maybe they are fine with just how things are. And so when you're not a willing participant, those individual therapies are not really going to work. Very okay, so willingness is the key to change. But this therapy, you know, the child does not have to be willing participant. Just the parent has to be willing to participate. And there are no demands actually placed on the child to do something except with failure to launch. That's the one exception. All right? So what's the theory behind space? So space is based on the theory that child anxiety is actually an interpersonal event between the child and the parent. So humans are mammals right, and mammals are hardwired to protect their young and children are hardwired to signal to the caregiver to their parents that they need help right, and that the parents need to step in when they're distressed. particularly when the child is a baby or an infant, or a young child who can't really take care of themselves. Right? Something bad's happening. Baby's gonna be crying like, Help me help me right? And just similarly, parents are hardwired to respond to detect fear and distress cues in their children. And they also provide this regulation and soothing, which is what we were just talking about. Kind of this cool regulation helping the child manage their anxiety. So there are 2 main ways that kids cope with uncomfortable emotions. I actually like Dr. Brad's self-management because I do self-management. I believe in self-management, but all the literature is self-regulation and emotion regulation. So like, I am right behind you about like being on the charge of probably changing that but self regulation requires that willingness that I was just talking about, and if your child is not willing to take the deep breath and to like, do the things that they need to do or find something that helps them manage those really tricky, intense emotions, especially the 2 kids have. Remember, they tend to feel their emotions bigger than other people because they're more sensitive. It requires practice. They have to practice these skills, and they have to practice them when they're not dysregulated, because if they don't practice them when they're not dysregulated, they definitely can't use them when they're dysregulated right, and it requires a child to actually learn a new skill. And again, if you don't have willingness. not certain that self regulation is going to be developed. So what other systems do they have co-regulation parents helping them regulate their emotions or the environment? And, as I just said, it is absolutely essential. In the early years, when children are very young for their parents to help co-regulate them. However. if the child becomes over reliant. just like Dr. Brad said, it prevents the child from learning self-regulation. If they can't feel that distress and then figure out, what should I do? They're never going to learn how to self regulate. It absolutely helps in the short term child gets on the bus. I saw that comment, too. The child gets on the bus. The child goes right. But it the cycle actually continues. and it doesn't help in the long term. So what is the relationship between anxiety and self regulation? So just like Dr. Brad said, at the beginning of this whole talk is that we tend to see anxiety is higher in this neurodivergent population. Okay? So in the general pediatric population, we see 5 to 10% have an anxiety disorder in the neurodivergent community. We have autism, Adhd learning disabilities. We see it's much much higher right autism population. It's 40%. Adhd, it's 25 to 50 and learning disability. It's 29 ish. right? So we definitely see this higher level anxiety. And what we also know about anxiety is that when you have high anxiety and pediatric anxiety disorders, you have low self regulation. Dr. Leibowitz actually wrote this amazing chapter on this. And it's not in his newest book, but it's in this other book, and it is amazing. It's like you. Could. You could substitute it, for you know, inflexibility you could. You could substitute for anything but this understanding of how anxiety impacts one's self-regulation. And we see it in these 2 E children and neurodivergent children, we see high anxiety. And we see low self regulation, right? Because we need those executive functioning skills. Okay, so here comes the accommodation, family accommodation. So family accommodation. You're going to think about it as kind of co-regulation now, in the early years, as I said, it's very appropriate. You know, an accommodation could be like a parent orders for the child, because they can't develop mentally or due to stranger anxiety, which is normal and protective. However, as the child matures the child will begin to order for themselves, they'll be able to self regulate. Maybe the child will feel nervous, but use the strategies to order their own food in a restaurant. It's funny, because actually, Tony mentioned this as well. And then we have the anxious child now. The anxious child will have the same exact accommodation of this child on top. But maturation alone does not lead to self-regulation. The actually the so the family accommodation will persist because they won't, they just won't do it. So the parents will keep ordering for the child what to eat, despite the child's ability, because the child feels too anxious, too distressed, because it's expected. It's a rule that they've always followed. and early in the child it was absolutely adaptive. Parents need to do this, they have to do it. But now it's actually preventing the child from being independent. Okay. alright. So what are the aims of space? So the aim of space is to help children get better at handling any anxiety or distress. It's the feeling that I can handle this feeling. I can get through this situation and not have my parents rescue me and take it away. So the goal is we. The aim is that to to help them handle the feeling. and the number one is because we can't get rid of fear. Nor do we want to. We have this natural, you know. We need to know when danger is happening, so we can't get rid of anxiety. That is an unrealistic expectation to get rid of anxiety number 2. We can't control our thoughts and feelings that's not possible. So anxious thoughts and desires to have things, a certain way will always happen. So we have to just know how to handle. Okay. So the 2 main goals of space are to increase support and to decrease accommodation. I want you to think about these little weights as anxiety. The feelings of anxiety. So support is to show the child. Hey, man, I get it. Anxiety is rough, but I think that you can handle it. and I know it's tough. But look at me. I'm also showing you. I can handle it, too. But I'm not going to help you. You can handle, even though it's hard. decreasing accommodations is by, is the combination of Oh, this parent goes. Oh, I don't think my child can handle this anxiety, so I need to come in and help them. So let me help you, dear. So the goal is to decrease those kinds of accommodations that are not helpful. All right, increasing support. So support in space is very formulated. It has 2 components. The 1st is acceptance and validation of the uncomfortable feeling and confidence that the child can handle the feeling, not do the thing, not get through something. the feeling handle the feeling, and that's what support is in space. So here's an example of a supportive statement. I know it's hard when you have to order for yourself, but I believe that you can get through it. And that's what we call a supportive statement. Okay, family accommodation. So family accommodations are anything a parent says or does or doesn't say or doesn't do to prevent or stop uncomfortable feelings in their child associated with anxiety. So these are 2 examples. So one, we have what we call participatory, and one is modification, so participation and modification accommodation. So the 1st one is the is the modification. So the little kid says, No, you know, eat cereal, only eat cereal right? So then the parents like, oh, no, I'm not having these good feelings. They're gonna yell at me every time I eat my cereal, so maybe I'm going to eat my cereal before the Kid wakes up. Maybe I'm going to eat eggs. Maybe I'm going to eat something else. So the parent might start accommodating and not eating cereal in front of the child, and that would be the accommodation. Okay? And for this parent they might say, I don't care how many degrees you have. Nothing prepares you for a teen who finds their phone didn't charge overnight. Okay? So a parent might begin to, because the child gets very dysregulated. They can't get out the door. It's oh, my goodness, it's a 5 alarm. Parent might charge the child for the phone, but might charge the phone for the child. and I have done both of these in space. These have definitely been 2 accommodations I've addressed. Thanks. Here is so I use young Sheldon a lot in in in my in my treatment. Because there's so many family accommodation. Good examples in that show. Hey? Here's what happened. Was Sheldon choked on a sausage or something in the morning. And he started not eating food, not eating solid food. And so his mom decided, okay, well, we're gonna figure something out. So I'm gonna accommodate. So this is a video of her accommodating his anxiety about eating solid food. Can you hear it? You're actually cutting the crust off before you blend it. I left it on his tuna sandwich yesterday. He said he could tell. Only drank half of it. Mayor, you think this has gone on long enough. No trouble, but it'd be better if I had 2 blenders. Be better if you stopped coddling them. Well, I don't know what else to do. I suggested that we take him to some kind of professional, but you said he'd outgrow it. Well, if you're looking for a psychiatrist, I bet my new fella's related to one. What do you think? Not? Sure. If we take him to a shrink, it feels like we're admitting something's wrong with him. He hasn't had solid food in 5 weeks. Thank you. Okay. needs a few more Cheetos. Okay? So the example there of the accommodation is that she's obviously blending as food. She says that she even needs 2 blenders to make her job easier. She's cutting the crust off his food she's putting in there. She's checking it. Those are all what we would call an accommodation for the child who's experiencing anxiety. And that is how it happens. Some event could happen, and then it gets to that point. And the and a parent just doesn't know what to do. Right? So what I believe is happening is that there's this parallel process happening for parents. So on the one side, we have the child who's feeling uncomfortable. and then they say, Help me, or they're upset, or they're getting dysregulated, and they get the parents to help them take away the feeling they avoid the feeling or thought, and it maintains the anxiety. But what's happening for the parent is that the parents having an uncomfortable thought or feeling about the child having an uncomfortable thought or feeling, they want to avoid the dysregulation for themselves and for their child. They help try to take away that feeling, so they avoid the dysregulation, and that maintains the accommodation. And so we have this, what we call an accommodation track. where the child begins to have distress or worry thought about how things should be expected, and then it becomes a family accommodation. So, for example, the most common accommodation that I have that I see is answering repeated questions. Okay, so, for example, this kid, this parent, this kid, is very anxious about being late. Am I going to be late? The parent says, No, we won't be late. You'll be okay. Am I going to be late, and then the cycle continues until they get to school, and the parent goes made it. It stopped asking me these questions. Then the the parent, the child becomes reliance on the parent for regulation, the child will begin to think. The only way I can be okay is if Dad answers my questions and tells me I will be okay. The symptoms continue. And then the child continues to have the worry thought and the worry thought actually can get worse. I really hope I won't be late if I have to ask 30 times. Okay. One of the questions that was given was, that are all accommodations unhelpful? No. when it is meant to avoid more or cope less, it is unhelpful if it reinforces your child's belief that they can't cope with anxiety, or avoid situations that are likely to trigger it. It is also unhelpful, or there's no path towards independence. So here's an example of the wanting to know what time it is. excuse me. your child wants you to reassure them several times a day. You won't be late. A helpful accommodation would be. say, you respond one time each day about the time, and you provide your child access to a watch. Sorry, I'm telling you I'm overcoming a cult. It was all this talking alright, an unhelpful accommodation, for this is you respond every time your child asks a question, and you reassure them they won't be lit right? So who should consider space. No parents who are providing any family accommodations to help their child cope with anxiety. Children who are unwilling to participate in individual therapy. This isn't a requirement for space. You could be in therapy in individual therapy, and also be having doing space at the same time. Haven't seen individual therapy make much progress. sometimes reducing family accommodations shown to impact the success of the traditional treatment. So like non-responders of individual treatment, it could be because their accommodations were too high. And so we have to get those accommodations down, and then they'll respond better to traditional treatment. The other thing that's really cool about space and family accommodations is that you see, gains in non targeted areas. So, for example, it could be like an a gain in an area that's like not related to a family accommodation, but it's related to their anxiety. So, for example, maybe, like they stop engaging and checking, or something that's not even related to the parent. But we see improvement in their functioning as you reduce family accommodations. Other considerations. So working with a provider that is neurodivergent, informed, and experienced, I think this is extremely important. It goes back to what Tony was saying. Space really needs to be adapted and modified and made to be more neuroaffirming. I have made some accommodations to the way I do space in order to make it more affirming, because we definitely do not want to be trying to mitigate certain restrictive behaviors that are actually meant to kind of cope with anxiety. And they actually are self regulation strategies. So we don't necessarily want to do that. And a trained person might not who isn't understanding of neurodivergent individuals might not understand that. It can be used for insistent on sameness and tolerance of uncertainty. So I have developed a protocol for using space for inflexibility and or insistent on sameness. And I actually have started a research study at Stanford, and we just got for the approval. So we are recruiting for individuals. But the child has to be autistic, and between the ages of 6 and 10. But if you're interested. So it doesn't. It doesn't address anxieties per se. But it is focusing on this, you know. Insistent on sameness. And you could email the study at this email address. All right things to do and not to do so. These are kind of like my takeaways. So one educate yourself. Learn more about space and see if it's something that your family wants to pursue, to try out supportive statements, using statements that have both validation and confidence in the face of distress, are helpful, even if you still accommodate. According to Dr. Lee Bowitz, he actually said that if he could do one thing, it would be to like, meet with all the pediatricians, and just talk about supportive statements. If you only had like 5 min he would teach him about supportive statements. if you listen to this talk. and then you just realize that you're doing accommodations. Do not stop. Start removing these accommodations. Okay, it is just one of the biggest errors is removing accommodations without having proper supports and pieces in place. So remember, you're gonna have to ride this wave of dysregulation. If you don't have what you need to ride that dysregulation, you know you don't know what the plan is that it might be very hard to follow through, and it can make it could maybe make it worse. So we don't want to remove accommodations. And you definitely shouldn't do multiple at a time. all right modeling, so model, using supportive statements on yourself to your child state when you feel anxious, and how you manage that feeling which Tony also talked about earlier modeling. I just can never stress enough how important it is to speak out loud, how you're thinking and feeling, especially individuals who have difficulty with perspective taking they need to hear what you're thinking, all right, getting training. So finding a provider to help you learn space techniques. you can do it in about 12 weeks. Alright, this is the website for space treatment.net where you can find providers. This is his Ted Talk, which I think is really good. That gives you a little bit more explanation. And this book is the most child, friendly or parent friendly book. So the one on the corner that's in blue is the one that was really meant for parents. alright, that's it. Thank you. Thank you so much. That was amazing. And we got a ton of questions. So I'll probably start with some of those. Kelly, are you able to put our 3 speakers in the spotlight. Kelly or Abby? So some of the questions that we got about space? What ages is space appropriate for? And is it? What about if a child has sensory sensitivities? Is it accommodation which is helpful or not helpful? So space. I mean the youngest I've used it with is 3 and then it can go up to because of failure to launch it definitely goes into the young adult. young adults. I've primarily my practice only goes to 18. So I but I've used it from 3 to 18. If they're younger, it's it's really not something that you can necessarily use. But you can always adapt it using pictures and visuals and use it with kids who are even not not as verbal and have had some really good success. As well. What's the other question about space? Sensory sensitivities? Is it an accommodation to accommodate sensory sensitivities. No, you absolutely should accommodate sensory sensitivities. So that's not. That wouldn't be so, for example. So we one way, I would deal with it in space would be that I would want them to be independent with their sensory accommodations, meaning like, if they need to bring headphones somewhere, it's making them more responsible for bringing their headphones, being, you know, instead of relying on the parent to always be responsible and thinking about those things. But absolutely we need to address the sensory sensitivities. And one last question about that is, does space still work? If only one parent is doing it? Or does a whole family have to be involved. Space does work if just one parent doesn't. No, so I mean, obviously, it's better if everyone's involved. But if just one parent is doing it. Oh, what I will actually to go back to the sensory sensitivity in the book there is an actually like very non nerve affirming sensory, you know example in there, and I just don't agree with how they address it. So that's 1 of the important things where somebody who's traditionally trained in space would consider doing the sensory. Like, yeah, we're just gonna let the blender go as loud as it can be. And all this other stuff. So so. So that is something you have to be aware of that in the book. It actually has an example that is not great. Didn't say so. Look out for that. So we had a bunch of questions asked in advance of the talk. And then someone I'm going to blend them together. Someone asked the space work for kids with the Pda profile. How do you reduce demands and pressure while also not accommodating? And I would love for Tony, Dr. Brad to weigh in on Pda as well, because that's a common topic we hear about on real. So I'll let Dr. Burke with start about space, and Pda. Yes. Yes, Pda, I have had some cases where it has been extremely effective. And of course we take them away slowly and methodically, and and everything. But it absolutely has been a game changer like, because these kids have really, you know, intense, insistent on sameness and and anxiety. You know, we want to make sure that we help them so that they become really proud. What's really cool about space is that I've also seen how proud kids are of themselves. and how much more confident they are things they just didn't believe that they could do just so much stronger functioning a lot better. And you know, space has also been used for school refusal. You know, failure to launch, they also say, is, you know, a symptom of lots of kids who've had school refusal have failure to launch. and a lot of the research on failure launch is really severe anxiety, you know. And so, where these other traditional treatments just haven't been very helpful because you don't place demands on the child. You are just setting your boundaries as a parent. It's like, I will not do this anymore. I will not do this anymore. I will no longer respond in this way, or I'm no longer going to do XY, and Z. And so that's really what they do. they? They don't always like that. They're the parents are doing those things, but eventually they are able to do it themselves. And and I've just seen like a massive change in their self confidence, which is the coolest part about space, is their. Does anyone else want to touch on Pda. Yeah, let me. can you guys hear me? I don't know if my. oh, okay. yeah. So in in a separate note, when I think about. You know, Pda. I do think about the idea. you know. If it is. you know, demand avoidance. Is there a way to move the the demand which I'm going to replace the word to ask, can we move the ask a day in advance? Can we make it transparent? Can we make them predictable. And what I'm wanting to help reduce is the nervous system reactivity. And then that behavioral training that when I you know, I might say, and you know, people with whose parents could really resonate with this was that I was actually asking my kid if they wanted ice cream, and they were like, No, why are you asking me? Is like. is like, Okay, and why would a child be yelling and screaming? If a parent's asking them if they actually want something that they want is because of this behavioral reaction that's been ingrained through the interaction. So if I can take these demands and move them outside of a conflictual time plan on them to say, Hey. you know, can we talk about these things? And I'm not asking you now, but asking you for for the next day. and I'm not suggesting that that's going to be magic, or it's going to remove any you know, any conflict, or all of a sudden, Pda is going to go away. But what we're doing is doing those 2 things, making the ask transparent, and the secondly, is removing that train interaction, that when something comes out of my mouth as a parent, that my my child already is starting to already is gearing up to scream back, or to say no, or to throw something. Those are just my thoughts about that, you know, interventions or or approaches, and even maybe some ways to think slightly differently about that that behavioral piece around it. I would echo what you've both said, and I think my approach has always been to really try to investigate what's going on. You know what is happening in the body, what's happening with the emotions, but also with the parents. So this is a time where I definitely like the parents to be involved in the work. Even if we're traditionally doing individual therapy working with Pda, I think it's so important to look at all of the different dynamics of what's happening, and a lot of the support does go to the parents so that they can feel better, and they can there then help them through the moment. All great advice, and I'm taking notes for myself, and so I wanna acknowledge that it is 8, 30, and it is the official wrap up time. We have so many questions that if you guys are okay but no pressure at all. If you have to go, I want to honor your time. If people can stay 10 more minutes. I'll keep asking questions. But if anyone has to go, I completely understand. Yeah, okay, I appreciate that. So we have some questions. It was asked a little bit tongue in cheek, but it's actually a really good question. How do you ride the wave when there's barely any time to be prepared for the school bus. Yeah, so one of the thing I I did reply, but I'd like to expand on it. And and in my reply I said that. you know, time constriction is a real and time pressure is just a real phenomenon for anyone living or most everyone living in the Bay area. And it really is going to get in the way of of what we have, you know, access to and and certain things that are more involved when when we're late or needing to be somewhere. There's no time to do pros and cons lists, or to, you know, even even be mindful if you know the child's gonna be late, and then you're gonna be late. And then, you know, the 3rd child's gonna be late. We just we just totally understand and empathize that. You know that, you know, riding the wave at that moment. Isn't you know the ideal, you know, approach. So we would pick riding the wave where we can just allow for time and space for a child to experience. You know, experience that emotion. and an experience of emotion is just what emotions are designed to do is designed to just allow us to feel. We oftentimes think that emotions are designed for us to solve. Or it's information. It is that. But it really is. Emotions are just designed for us to feel so if the child's feeling something just allowing them to feel okay. But what do you do? So I don't want to leave you with just this idea that okay, there's nothing we can do, what it's fairly similar to what I just kind of mentioned is that you know, if if there's something that's going on at the moment of leaving, what can we do? The night before the day before, or even the weekend before. Is there a collaborative, you know, to to leverage some other ideologies? A collaborative problem solving approach is that, you know when. So this is a Saturday morning conversation. or or Sunday morning conversation not, you know. Monday or Tuesday morning is like, you know, when this happens, what ideas should we have? What should we put into place? So that, you know, when you're feeling this way? We could. you know, have these tools, or, if appropriate, and and not many of these conversations don't necessarily work. It takes a few tries, because a 7 year old's not necessarily going to be able to to be able to express themselves, or even know to say, you know what kind of things are getting in the way of you, you know, getting, you know. Leaving for school. Is there something that we could do? The you know, the day before the night before? Is it that you want more time with this? Do you want more? And I don't want to suggest that you're asking and doing all this, you know. Sherlock Holmes kind of investigating all these different pieces, but it is really about just opening up a dialogue. You know. Well, in advance. and the final thing that's hard to say is sometimes it is. It is a distress, tolerance, not not on the parents, but distress, tolerance. It is a stressor for the child that they have to, they that that is a developmental, developmentally appropriate stressor, that they need to learn the skills and tools to navigate. And it might be just being patient through. And of course, when I say, being patient also means being late. Enough times just to allow for them to develop that ability to to just sit with the distress without the pressure of you know, being on time, without the demands, without you know the sense of of the fact that when I get upset I'm disappointing all the people around me. So so yeah, I know that's a long answer. It's really I I try to be as specific as possible. Thank you. No, that's a great answer. someone asked. Can kids get over anxiety? Or is it just about accepting that? It's part of who they are. But that was a great question. Who would like to jump on that one. Tony? You have the smile. I was. Gonna say, I mean exact like when I said in my talk, right anxiety is, it's never gonna go away like it's part of who we are, as people right, and I think you know from what we were talking about, it's like, but how do you manage when anxiety comes. And are you gonna manage those feelings in it? You know? you know, especially if you have these things that you want to be doing. But you have this anxiety and this, you know. And so, you know, we talk a lot. I mean, I know Dvts like that act like that like we talk a lot about. What do we care about? How can we allow anxiety to be there and still do the things we want to do and have the life we want to live. And and even when anxiety shows up right? It's anxiety is never going to go away. If you could improve or lessen the like symptoms, or the you know. If it's been like your your world has gotten smaller, is kind of like how we talk about it is like as your functioning got less as your life gotten smaller. And how do we expand your life so that it's a meaningful life that you want to be living. And you're not just. you know, shrinking your world because of anxiety. And so that's really that definitive line of like when anxiety is paralyzing versus and and really impacting the quality of your life. And when is it like there? Because, like. it's just there, and it always will be. And it's part of us just like happiness and sadness, and all those other wonderful emotions that we have. And and that's really like more. How I would talk about it with your child. As that, like the the goal is never to get rid of it. It's it's just how do I manage it and live the life I want. I love that we have a couple questions about diet. That I'll weave together. How much can diet be the cause of anxiety and dysregulation and then there's a question about arfid it. I think Dr. B. You said space can be good for arfid, but then, later, that we shouldn't use space on sensory issues. So I just wanted to clarify that. So our fed like, there's 3 different categories of what our fed like. There's different kinds of permutations of what our food shows up as it could be, like phobia of new food. It could be sensitivity of like certain and things like that. But then there could also be these other components of like trauma that you had with the food like kind of like young Sheldon and so there are different components. And so there's like the sensory issues. And then there's other things. So they're they're not all the same and so, but a lot of kids who who have arfid they just. They're not meeting their nutrition and things like that. So we have to think of, you know, especially if it's like neophobia like fear of new foods. Or I have rules around foods. Or I just don't eat new things. And we definitely want to use something like space or other strategies to help the the child be able to expand their their diet, especially if they're not meeting their their weights. They're not, you know, growing. You know those kinds of things so that feels more of like, it's not just sensory, that's like the bottom answer, or like the. But it can be like in some ways. And so like, you need a professional in order to like, actually diagnose or figure out what's going on, and what would be an appropriate treatment for your child. I'm going to close on a super timely question. I'm glad Dr. Brad mentioned sensitivity to current events, political and geopolitical. How can we help 2 kids who are deeply troubled by the recent election cope with their anxiety about how it may cause suffering to people animals and the planet. Tough, tough question. Anyone want to weigh in. I can jump in with how I've been working with people over the last week or so, and a lot of it is validating their feelings like letting them know that it's okay that those feelings are there and asking them what they need. And I let them be the guide. This has worked for for many different ages. But you know, what do you need right now? And if it's okay, I need a sense of safety. Okay? And I'll ask, Hey, should what should we do? Should we look at it and try to find reasons that you can feel safe? Should we find people you can talk to at home and and co-create that with them. But not take away that this is really hard, or that they're having those feelings, and that they're scared, just leaning into what they want then, and that it's okay that the feelings are there. All right. Thank you all so much. We have a bunch of other questions. But I want to honor everyone's time, and it's getting quite late. And so to everyone who's here, we will send out slides and the recording and contact information for our 3 speakers. Thank you all so much for being here tonight. I learned a lot from this talk, and I'm sure everyone else did, too. And there's a lot of kudos in the chat. So thank you all so much. You've helped a lot of people tonight, so have a good night. Thank you. Thank you.

Dyslexia affects as many as 1 in 5 people. Most people view it exclusively as a challenge with reading and writing - what they don’t realize is that dyslexic brains have many gifts and strengths! Join us to hear about Dyslexic Design Thinking, as Gil Gershoni shares how dyslexia offers a heightened advantage, what he calls his “hyper-ability.” Learn how parents and educators can find the hyper-ability in children’s differences and foster these unique strengths to boost self-esteem, school/career pathways, and finding their place in the world. Gil Gershoni is the co-founder and creative director of Gershoni Creative, a branding agency with offices in San Francisco and Dallas, and founder of Dyslexic Design Thinking, an initiative that explores how the dyslexic mindset can help improve the way we think, create and relate to one another. For more than 25 years, Gil has developed design- and innovation-focused solutions that help brands connect with themselves, their audiences and the world around them. Clients include Google, Apple, Spotify, Deloitte, Nike, BBC and Patrón. Read the transcript here as I said I just want to thank everyone who rsvp'd and has come to our event tonight or we'll be watching it on the recording we're grateful that you've taken time to be part of our real Community my name is Cali Turk and I am one of the co-founders of real I'm joined here tonight by Yael valak who is my fellow co-founder and Abby Kerrigan who is our real partner and we just couldn't be happier that you're here we're going to go through just a few slides on real and then we're going to jump into our main speaker I want to next yeah 703. I'm gonna have more people coming in we'll make sure everybody gets in so in case you're here and you've never been to any of our past events or you're not familiar with real we just wanted to share our mission and vision uh we are a non-profit based in Silicon Valley and we really are focused on helping twice exceptional students thrive in school and we're doing that by really working with parents and Educators to raise their awareness about these very unique Learners and understand some practical research-based strategies to help them with their needs we're really working to build Bridges between Educators and parents through resources and workshops and programs and tools and speakers just like this tonight probably most of you are familiar with what we mean by twice exceptional but just in case this is a term that is new to you twice exceptional students are students who have very distinguishing strengths they have high abilities or potential in one or more areas it could be an academic area an intellectual area creativity or leadership and they also have complex challenges so they might have a specific learning disability like dyslexia which we'll be talking about tonight or ADHD or general anxiety or Autism and it's really that combination of that high ability and that challenge area that makes them what we call a green learner where they are always that combination and we want to help them thrive in all kinds of situations we have a lot of resources on our website and invite you all to go there if you have any additional questions this is an example from our website and you can see that our 2E topic tool is a place where you can navigate our resources based on a topic that you might be interested in we have a lot of events coming up you're here tonight for our February 1st event and this is our kickoff of our 2023 event series on February 13th we're going to have a lunchtime chat about living and loving2e just in time for Valentine's Day how do you manage relationships in your neurodivergent family on March 12th we're going to kick off neurodiversity celebration week by featuring the awesome duo from autism level up talking about how we can support our neurodivergent children in what would they like to call useful reality uh then on April 24th we will host another lunchtime chat on being Mindful and tools to understand and manage your own anxiety so that you can self-regulate and show up for your kids and then on May 9th we're going to be talking with Dr Tasha Oswald of open doors therapy about how we can think about how do we really celebrate our 2E child when there are a lot of things that are really hard about parenting so we're going to be talking about that dual reality and uh then we always host our bi-monthly support groups with parents helping parents so our next one of those is March 2nd and then again May 4th we have a lot of other resources and support we have a private Google group if you'd like to join a private Community to ask questions and get answers you can also follow us on Facebook Twitter and you can see all of our event recordings on YouTube and that's where we will be posting this event recording in the coming days I am we offer workshops I'm not going to go into this a great deal but you can learn more about this on our website if you think that things that we offer would be helpful for parents or Educators at your school whether it's introducing them to 2E understanding strength-based strategies talking about creativity and all kinds of things we just cover all kinds of topics and we'd love to come and speak with your community okay and last but not least we are still celebrating the fact that we became a non-profit in the middle of last year this was a long journey for us and it was super exciting and we really want to share that with our community and let you know that if it this is a program that you find useful if you appreciate that we are offering these kinds of programs for free and you would like them to continue to be offered for free so that everyone can we want everyone to be able to join them even those who wouldn't be able to afford if we were charging a fee we would really appreciate your support so that we can kind of keep the zoom lights on and keep keep our work going we'll put the link to our donation in the chat um there's no obligations to donate but if you feel so called to do please please consider consider that donation so without further Ado I'd like to introduce tonight's speaker Gil gershoni hi Gil hi everybody great to be here gilgershoney is the founder and creative director of grishoni creative in San Francisco and Dallas for more than 25 years Gil has worked with clients like Google Apple Spotify Deloitte Patron San Francisco art institute BBC and Nike foreign advocate for neurodiversity and regularly speaks on neurodiversity's influence on design thinking his mission is to educate people about dyslexia moving from more traditional views of Dyslexia as a debilitating mental imitation to what Gill calls a hyper ability Gill has presented a South by Southwest Whitney biennial and Sundance Film Festival engaged students from UC Berkeley engineering program California College of the Arts and Vancouver Institute of media arts on the topics of Dyslexia and neurodiversity executive produced dyslexic dictionary an exhibit which we went to which was amazing in San Francisco featuring dyslexic artists virtually reinterpreting words phrases or ideas through the lens of their dyslexia he has been profiled in the 2020 book the bigger picture with amazing dyslexics and the jobs they do he's written numerous medium posts on the benefits of Dyslexia and neurodiversity and he hosts salons with dyslexic thought leaders across Industries he is currently hosting the dyslexic design Thinking podcast which explores the intersection of Dyslexia and creativity with guests from a wide range of Industries he is producing the deer dyslexia postcard project which we will post in the chat which invites students from around the world to continue the work of dyslexic dictionary by visually redefining dyslexia using their personal experience as a guide he is also producing dyslexia Beautiful Minds part of the Inside Out public art project displaying portraits of 100 dyslexic in the heart of San Francisco we're so excited to have him here tonight bill would you like to take over the slides or should I keep going sure you can keep going uh let's go to the next one so hi everybody I'm so delighted to be here um I I was looking forward to all day to be and meeting you all and kind of getting into a good discussion about how do we change the narrative and the perceptions of Dyslexia I wanted to start by kind of letting showing you a little bit of my the foundation so then we can jump off of it into sort of conversation and then question and answer for everybody you know most people that are not dyslexic and even dyslexic think the dyslexic dyslexia is a single mindset or a single perspective or a single learning disability and I think it's important to realize that when you think dyslexia you're actually talking about many different modalities and when you look at all the amazing dyslexic around the world that change our perceptions you start to ask yourself why is this a disability and why are we looking at what we can do versus what we can do um so let's get to the next one um one of the things that most people think about dyslexia is that oh isn't that the kind of thing that you can read and you flip letters and most of you that are not dyslexic when you look at the word cat on the left of the screen the first thing that you can visualize in your head is the image of the cat on the right right it's very easy you barely even read it it just sort of jumps into your mind and there's a cat let's go to the next one you know what that's more or less what happens and I know a lot of people loves infographics so we rendered one for you guys just to kind of like see how that sort of cognitive observation from the subject and the object and interpret interpretation of it goes if you go to the next slides you know when I look at uh cat go to the next one I see every letter from every perspective through and above you know I see the C I see the inside of the T I see the a I see it upside down I see it's in 3D all at the same time and no one no wonder no matter which way I spin it I never see a cat you know um and and most people say wow that's exactly what the learning disability is let's go to the next one but you take the same disability and apply it into just about any other problem solving for example you take the same cat and you put it in the bag and in my mind I can in a blink of an eye I can spin the bag inside it out I can spin the cat and whatever which way I do it you know I can tell you it's a cat if you jump to the next one you know so so it's the same exact uh negotiation of linear subjects or linear objects that really allows you to think of the learning disability and move it into the high probability let's go to the next slide so what is dyslexia really so I figured that you know if you look when you look at the dictionary definition of Dyslexia they're really telling you what you can't do you know there's not a lot of other definitions of other things in the world that actually talks about what it's not versus what it is forward to the next one so dyslexia's ability to see the world from multiple perspectives all at the same time and solve problems in unique ways okay let's go to the next slide so that brought me to sort of start to think about if dyslexia is a gift of seeing through things above things below things all at the same time you know and as I am a designer and a thinker and a creative and an entrepreneur I really realized that dyslexia it's been one of my strength as I do my work around the world so I came up with the idea of Dyslexia design thinking let's forward it to the next one please so we'll talk a lot about what is dyslexia design thinking today Less in the theoretical part but how do we apply it to Everyday uh um exercises practice some of the challenges we're having as adults as children and everybody in between but I wanted to put a little bit some of the the building blocks for you guys here so it's Divergent thinking non-linear ideation you know to generate unexpected ideas you know and let's go to the next one it's root in my belief that dyslexia is a high probability that it's truly a gift that 99 of everything I do is dyslexic frankly everything I do is through the lens of Dyslexia but most of us tend to think about it as the learning disability that it is and not the other 99.9 of everything else we do that is still through the lens and Through The Gift of Dyslexia it helped me to think and create and relate to one another you know and as I learn how to regulate my dyslexia and I learn how to work with other non-dyslexic to actually solve problems bring ideas and and and collaborate I realize that actually there is a beautiful dance that can happen between dyslexic and the gift of it and non-dyslexic as we work together to change the world so I would love to invite you all today and in the future to check out all the problems we have um you know some exhibitions podcasts you know uh dyslexia design thinking salons uh and and really share some of what you guys are doing and you know and follow us on Instagram and Linkedin and uh follow our medium article and let me know what you think and how that experiences uh um you know work for you and um let's jump into the conversation right great so so excited to have you here Gail so let's talk a little bit more about you know how how you developed all of this and you talked a little bit about it in that first introduction but when did you first start to notice that you saw the world differently like that you saw cat that different way than everybody else or people around you you know um when you don't know you're different you don't know you see differently you know it's it's um you know that's the beautiful about being a child right until you told me that I couldn't do something I was a vibrant happy creative outside the box kid you know and I followed my my own you know my own interests and my own uh uh uh uh passions and as soon as I started going to school I realized that there is so much that I can do like others and no matter how much I tried to overcome it and change it and to be linear you know I couldn't you know uh it's not the kind of thing that you can try harder to do in order to overcome it you know um I always looked at the world you know from every perspective you know I remember when I was a little kid everybody in my family knew that if they lost a key a ball a bat they would just ask me because my photographic memory my dyslexic mind will be able to sort of spot it in the house say oh Mom your keys are underneath the couch and she was oh be like how do you you know you're six years old how did you know because I brushed against it visually and seeing everything at once I was able to sort of exactly know where it is you know um as I got older and I realized that it's very difficult for me to read and write I found that there's other ways that I expressed myself that was very different than my um classmates and my um colleagues at Carla in college and and Beyond when I you know got to be more in my professional world so uh for me um it was really important and I think that was credited to my parents it was like to really sort of follow what gave me joy to fill my cup with things that um I really was I was really good at I really thrived at you know and I think that um even though I could read and write easily they knew how hard I tried and they they didn't they never for one minute says oh he's lazy he's stupid even though some of the teachers and some of the community kind of label me that way um but they always believed that you know I was immensely gifted I remember when I was like second grade or something like that my mom said you know you are the smartest you know you were so you know you're so creative and I says mom every mom says it to her child every mom says that you know and she's like well that's fair and I remember her and she tells the story these days she kind of teared up and sort of her heart sort of was died for it he's like you know what let's take you and get you tested and get your IQ tested and she explained to me what IQ testing was and she said I'm going to send you in by yourself a third party is going to sort of evaluate you and they're going to sort of let you know where you sort of fall on the Spectrum you know and I went and did that and afterwards the the the person called her back in and says you know he is below average in reading and writing but in every other cognitive sort of measurement is absolutely exceeds uh his age group and Beyond and I think that was a really pivotal moment at such a young age to know that my mom saw the potential and she gave me the the confidence earlier on to still work hard and overcome and and and struggle with some of these linear thinking but also feed um feed my dyslexia you know help me you know uh um play and draw and and make things uh that really gave me a lot of strength you know it sounds like your mom was one of your you know major supporters throughout your life do you have other adults that you can credit for helping you along the way um yes you know obviously my mom my family my dad uh um grandparents and things like that learn over time that you know it's not about trying harder it's just that I see the world differently um and they themselves learn over time that actually part of the challenge that a young person with dyslexia has is the way they they are observed by their near and Dear Community um and as I got older and went through sort of you know a high school I found other teachers that really understood what dyslexia was and really supported uh the gift of of my dyslexia and and and and celebrated it and and gave me other ways to communicate and um and and to express myself as I got older and I went to University um I learned that actually my dyslexia was my superpower you know because I was able to communicate and and and create ideas and solve problems in ways that some of my colleagues couldn't do exactly the same way um and I learned that instead of trying to fix my dyslexia and not be dyslexic and try to fit like into a linear world I learned that I need to slow down my dyslexia in certain circumstances in order to be able to learn in more traditional ways but also I I fed my dyslexia so I was so curious always to sort of learn uh in different ways I used to sit in University in classes that I didn't even like I was belong to just because I wanted to hear lectures I wanted to so I just sort of got really immersed in sort of uh looking at the world from different perspectives and two questions found professors and others that sort of really um just just you know supported that you know um so so it sounds like it was in college when you really started to have a mind shift about dyslexia when you started to think of it as a gift like is that right or was it even earlier you know it's a it's like you know I think that every day I go through it I don't think that it's uh it's it's you know it's um the gift of it continued to evolve as I could devolve as a person so I think that it was a child you know I didn't know that there was some struggles and then I sort of faced them and then I was spend a lot of time through my parents to sort of feed my dyslexia and my talents so there was different places to sort of fill my cop um but as I got older you know different aspects of it unfolded and the more I got comfortable with what I can and can do and Expo spoke it to the uh to my community my professors my my teachers um and I felt okay with it then they actually supported it um so I think that it's an ever-evolving process and it's a lifelong Pursuit but um I I did find that earlier on I kind of embraced it and um started to talk about it and um and and then as I got older you know and really sort of uh start to to think about it and and and find the different structures of what it is um you know I got more more people involved in it as well yeah yeah actually it sounds a lot like how Jamie Oliver talks about his just thinking about playing your cup and finding what you love and working on that um so it's interesting you showed that slide with all of the different people who who are dyslexic and they all have different talents and strengths but if you could name a few I don't know overarching themes you might see for dyslexics what are some of those things that dyslexics are uniquely good at yeah um you know a lot of us look at the world through the lens of again like I said there's different types of dyslexic and just just put it out there I'm not an expert in dyslexia I'm just dyslexic you know and I can only speak Through My Lens of Dyslexia and and my experiences so maybe your child your other you know if you're dyslexic and adult you see The World Slightly differently you know I've talked to a lot of dyslexic over the years from all different backgrounds all different countries and occupations and there is some commonalities one of them is we tend to think very fast you know and um and and we think very fast because we jump over things you know we look at things that are non-linear and we find connections you know and um so that's something I found often now when I didn't know I was doing it it's not only disorienting for me but also for my colleagues and my environment when I start to realize what I'm doing I was able to then start to uh name it paste it and regulate it and and sort of use it more as a tool um visualization and many aspects of visualization is something that's very often very common with dyslexics I can see it in my mind's eye fully rendered you know so for me if I think of an idea or if I think of a problem I can actually visualize it which means I don't have to visualize I can see it in my mind's eyes so I think that's a very common trait for dyslexics um you know when it comes to language because reading was so challenging I found myself really honing in the meaning of language and over time really hone my communications you know so finding more specifically what I was trying to say and how I was trying to say it was almost I don't know if it's for all dyslexic but because I was over compensating that became a very strong aspect of uh part of my lens of dyslexia um a lot of empathy because you know you know for me I was always interested in how other people feel how do I relate to them so I learned over time to really be sensitive to others feelings and emotions and behavior and be very sensitive to it you know um so I tend to bring a lot of that and some of that is what they say but often it's what they don't say So reading body language reading their um you know intentions became something as it became adult a great Tool uh through the lens of dyslexia and um you know it's I mean there's so many different other Gift of Dyslexia but I think these are few and I'm sure we'll get more into some of them as we keep talking today yeah yeah so let's talk a bit more about dyslexic dyslexic design thinking you mentioned it's Divergent thinking non-linear ideation and unexpected ideas so tell us more about that and tell us who can be a dyslexic design thinker so um so I come from the world of design and design thinking which is a phase approach to problem solving and uh but the problem with that for dyslexic and other neurodiverse Minds is that dyslexic thrives in a non-linear so for me when I look at the idea of dyslexic design thing it's really based around the idea of Divergent thinking and non-linear ideation to help generate unexpected ideas that is something that anybody can do and it's really more embracing um different types of modality incorporating all mindsets you know and bringing both the neurodivergent and the neurotypical minds to the conversation it's really it's got to do with how do we look at problems how do we suspend trying to solve them as long as we can so we understand the environment and we understand what is going on for The Human Experience and how do we find the various moments of those experience in order to create a better solution and outcome together you know um often when I work with my team at the agency each one of us comes from very different mindset you know some of us are traditional researchers writers strategists uh project managers um designers and we tend to suspend as long as we can to solve the problem and it's very hard to do when you first start do it because you here's the problem and you want to solve it so everybody throws Solutions but often I say is if you knew what the solution was or if you knew what the problem was then you would also most likely knew the solution so we start with the idea that we don't actually know what the problem is and we try to sort of look around and below and from every perspective to try to find is where is the Discord where is the where is the moment in the relationship of what we're trying to do that is not flowing and then we look at it from every perspective and as we get closer and closer to figure out where it is it becomes more apparent how do we actually address and solve those uh creative problems so to your question you know anybody can apply that methodology you know it's it's uh it's it's something that we've done internally I do it every day both in my personal life and my commercial life and it's an approach that really allows to find uh the truth and the Heart of the story no matter where we go you know I love that it's kind of um it's like you're dyslexic design thinking is for everyone and what we're trying to do is help all these poor people who don't have the Gift of Dyslexia figure out how to do what those of us would dyslexia do naturally right beautifully said exactly that's wonderful um let's see I think I'm going to move into some of the questions that people have submitted to us before the the talk so the first things that a bunch of people asked about were about classroom strategies so the first question was uh what are some ways that children can learn to embrace dyslexia both at home but also in the classroom um everybody's different so I'll give some of my experiences and some what I've seen uh out there and and then we can you know as we go when we open it to the audience we can get more specific about it how do you embrace your dyslexia well I am dyslexia thrown through everything I do is dyslexic there's no part of me that's not dyslexic and part of me that is dyslexic I wake up dyslexic I eat dyslexic I see the world dyslexic I dense dyslexic I do everything Through My Lens of Dyslexia so the first thing to say is is that there's no separation between me as a person and me as a person thinking non-linearly and I think that's a really important distinction because if we say that everything you do is dyslexic then what do I do in the classroom at home that gives me contentment that makes me feel whole you know some people loves to dance some people like to make things with their hands some people uh you know loves to draw or do a mathematical equation or so the first question is what do you like to do you know and that's for an adult and a child you know what do you like to do when nobody's watching that just makes you feel your whole self you know that's always a beautiful place to start because you know often you find them when you pull on that string then you just you know then the whole gift of this Deli starts to become apparent you know and then how do you um do more of that how do you regulate it so if you go to a classroom and you have to sort of comment down what do you do that makes you come oh I take deep breaths I feel myself through all of my senses I look in my classroom and maybe something in the room reminds me to just become present I practice those physical behaviors so it's not um you know it's it's become sick in nature you know you work on these tools from very early on that as you become as you grow and you develop him you just become more of a fully embodied uh um you know conscious person about how you experience the world now you have to be dyslexic to do that well no I mean that's that's what we're talking about Consciousness that's when we're talking about being uh present that's when we're talking about buying being compassioned and uh so so that's kind of part of the fundamental things that I do every day with my son sadly he's not dyslexic but you know the other day he was given a performance and you're feeling a lot of anxiety about it and I just said take a deep breath man slow down relax you know bring your shoulders back and I remember he was on stage and I can see him just becoming present with the space in the audience you know move from your head to your body and from your heart and when you practice that over time you kind of become addicted to it because you know whenever you take a deep breath into your whole body you just become here and now and everything becomes much easier you know um this this stigmatizing dyslexia is something that I think is also very important as a tool in the classroom you know often when I was a child everything that was done for me was emphasizing what I couldn't do that is terrible versus for a child to always experience what they can do and then try to find ways to be cool with it with with their peers you know so for me is working with teacher working with the students working with the parents to find ways to learn in diverse ways you know um if you loves to draw or if you love to do math if you like you can find so many ways to learn subjects through different modalities that makes you feel your strength first and then you over over you know you start working on your differences you know um if you like to make art make every letter out of clay or thing it or paint it or tell a story about it right because it's all about how you know teaching each other how to learn um so I don't know if I fully answer your question about tools in the classroom but I think these are kind of tools that I apply myself and I know that uh I can be very helpful um but we can talk more about scenarios around specific uh um issues that people may have okay no I think that's great and I one of the questions someone asked so for children who um think through problems differently so for instance maybe they're during a test they need to talk through each problem out loud that helps them get you know think through the problems what's the best way for parents to explain these things to teachers so that the teachers are willing to make accommodations if they can't meet you individually what would you tell them to tell um their teachers well you know it's really again depends on the class size and the teacher itself but I think that it's important that if that that I mean first and foremost I think is that a teacher is here to teach the children how to learn subject and content comes and goes so there's definitely things we have to learn and take take from every lesson in class but if you teach a child how to love to learn then they would learn anything so knowing that we all learn differently some of us dyslexic or not love to stand love to see it loves to dance or read or whatever which way we do it is to give the child the space to do so knowing that the end result is not to accommodate their their disability but to enhance their superpowers in order to become a better student you know so if I was to talk to a teacher and say I know my son or daughter loves to or needs some more time or wants to make it out of a different mediums or material is to sort of have a dialogue about it's you know this this is a way to bring the students to be uh to engage with the curriculum and the subject matter um you know my mom back in Undead is before you know the funds as we know them today and before audible she used to record most of the subject it into a cassette tape and I used to listen to it you know these days uh were obviously there's so much more awareness and you have all these tools out there so I think just kind of educating the children to be a little bit more open to different learning uh Styles and um you know it goes a long way that way yeah so yeah so busy in the classroom with the other kids but also with the teacher that's that's great well said um somebody asked do you have any favorite apps websites or technology that you'd recommend to for elementary or middle school students with dyslexia I love taking in content uh through audio so I listen to and I've as I've learned it I've listened to um podcasts books uh anything I can I I every email everything that comes in I make it uh basically read it to me and I really learn to consume it that way and remember it so I think any kind of uh audio tool to sort of turn things from text to audio is a great tool to get the content I also love uh watching videos and and and you know uh um documentaries and things like that um I found that I really consume information really well that way and I just don't forget it you know when I read it I don't remember most of it I remember some of it and it's very patchy but so a lot of that so uh really is very very helpful um You Know audio to text these days is as such an evolution um I you know always speak and it always types it up and my first thing is to say it's like it was you know a you know dictated and I apologize for being dyslexic so if you know if an issue with my grammar or what it says you work on it I communicate what I can and to you and then like and people usually find it you're funny or whatever they're very welcoming to it um there's a lot of tools out there uh both linearly or more traditional tools as well as digital that allows it to sort of create visual mind maps uh and you know I still do it I still take Post-its and white boards and I try to kind of put things non-linearly and move them around because I love the physicality of it even at my at my studio with a lot of the designers and others that are not dyslexic we print everything out and we print it on the walls and we move it around and everybody finds like well but we can do it in a computer yeah but then you don't get to be in it you don't get to feel it so um try to solve a math problem you know on a table on the wall instead of just writing it down you know so so these are kind of I think common uh easy tools to apply to any learning differences that I think can really support different modalities we were working on the Schwab Learning Center with some dyslexic students both High School is worse Stanford and one of the students there had a really hard time sitting still in the class or even through Zoom during coven and whatnot and as we brought him to the center we talked about what he loves to do and he says I love to dance so he just was doing I said get up dance and start to do your work on the board and just by moving and doing his homework the great change he loved the content he loved the subject so sometimes the tool are kind of more based on the individual person and then you just get think outside the box and you just find those tools and make them uh apply them to any assignment you know um so yeah I love that I want to meet that kid who wants to dance while learning that's amazing um okay I'm you know there were several questions that involved anxiety and dyslexia and um one parent wrote anxiety and a deficit Focus together are overshadowing what could be my child's superpowers how do I help them feel good about themselves and keep that light in their eyes so how do you help these students you know find their own powers and think of themselves in a positive light foreign yeah I mean that's that's um well a couple different approaches that I find helpful to that um it's a practice okay so for me it's not a single gesture it's an ongoing uh approach to regulating you know um what anxiety can be and where it is in the body so having a relationship with that knowing where it is how does it feel not running away of trying to fix it at least make space for it you know talking about it and where uh and how and where does it come up it's always been very helpful as I said earlier having a practice in breathing is a really simple and um something that most of us were like well what do you mean practice in breathing I breathe all day long yeah but we're not conscious doing it so I tend to do yoga and I tend to meditate and it's something over the years that I developed that really is helpful I got you know um my team at the agency to do some of that work and it's very simple you know just take deep breath you relax you embrace it uh and before you know it it's sort of starts to you know softens and become something that's much more manageable um and the more you practice the better you get at it so you're becoming having a relationship with it having the relationship with your dyslexia you're able to sort of know that certain things triggers it and certain things become too loud and then you just sort of find ways to start to regulate it you know um dyslexia is the way your mind and your body reacts with certain circumstances and your emotional guidance system is we're telling you that you know it doesn't feel good to be called out or to be labeled with a disability and and so you start to sort of figure out how do I go toward things that make me feel better and how do I um you know regulates my my feelings around it um you know different ages different different techniques for it but you know you're really trying to sort of find a way to not try to get over it but just embrace it you know um that's that's some stuff that really has been helpful to me over the years and uh I know it's uh with practice it just makes it a little easier over time yeah actually you mentioned in there something that was just leads up to the next question someone asked if there are different techniques for embracing and feeling positive about your dyslexia that you would use with Elementary School Kids versus if you're approaching a child in high school who needs to work through these sorts of issues you know doing the dyslexia dictionary um exhibit we had many schools come through and and hundreds of kids and um I can really sense their energy right like together as a group all of them were dyslexic so they would get super ramped up and everybody was getting on top of each other and wanted to sort of come to and touch the art and talk about and everybody had a question and um and especially the little ones you know first grade which is so enthusiastic and as as the sort of guiding them through and working with them the first thing you know I would say to them is everybody look over here and everybody together take a deep breath as big as you can you know and to stretch your body and reach up and feel your your feet and then I'm through everybody go quiet you know and it's who doesn't want to do it I mean I mean it was just so much fun you know and you do two or three times with them and all of a sudden everybody's sort of so much more relaxed you know and it's not a thing you know it's you just embrace the play of it and it just brings the energy down and growls everybody and makes it very um easy to sort of regulate the amount of energy that flows through your body um frankly I would do the same thing with adults you know or high school there's no difference it's just how do you approach the different individuals so it doesn't become a chore and it doesn't become like let me fix you by doing it it's uh you just more move toward it and you sort of help kind of like relax the body and relax the mind and relax your nervous system you know and um and like I said earlier on when you do it and you learn the benefits of it then you kind of tend to do it on your own you know and you can see like after we we went with the students throughout the different art pieces and talked a lot about it I was like everybody take a deep breath and they just remember just a few minutes ago and they came back to themselves and we can continue again you know the other part of it is when you know all that happened is run it out you know let it just like you know that we we I just let everybody ride around like just exercise it out let it flow through you and then come back again and sort of re-regulate again um young kids do it naturally you don't have the time to do it you just need to sort of give them some space to do it when you try to bottle them out then it's when you know the energy and the mind and the dyslexia sort of gets really ramped up but adults tend to sort of ballad up and sort of be a little bit more um a little bit more uptight about it you know and uh well I'm not gonna take any breath right now well why not you know I'm not gonna you know let me hide so nobody can tell that I'm completely absolutely stressed out you know well that's not really helpful everybody know you at least it's not helpful to you so just relax you know and the more relaxed The More Everything flows and uh yeah and it comes back to Center so that was great thanks um okay I'm gonna shift gears a bit to a question about dyslexia and fine motor skills delays which often can be dysgraphia but could be other other unspecified motor skills when you have a child like that who's so creative but they struggle with those fine motor skills is there something you can do to help them still Express their creativity well it's as you said it's it's a really big umbrella and every every child is different right so um what we tend to do when we design spaces like the Schwab Learning Center is to make sure they're being immensely sensitive to all the senses some individuals love stimulation so as you can see in my studio there's so much visual stimulation because it helps me kind of regulate I'm actually not that comfortable in empty spaces they're just you know so much that my mind is running so when I in my space everything on the wall I can ride on the walls there's art there's ideas there's stimulation and helps me regulate other people like super quiet spaces you know some people are very sensitive to sound or to being you know uh looked at um some people are very sensitive now right so I found that when we find the individuals sort of what stimulates them or what creates a lot of um uh um you know physical and mental and soundness non-stimulation is to sort of acknowledge it and embrace it you know so back to this question with the student you know if you know that the the child is needs to be more in a quiet space because that helps them regulate than finding those moments and those modalities that help them to support their differences um you know when as I kind of work with my dyslexia and try to regulate it and try to figure out how to come to Center is I realize that you know instead of stopping it is I start to move with it I start to dance with it you know because that the contrast wasn't so strong and I'm able to sort of dance with it and if I dance with that I can regulate it in a lot more um intuitive way for myself you know um so a few different ways but uh again I think everybody is different and talking about the individual child um and what is some of their challenges can be more specifically focused for their needs right right in ways that they enjoy expressing their creativity even if it's not with writing or drawing or something yeah like you said um so several people asked questions about college and careers and moving into adulthood and so earlier we talked a little bit about some of the things that you know dyslexics are uniquely good at um a whole variety of them so are there how do those translate for you into potential Majors or kind of career opportunities that dyslexics should be thinking about again I think that the question is uh rooted in dyslexia not in the person dyslexia is that's the way your mind works if you love to dance move toward dancing if you love to design or create spaces create spaces if you get your personal astonishment by you know thinking about engineering engineer you know and that's that's an indication of where your uh your mind drives right so there isn't a specific major I would say that dyslexic are really good at most of us as as far as as I went through some of the educational for myself is that I start to find ways that I was very good I was very good at thinking outside the box you know whatever I try to get a job I realize that well the way they were trying to solve it I did that didn't work for me I can think outside of it but I was maybe just starting my career so I didn't have really the uh opportunity to to shape it so I decided to become an entrepreneur and guess what a lot of dyslexic end up finding their own um path in many Industries because they try they tend to do it differently so one of the thing is to embrace that but it all goes back to the person like what gives you Joy you know it's and and and if you follow that then you'll realize that that is a good place to sort of find it in other places you know I would have never imagined that I would end up where I'm at today you know it wasn't my major to get here I first started in computers in the 80s and then I was really interested in the idea of communication because I couldn't really really write this as as well as I can speak I was like okay how do I communicate in visuals how do I use that as a visual language and then I realized that I can do certain things with that very well but I needed others to do other parts so I started to say okay my friend Dave is a great illustrator and my friend you know Susan is a great writer so I was like hey you know and I can definitely get clients to do projects so then we I brought everybody together and then I worked with them and before you know it you kind of dance with your skills and 30 years later you really you know you're Reinventing breasts and Reinventing spaces and rebranding organizations but it's the same thing you know um you know I really just started sort of at what place and it led me through the uh entrepreneurial mindset and the Curiosity and the mindset of making you know um I think this dyslexic are very good and and and making things when we figure out where we Thrive you know so what do you like to make you know and um either folks like to consume you know and that's where they get theirs to fulfillment but for me it's like I love to manifest and create things and because I can see them you know and I can see them before they come alive and then um I can I kind of know where it needs to go I couldn't always explain it to you but I've learned that to trust my gut and my dyslexia to to move toward it and um and then to readjust and to re-navigate the rear Jaws so you know what career is good for dyslexics any career you know any career that gives you uh that interests you and pulls you target you know um I would probably say what career is good for dyslexic there's anything that makes you feel great what career to stay away from is things that don't make you feel great that you work too hard to try to just be average because it's you know I mean we have to do some of it I mean I have ton of friends I became writers at dyslexics because they love to tell stories they have something to say not because they're uh caught in the mechanics of language or of writing writing is a tool to express an idea what idea do you have to express you know um so really find what you love to express and then the rest would follow if you just go down river with it you know uh you'll be surprised how quickly it becomes clear um and the other thing is don't try to arrive you know as parents we tell our children well how are you going to make a living I'm alive I mean you know making a living I'm already living you know it doesn't you know if you have you know a a joy in your heart and you follow your bliss the rest always follows it's only when you try to force something that's not part of the inner you know inner spirits that that you find the the Discord right what makes you less ease right disease like less ease it's not easy it doesn't flow it's not natural so you want to find a place where the where the flow of things become natural and becomes more right and when it becomes more than the universe and everything you do kind of comes to it because who doesn't want to dance with that you know so um find something you love to do and you know um you know one of the pieces in the art shows that we had and I designed with uh with a lot of intentions you know if it moves you dance with it move toward it and build a language for yourself toward that and find a process and the relationship to do more of it you know and uh and you don't have to be dyslexic to do that that's that's you know part of the beauty of being a human at least for my lens you know yeah okay beautiful love all that I was just all of us from the audience are like yes I love it um let's see I oh yeah I think that people were asking a little bit about how can we um prepare our teenagers for a world where not everyone is going to understand their differences and where not all their workplaces might be suited for them and in many ways you might just say well you you keep trying until you find that place where you know it works for you but how do you in your own work try to raise awareness with employers and with with adults in the in the world about acceptance and the benefits of all of these things it's a you know it's um it's really I mean there's no one way to answer your question there because I think that it's a life Pursuit you know my thing is I've learned that um so when when I was a child I was raised with a lot like a lot of dyslexic that dyslexia was I was lazy I was stupid I would never mind Mountain much uh I remember one of my early uh great teachers said all he needs is a pillow and he falls asleep what a sweet boy but um not that bright um and that's part of the dyslexia stigma is the shame you know and um and when you have somebody like a parent a guardian a teacher somebody that sees di gift then you start to change in in a narrative where we're trying to get to is a place that you have uh it's Dental you have confidence and dyslexic or not you can just approach the world with that you know so I've learned over the years to tell people that I'm dyslexic and that's the gift of it um yeah you know I almost want you to re-ask me the question in a different way because I think it's so specific to answer it you know um I think I mean I I hear you I think that um one of the things that's real that's related is if you could if you could speak directly to a child with dyslexia or ADHD or other differences twice exceptionality right now you know what would you most want to convey to them because I think that's the same message that you would want to convey to the whole world yeah it's really simple you're part of a group of individuals that are super super have super powers these are superheroes they've changed pretty much every industry around the world as you know it you know um and maybe people without dyslexia you know can walk can read linearly but us with dyslexia we leap we fly so welcome to the club I mean like you know um it may take a little bit to realize how How Are You Gonna Fly and how they're going to sort of spread your wings but you were born with the gift of seeing through things above things below things all at the same times you know and find things that are not related and find beautiful relationship between them so um you know congrats I mean like who doesn't want to be dyslexic I mean really I mean think about it I mean half my staff is like God I wish it was dyslexic you know because the few things I can't do you overcoming in ways you know but the things I can do not everybody can do them you know um you're an amazing company of people that invented from the light bulb to the automobile to the iPhone to you know I mean on and on and on so uh I I I I when you learn that then all of a sudden it's like you kind of realize like wow that's that's a pretty pretty amazing thing you know um and as I said you know you learn how to dance with it you learn how to build your confidence you learn how to um know that reading and writing can sometimes be challenging but seeing the seeing the you know mostly because I mean I read a story I right away dive past the sentence into the world into the under meaning into the emotional content of what the author or the content is trying to say you know uh it's it's you're opening a door it's a whole universe the possibility that the sentence is just the key you know and it's just sort of the you know so so as a dyslexic I think that um yeah I mean you know and lucky for the child's like what do you what do you what gives you that gosh he's like I just want to do more of it yeah then you feed it and you feed a dyslexia and then you you just reinvent it all you know so um and when you realize that it's a gift and you realize that you're in a company of these amazing individuals the story is different now you're never going to look about it the same you know then it's like then somebody tells you you can't realize it's like well okay whatever like you know like I invented iPhone what do you want from you know like uh you know it's like um so yeah I mean um like I said ask me the question different ways because everybody has a different um place with it and where they're at and it's always been for me a lifelong Pursuit I've continued to become open about it and find you know find my gift of it and realize that as a dyslexic everything is negotiable so instead of trying to resist that when I read I see through everything because sometimes I'm like you know I can see through everything you know and then I choose the things I want to kind of see through because I negotiate it all you know [Music] um yeah that was beautiful I love it um okay I think we're gonna move right now to the night of audience questions Callie and y'all do you have any that you want to jump in with while I look them over quickly sure um I'm looking through all of them myself um how do you support bilingual children with dyslexia I've had teachers just putting one language on the back burner and focus on one but that's not really an option if he wants to be able to communicate with all of his grandparents but I don't want to overload him so I was born in Israel um I'm dyslexic in Hebrew and in English um you know so I think that languages are just another medium of communication to different groups right I when um you know a language it's it's you know most people say oh you're also dyslexic and you know dyslexic in Hebrew it's hard for me to read in Hebrew it's hard for me to read in English you know I mean uh I I take the information you know the same way um often it just needed to sort of explain often you know in my with my family different Generations uh they come with different sort of understanding of um learning uh modalities um different age groups um so you know I remember with some of you know my grandparents have passed by the member uh before that um really explaining to them that I just see the world in a very different way my grandfather was an entrepreneur and uh you know and you could totally understand that you know as a dyslexic I can solve problems in different ways and that you will very much relate to it that I relate to people from a very different place than maybe my other uh siblings and relatives uh so often it's against to find the kind of gift of it and express it so it's it's accepted you know um I'm not sure I'm answering your question on that uh yeah but um I I don't find differences between languages and dyslexia it's it's the same you know it's it's um um but different cultures have different tolerance to it right I remember you telling us about the new found language um something that's negotiable and I love that story I was asking more of if we should agree with teachers who say put one of the languages that your child speaks or we're Israeli also um if we should put one language on the back burner in favor of another one and I don't know if I agree with that teaching approach I see where it comes from to kind of make his life a little simpler but in the long term I feel like that maybe would put him at a disadvantage yeah yeah and Gil I would just add I I think they're I know there are a few people on the call whose families are bilingual and they would love their children to be bilingual but they do get this advice that that's part of what is keeping the child from either learning to speak or learning to read or you know and I just wonder yeah do you have any thoughts on that like how parents should think about those choices I don't know if there's anything to do with dyslexia and that's not my expertise but what I can tell you is that um depends on the age right I think that sometimes when the the child is quite young and you have multiple languages uh and you have obviously you're you're you know your prominent language and then you can learn a second language like ah and it can be very difficult um over time it becomes easier and it flows better and that was then you have double gifts right um so it really depends on the individual and how it's embraced I I don't know that trying to not have a second language if that's something part of the family structure or an individual that it's it's something I would avoid um I don't know that it's it's it's there's difference to me between the dyslexia mind and languages you know um so I you know it's hard for me to be to say more about that besides that I you know I I'm dyslexic regardless of the language you know just the way my mind works and I would say it's up to the individual but I won't I personally but I'm not you know again not my expertise but I personally would not hold the child back because it may be it's easier because I think that often that's what reinforces that there's something wrong and there's nothing wrong you know so at least from my perspective right and I'm gonna put a link in the chat to something from understood.org which I think we have found in general has been a good resource on these topics so I think we can throw that into the chat from the point organization dyslexia um tutoring you know when you're working on the interventions that you might be doing especially when your child's very young to to help them learn to learn how to read like work on phonemic awareness I think it is important not to be mixing languages when you're doing that that will um slow the process down so it might depend what stage your child is in they may be if you've moved on past that you're no longer you know worried about or working on reading intervention strategies and you're looking more at accommodations and you know you're thinking about all your strengths and you're older then I think that should be a time when you could easily then start to look at incorporating another language just just my two cents on that yeah um I I love this question here I think this is that they'll be a challenging one so some neurodivergent people don't like the term superpower because they don't want to take away from some of the real challenges that they may face in a neuronormative culture so what are your thoughts on that um so it doesn't mean that you don't have challenges it just means that you're not your challenges and I think that there's a difference for me about that um dyslexia didn't happen to me I was born with it I'm not trying to overcome it uh I'm trying to have a relationship with it as I get to know myself uh and I can understand maybe superpowers that's very respectful you know it's all about inclusiveness and making sure that you meet the person where they're at and what suits them to feel their strengths so for me it's it's it's more around the idea when we talk about superpower it's not that I'm a superpower superhero I'm like it's that I'm not only focusing about what I can't do and you know label it as you wish frankly maybe don't label it at all but make sure that the dialogue and the behavior and the unspoken gesture toward that individual are full of all of it you know and it's not always about the the challenges and the struggles you know that there's more of a balance at school at home uh and and everywhere in between that the person can feel their full strength their full gift uh and their challenges you know you don't have to be dyslexic to have issues you know frankly I think people uh with every modality has a lot of different challenges uh but we don't walk around saying well he can't play basketball he's you know like it's it's really how we see the individual and how we support them I love the idea that we try to find what makes where's your strength and spend more time about your strength than about your weaknesses because if you come from that place that you look at the strength then it's a lot easier to overcome your differences you know because you know where your power is and you know what tools you have to do and how to um how to feel your best self and then it's a lot easier to deal with things that are more challenging when you have that confidence and you bring that to the table and you can use them to overcome some of the differences so you know but everybody's different like I said and I'm only dyslexic and this is only my experience and everybody goes about it differently so if superpower turns you off then stay away from it um find a different word or a different way to embrace the whole person how do we deal with that that's great okay um what do you recommend to do with a kid in public school who's in seventh grade who keeps getting the mess hit the message from his peers and maybe his community that um dyslexia is bad did that happen to you in school and how did you handle that um it happened to me at school um and and maybe a little bit because of my age and because at the time of education and and the lack of awareness about what dyslexia or learning differences were um it was very challenging you know it was very challenging and um now as an adult I wouldn't have changed a thing because it taught me to learn to work hard uh it taught me to find things that I was good at and I think that's part of what my parents and some of the better teachers that were able to see the gifts brought to the table um and celebrate that um you know it's it's people are going to tell you all sorts of different things in life and you can that you can't you know it's it's you can't change what they're going to say you can only change how you're going to interpret that and how you're going to sit with it so um you know it's a I think it's a good opportunity at least from my perspective to have a conversations about your personal strength and and um know that sometimes people are mean and sometimes people are you know they don't understand and they come at you in ways that are hurtful and um and how do you deal with that you know and that gives you the tools later on in life to make those choices or to stay away from those individuals but um you know um but if you at least at the same time maybe you can do something that's uh that they say but they can see you doing other things at school that have that gives you you know your talent um that can help change the conversation you know I always found that having an ally or finding a student that I was really close to over the years really gave me sort of community uh and the teachers I didn't feel uh Alone um that was also very helpful to me and being part of a group or I was involved in sports or in the art program or in the theater program that there was other places in school that I didn't have uh other support and other you know others communities uh or program outside of school that sort of gave me some um some sense of empowerment and Community you know and you touched on this a little bit just then but somebody specifically said they have a 16 year old who doesn't know anyone else who's dyslexic or twice exceptional and they recently left public school to homeschool and you know how how do we help this these people find their Community how do they find other dyslexics and you know how can they do that foreign go to my podcast and listen to stories of people around the world talking about dyslexia um you know you mentioned Jamie Oliver and so many others check out their their program there check out their stories you know check out their podcast check out their uh you know documentaries get involved or have your child get involved in realizing that so many people out there are dyslexians you know Community doesn't have to be in my neighborhood although there's ton of community of dyslexics and uh uh um you know neurodiverse people that are doing amazing things you know so I think it's really you know eye to eye is a great organization I mean there is so much out there these days that when we were children were not available I would say let them know that they're not alone and um finding those stories participating come to these great uh talks we're having um and and really realize that uh the world is greater than the moment they're living today and when they hear these stories of others allows them to find ways to realize that all of us have struggled so they're not struggling and they're only one in isolation and if some stories and tools about how to uh embrace it and um and when you realize that you were as I said earlier in a company of amazing people and some students tell you oh you're dyslexia can Mountain much you can tell them that you know the the tell them you know the phone they're using to text you was designed by dyslexic what are you gonna do about that or that the athlete that you love and there are you know top of their game are dyslexic so you know I mean like it's it's I think that um when those stories come out and you realize that it's hard for people then when somebody tells me you're dyslexic and you can't read okay you know it doesn't it doesn't necessarily goes as it is as it used to because I've learned and understood so much it doesn't go that deep anymore you know because it's just like it doesn't not really it's when young it really matters but as you grow a little bit you get to your teens and you hear about these stories and you understand that you are uh uh the gift of it and um it gives you a tool to cope with it and uh to deal with others um misunderstandings of what really is going on you know so there's so much out there these days that uh um it's just awesome so any other any other thoughts any other questions well I was just going to say on that one I I put in the chat like I was just so touched by what you said about like where do you get your personal astonishment and I thought for a 16 year old that's a great way to think about it is is where where is that child finding that joy and that astonishment or that excitement and then lean into those activities as a way to make connections if they're homeschooled so I I'm putting that one in paints like on my wall Now personal astonishment yeah it's part of what gives you Joy you know and uh and then when you find it just just just embrace it you know um homeschool or not uh you know it's it's when you find it is it the child is an adult it's like you just want to do more of it it just feels good and that's isn't that enough you know if you love to put your fingers in the soil and plant a seed and water it and see it grow and it gives you the joy of life I mean what else are we what else do we want you know and you know of course making a living is so important but then you realize that you become an amazing beautiful you paint with plants you you become a you know a gardener I mean whatever you know it's like all these different things that are just like you know um makes it so much so much more um colorful to to find those things and then to to go toward them you know you had mentioned family um and family in different Generations feeling differently about dyslexia there were a couple questions right after that about um someone says that her sister acts like talking about it as a taboo she will often say my daughter isn't dyslexic and she will be fine she thinks it's an extremely negative label and she won't talk about her own children possibly having it and other people say their partner is not understanding the strengths and challenges of Dyslexia I don't know if you had any thoughts on that yeah I have a lot of thoughts about that to be honest with you because I think that that is um part of the problem you know when you look at your child and you tell them no you don't have it it's not about having it it's just the way we are right um it's like you know telling if you are blinds and try harder to see uh you know um and and that child even if you don't say that child feels and sees that embarrassment and shame and uh in the parents and you know the label and that is what I think a lot of folks with dyslexia and other learning differences then they have to overcome that you know and all they want to do is to have their you know parent family teachers see them in in with the gift that they have you know um and I think it's unfortunate because you know it's you are who you are and um if you get older you realize that I don't need them to uh approve who I am you know it's uh often it's in the eyes of that person that the issue lies you know why is that person embarrassed on dyslexic or why is that person trying to deny the fact that I don't label me dyslexic or not it's the way my mind works but why is that person going to say you know you're not that and you can get over that and unfortunate you know um and I've talked to many parents and some you know some see this where's the car because they're all mouth too much you know I don't know I would say go fetch you know it's just like really is that where we are I mean uh so to me it's just like you know it's uh it's it's unfortunate then it's the educational and that person you know goes back to to that individual to sort of look at it and say well I wish it was different don't we all you know but it's not and the world is the way it is and you're born with the gifts you have and either you embrace them or you try to fight them and how is it working for you if you're finding them are you thriving are you content are you uh you know are you bright everywhere you can be and if dancer is you know no then you're dealing with what it's not and when you're dealing with what it's not you're making more what it's not and then the conversation about how empty is it versus how full it is you know so it's just a perception um and you know you have to meet the individuals where they are right it's it's uh I always trying to find uh you know the the Silver Lining and work through it you know but um directly to what you said I find that to be a very challenging thing when uh my parents does not um see the individual with all the potential you know so well I mentioned in the chat that this is such a common experience that comes up in our group right parents not being on the same page or how do you manage relationship with your own parents or the grandparents or so that's why we are hosting that event on February 13th because it's such a navigating relationships like this can be really really tricky so very tricky I want people to know they are not alone in that Journey oh no yeah absolutely Gil I'm personally curious if you wouldn't mind sharing an example I love how you described um using dyslexic design thinking and how you come up with things that are you know a different perspective and way of solving problems I don't know if you have an example I'm really curious of how that thinking led to a different solution than what sort of linear thinking might have led to I don't know if it's in a project you worked on or yeah usually you know um every project I work on I think has an aspect of that because um I try to and it's kind of like maybe a little jumping off the last question it's like I was trying to find is um what is the problem because usually what you consider to be your weakness is your strength you just don't know it yet and you don't understand it quite yet but when you realize that I'm putting more effort to hide to deny The Gift of Dyslexia all that effort going into into making something that's not so when I work with clients often we're trying to figure out where is the Discord and what we're trying to do why is it not happening um I remember earlier on we worked very early on launching the Patron tequila brand and I remember talking to the team and they looked at the bottle and and nobody used to have a quirky kind of chunky if you guys know Patron tequila the bottle is very small on this and I went to the bar and I I brought a sample to talk to the bartender to do kind of like dyslexic design thinking figure out boots on the ground like what do you think about this and the first thing the bartender said oh my God this bottle is horrible I was like why well because it doesn't fit in the well but we'll have to put it on a back counter and I was like okay that's that's interesting and uh this is if it's a top shelf product and you put on top shelf it's so small you're not getting a lot of visibility and I said would you put out there and I took a picture and what I realized is that when you put a bottle on the back counter everybody asks you what is that bottle and when you put a small bottle compared to big bottles because the Shelf was so loud all of a sudden what is that Corky bottle there and then we went back to the team at Patron and we said instead of changing the bottle to be bigger I think we should embrace the ball as his and they're like why and I was like because you can't put it in the well you can hide it and and it's exactly you know they it's like when we went with the big business will become you know bigger and we'll get more market share we'll change our bottle and we realize that actually what they thought was their problem was actually what we needed to embrace you know so often we kind of tend to look at where it's not working because you're putting so much effort toward that and how do we change the energy toward accept it and bring it on and all of a sudden things start to flow you know when students become um what they are you know so you know you're not dyslexic how is that working for you you know you are dyslexic oh my God what are we gonna do with it it's it's the same thing it's the same stick it depends which side you hold it on you know so no we're talking about dyslexia no you're talking about what dyslexia is not and if you go to the other side this big dyslexia is it's the same conversation but it's either half empty or half full do you turn it into a problem or you turn into the solution and I think to your question that's something that anything you do you can look at it like what are you focusing on and if you just sort of lean a little bit to the other side of it all of a sudden it opens up and when it does then it becomes it almost starts to tell you what what it's supposed to be you know you know with Patron we embraced it and then the audience embraced it and we embraced the fact that it was handmade the balls were handmade the process was handmade the relationship with the farm and the plants and the the community in Jalisco Mexico was part of the value of the product so obviously I'm gonna say what a patron was somebody that loves their community that loves their Heritage that understand that it's not about um just turning a dollar it's really about a value system that is through and through everything you do and when you get clear about that of course you can put that bottle in the well it deserves to be on the counter it's deserved to be celebrated because it comes from a place of appreciation of generation of Heritage and stories you know and all of a sudden you have so much to tell about it you know so I think that anything that you any any project we do Rob Learning Center exactly the same example it's not a learning you know it is a it's a facility to learn how to work with your dyslexia but it's about Innovation you know it's about ideation how do you how do you figure how to take your dyslexia and become make it a place that you are learning how to um you know be in an innovation lab for dyslexic you know then everybody wants to go everybody wants to be a part of it you know um so it's really looking at uh at the brightness of that and sort of feeding feeding it you know so foreign I love that and I love the parallel to how dyslexics should see themselves and how you solve these problems um I love that perspective Abby do you wanna right our last question one last question for you which is what is next for you in terms of art exhibitions creative projects that will continue to build understanding and appreciation for neurodivergence yes um so we are we just closed a beautiful show the dyslexia dictionary which you actually can check it online all the artists recording videos off the work and of their intention every artist chose a word to redefine their dyslexia with a full description and to make sure it's exclusive they'll recorded conversations and dialogues about it as well as the art pieces and website that they do so uh please go check it out online you can find all of it in on our website uh we are uh continuing the dyslexia dear dyslexia postcard projects which we want to invite all of you and all your children's and um and we extending it nationwide and around the world we're going to continue to post as those postcards continue to arrive we're going to continue to post it to the exhibition online so you'll see your work part of this Global community of kids of all ages so you don't have to be um age is not defined as you know a child and there's people from different different ages that are participating in it and we're definitely looking to bring it to a physical space throughout the year um so we're super excited about that and um the Inside Out project and this likes a beautiful mind uh we were part of a community that did that project in um London in the design Museum and we're working right now with different uh individuals around the US and about and abroad to bring it to San Francisco in uh later this year as well so uh definitely keep your eye on that project as well our podcasts are continuing uh we release one just about every month we have some great uh podcasts that already came out this this year and a lot more coming up so just amazing conversation with dyslexic from different backgrounds different interests uh um and um just always super inspiring from me and hopefully for the audience as well uh so um yeah we're we're as a good dyslexic there's plenty going on sometimes too much for everybody else but I just can't get enough of it so um yeah a lot is happening that's great thank you so much I actually posted the link to the postcard project in the chat I'm excited for my kids to do those postcards and send them in to you so I hope everyone on the call does that as well it's really exciting project so thank you yeah I just wanted to read you absolutely that someone posted this is the first time I have listened to an adult with dyslexia till now it's been years of negative connotations you have transformed My Views and how I interact with my child thank you amazing amazing beautiful see now you can go back you know that's the thing about it as soon as you sort of like figure out that that's like reading and writing great amazing bright brilliant children uh and embracing it then it's only the beginning I mean I can't wait to see what all these amazing kids will do and uh it's so cool to have uh everybody here today so thank you very much I really appreciate it thank you so much for sharing your amazing perspectives with everyone we're getting tons of things in the chat about you rock and this was amazing you changed my perspective so we really appreciate you taking the time to to speak with us so good you're welcome I'm gonna say thanks to everyone for coming and I'm going to stop recording now but what a pleasure and a delight and it's been so wonderful to focus on what we can find Joyful in our children and not just the things that they struggle with that so much of the world wants us to focus on so thank you

In our Sept 2025 support group for parenting 2e kids, Heather, a parent and professional advocate, explores practical ways to foster warm, collaborative communication with teachers while also navigating the more challenging moments when accommodations aren’t fully understood or supported. Parents will leave with concrete strategies for framing conversations, reducing conflict, and keeping the focus on their child’s strengths and growth. Read the transcript here all of your sympathies with me. Um, real quickly, just some housekeeping stuff. There's a tiny URL at the bottom of this slide. Um, and that has got a folder that just kind of filled with resources. It's got the link to the slides. It has a Substack article I wrote about this with a bunch of just great embedded stuff in it. And there's also an outline for your teens for helping them write emails to their teachers. So, it's just sort of like my version of an online goodie bag. Um, so that little URL could be really helpful if you want to just pop that in your browser and you can just kind of move along with us on that browser. Um, hi, I'm Heather Johansson. Um, I am a local advocate. I'm actually the founder of Mosaic Minds Consulting. We do some educational consulting and we also do advocacy. I've kind of had an interesting journey to get here. I was actually a regular education teacher early in my career, third and fourth grade. And then from there, I taught abroad for a couple of years. And it came into my love of special education, really focused that work on dyslexia. And then I was like, "Okay, I'm ready for those teenagers." And then fell hopelessly in love with teenagers and worked with them for like 15 years. Did a lot of program development for a local district, a lot around like social cognition, all of those pieces. and then kind of 20 plus years in public schools. I'm like, I'm ready for something a little different. So, I went kind of the way of executive functioning coaching and kind of worked with a local advocate and then eventually sort of founding my own firm. Um, it's me and I also have two other advocates that kind of work with me and take some cases. That's kind of the journey. And I think most importantly, I am a mom. I have three. Um, we are a house of ADHD. my lone husband is sort of this like lone island in a sea of of chaos sometimes. Um, and then the my oldest and my youngest also had some real mental health journeys. So, I definitely can come at this from a lot of different angles. All right, so with all of that done, we'll kind of jump. It always never wants to go when I want it to go to move my slide, which is always interesting. Let me see. I'm going to figure this out. Oh, just click it. There we go. Okay. So, kind of tonight's conversation, what we're going to talk about is sort of some of the realities um that kind of first reach out to teachers, how to involve your child and teen in that process, kind of that self-advocacy piece. How do we kind of start requesting accommodations and what do we do when collaboration breaks down? Okay. Um this is my favorite Hello Helen Keller quote. Like, alone we can do so little, but together we can do so much. Um, it's kind of a good one to hold as we're kind of working with teachers and just knowing that like when we get that nice relationship going, we can get a whole lot more done. Um, so that collaborative spirit kind of working together, it's just going to be so darn helpful. I'm going to absolutely hold the reality for us parents. We are tired. Parenting is a is a tiring thing. We add a little neurode divergence into the mix. It takes us for that next level. So sometimes it's hard to stay in that collaborative spirit, but just kind of knowing like, okay, that that there's that adage I still don't understand to this day, but the sentiment of like you kind of get more flies with honey than you do with vinegar. Not that you really want more flies, I don't understand that one, but it's kind of the idea of like it can go a long way. Um cuz the real educator realities having worked in public schools for 20 years like our middle and high school teachers can come come in around 200 kids like right. So that's just a lot of a lot of teen bodies. They're seeing those elementary teachers kind of 25 to 42 depending. There's lots of usual there's lots of needs in that classroom and then the reality is they're they're teaching for about seven hours of any day, right? So they're in front of kids, they're running their classroom, and then there's like all the outside stuff that they're doing, which is the planning and the grading and the emailing and all of those pieces. So they also are kind of coming from a place of just like they they're kind of they don't have a lot of extra either. So when we kind of come with more of that collaborative communication, it can make a huge difference. um just kind of like that that tone if we're kind of thinking of that like poly vagal nervous system side right like what are you gonna respond to like that when you have that more cal kind of that collaborative calmer tone is going to help make a calmer and more supportive teacher in classroom so just like kind of thinking of that kiddo in the middle and we're just trying to work together all right so that first contact I know we're already like it we're fully into a school year. So, this is kind of behind, but just in case you haven't got there, this the idea of just kind of keeping it kind, brief, and just the essentials. I get like you want that teacher to know everything about your kiddo, right? Of course you do. You want to tell them about every little piece, but we really kind of want to keep it just short. Like we don't need that long backstory, what they need to know to kind of keep your kid safe, regulated, and learning. And there here's like a little quick example like you know, hi, I'm Heather. I'm Sam's mom. He's excited. Writing's tricky. Here's some stuff you can use kind of first day. Here are two of his peers that like do really well with him. And then give him like a thing like he's a movie buff. Ask him about the Avengers and you'll connect right away. Just little quick, right? And I didn't go into like here's his 50page. Please read this neurosych assessment. That can come later, right? But like for that first initial contact kind of kind, brief, essential is a good way to kind of go about it. Um, so I per like having having worked in public schools for as long as I did, teachers love hearing from the kids. They just love it. So just anytime I always tell my teens, I'm like, teachers are suckers. We can't help it. If you if you go to a to a teacher and kind of tell them what you need, they're nine out of 10en times going to be more likely to respond just because they just that's why they're there, right? They like they like the kids. For our littleer guys, obviously your little guy is not going to write an email to the teacher, right? So maybe adding a quote from something they're they've said or like a 30-secondond video into something just for them to watch might be a good way to kind of help get that child into the idea of like sharing with their teacher, right? And then in that folder, there's a whole bunch of sentence starters and frames that can kind of help you with this piece with your younger kids, but like something that helps me when I'm overwhelmed. It looks like you can help me buy. And it's always nice to kind of hear. we think we know and it's I always think I know and then I talk to my kids I'm like oh actually you know like they always kind of know what's what's best for them and they're so good at expressing it for older students kind of like sixth grade and up um helping them to kind of start writing those emails right and like I said there's a outline in that folder you know showing them where to find emails showing them how to format an email like it is hilarious the emails you get from students are like, "What up, girl? I need you to grade." It's ju it's really funny. So, just helping them kind of structure an email. And here's the thing, like I know sometimes like we really hit self-advocacy hard, right? We're like they got to learn, they got to learn. I am a big fan of meet them wherever they are. My youngest is a senior this year and I still sometimes for those harder emails, I sit down next to her and we write them together, right? I just and there's days where I could tell she is so fried out if I try and push her to write that email to a teacher that's going to to make her way more toast, right? So, what I want to do is meet her where she is and sort of what she needs. So, if she doesn't write every single one, it's okay, right? Like I don't want to push past that point into getting her super disregulated, right? We kind of want to we want to do the growth but not the fry, right? So this kind of and that you as parents know kind we kind of know where that line is, right? So that's something I know there's a lot of pressure to have kids write them, but if your kids's not in that place, it's okay. They don't have to. Okay, I keep hitting the wrong button. So kind of now we're in it, right? Like deadlines might be being missed, things are flying, there might be some dysregulation having. So like, okay, we might have to kind of start communicating more with these teachers. So kind of like this is sort of an outline for it, right? Like first just like name that situation, right? Don't feel like you have to talk around it. Just name it like missed a desk deadline, a dis whatever is kind of going on. Naming that specific challenge like that is kind of causing the situation for the teacher. Like and we're going to get into this. I'm going to give you some examples. Outline a plan like kind of solve the problem. I know that sounds weird, but just if you kind of say, "Hey," and I'll show you an example of what this looks like, inviting that collaboration, expressing gratitude at the end of it, that word flexibility. Thank you for your flexibility. It goes really far. And then kind of CCing key people in. So, if you have an ID, CCing that case manager, the counselor, any other key staff of your kids, working with the therapist really closely, CC, it's like keeping everyone in the loop is a really good way to do it. So, I'm a bigam big fan of examples. So, like let's just say you need to write one for your kiddo, right? You have a freshman, they're freshman or sophomore. They're taking, you know, English, you know? So, starting with like, hope you're doing well. He's working and kind of naming it. He's working hard on cracking those due dates. That Lord of the Flies essay went flying right by. who really focus on a world history project because as we know sometimes our kids can't like break away from one thing to do another you know he's strong with factual writing but inference is more difficult once again really kind of getting into what's going on this is an IEP goal area along with executive functioning and then you're going to solve right he's coming to you on tutorial on Monday to get specific support on the that quote analysis we appreciate your flexibility thank you so much right we're going to continue to work on this like this, right? Once again, it kind of you're you're you're cuz we want that extension, right? And there's a couple of ways we could write it, but this is going to most likely get you what we're hoping for. Um, now if like your kid were to write it, and once again there is an outline in that folder for you, you know, just like, and this is going to be the hardest part is like for kiddos, they don't like to say they goofed, right? But just kind of helping them like yeah we all make ups says it's okay like and helping them once again format like I knew and just owning it. I knew it was due. I haven't turned it in yet in the future. I wrote and I think it's really important. I'll do my best because we don't want them to make promises. They probably are going to miss this again and that's okay. Like I'm going to do my best to email you before to ask for my accommodation. I'm working on planning, but sometimes my executive functioning challenges make it hard for me. Writing essays is also tough. And like getting really like into it, like including quotes is tough. I'm working. And then once again, he's going to give the plan. Like I'm I'm working with a writing tutor this weekend. I plan to turn it into money. Thank you for your support and flexibility. Right? Just kind of using those like those pieces. So if you have a little person like more of the elementary age, right? you're probably not going to they're not they're not going to be writing to their teacher. But like I know this is one that comes up for a lot of my clients is just kind of giving those sensory breaks throughout the day because teachers kind of forget a lot like you know hope your week's going well. Want to follow up about that accommodation for sensory breaks. He's coming home quite disregulated. I suspect he might be pushing through without taking breaks. Like these breaks really help every for giving some ideas like quick walk to the drinking fountain, a chance to stretch, you know, helps them stay engaged. Would you be open? That's my favorite. Would you be open? It's an invitation, right? Would you be open to brainstorming together? Let's bring in the case manager. We can problem solve this as a team. Thanks for your support. Right? Just kind of real simple. Um and then finally, like, okay, we need something new, right? like how do I ask for a new accommodation or something that's not already in an IEP or a 504? Um, you know, this is one I've seen a lot like, you know, Jim's doing great in math but struggling with those tests, right? He's working with a tutor, he's doing his like he's turning in his homework, but those working memory challenges combined with anxiety seem to trip him up, right? Naming it. And this is once again like we're g I'm writing for my teen, but I want to include his voice. Like he's expressed that having a formula card might help him. Like just this support could help root bring down his anxiety to show what he truly knows. And then a lot of times teachers are like, well, let's just have him take it outside of the classroom. And for some kids that's not a thing, right? It almost makes it worse. So just kind of problem solving that. Love to collaborate on what this might look like. I see CD's case manager, right? So just kind of warm solving tone. Okay. So you may do all of this and you may not hear back from a teacher or you just might get a no, right? Like this. You may and honestly what I have found like 95% of teachers are going to fully honor that email that you sent. And then there's going to be the 5% that don't. For whatever reason they don't. So kind of what do you do when that happens, right? So, if you have a case manager or like a counselor that holds your 504, you're going to share that communication because you're going to this is schools love it. This is sort of secret sauce. They love it when you kind of follow their chain of command, right? So, you're going to say, "Look," you're going to send that to the case manager, the counselor, say, "Hey, I sent this to Mr. Smith. I got this response. Can I get some help?" Right? Because you've already shown you've tried to problem solve it. you did in a really collaborative way so that instantly kind of kit will help get things moving. Let's say it's not happening with your case manager counselor, then you're going to go to that admin next, right? For elementary school, that's going to be your principal. And for your middle and high school, that's probably going to be an assistant principal. And the school website should have kind of which AP works with your kid, right? So that should be on the school website. The reason I point this out is sometimes we escalate right to the principal at that high school level and it's going to actually take longer to get the problem solved because they're they're rarely in charge of like kind of these types of pieces. So, it's going to need to get filtered to the right person. So, as we go straight to the right person, it kind of can help move things along a little quicker. If you have an IEP or 504, you can always request a meeting and kind of go go at it that direction. keeping this like by kind of sending these emails, you're keeping that paper trail which shows like all of your efforts which documentation which will actually help things kind of move along more. And I already see like a hand which goes to this. I'm sure people have questions so I'm happy to answer questions.

Parenting a neurodivergent child can be an anxiety-filled journey with concerns for their physical safety, mental well-being, as well as what the future might hold for them. Andrea Wachter is a licensed psychotherapist, inspirational counselor, author, and teacher, well known for her Insight Timer meditation courses on anxiety. Hear Andrea’s personal journey to meditation. Learn clear and useful strategies for addressing anxiety. Get advice to address high anxiety situations with your children. Hear strategies for self-regulation and co-regulation, which are so important in the parenting journey. Read the transcript here all right and I'm also going to see about turning on the caption I can help so everyone thank you so much for being here today I am Cali Turk I am one of the co-founders of REEL and we are here for our session on being mindful tools to understand and manage anxiety and this is a really special session for me uh because I'm getting to host Andrea wachter who is someone I just really admire and it was brought a lot to my life and I'll be excited to introduce you to her in a little bit before we jump into that we'd like to just give anyone who's new to real a quick overview of who we are and why we do these kinds of programs so we are a non-profit that's based in Silicon Valley our focus is really on helping twice exceptional students thrive in school by raising parent and educator awareness and understanding of the best ways to support them using practical research-based strategies so we do all kinds of workshops and offer resources and programs and events and we're excited that you've joined us today for this one in case you're not familiar with what twice exceptionality is since that's a term we'll probably be using sometimes today twice exceptional people are those people who have really distinguishing strengths they have high ability or potential in one or more areas it could be an academic area or creativity but they also have a complex challenge like dyslexia dysgraphia dyscalculia ADHD autism and these things mixed together to make a very unique lived experience for the twice exceptional. um like I mentioned we have all kinds of resources on our website please feel free to go to that and you can look at our Tui topics and get information on a wide range of topics that are very specific to the twice exceptional learner we also have a few other upcoming events on May 4th we'll be having our regular parent support group with PHP it's a nice night just to get together casually with other parents of twice exceptional kiddos to get support and ask questions on May 9th we're hosting Dr Tasha Oswald of Open Door therapy talking about what it's really like to walk the 2E parent path what are all the ins and outs the ups and downs and how do we navigate these great kids and then on July 11th we will have our next bi-monthly parent support group you can learn more about those on our website and register that's where you RSVP to get the zoom links and then if you would like to see all of our previous events you can check out our YouTube channel where we'll also post this recording um you can also tap into any of our other resources including our private Google group for parents so we'll put the link to that in the chat if that's something you'd like to be involved in it's a great place to ask questions get answers we do have Facebook Twitter and I already mentioned our YouTube channel we do offer educator workshops on a wide variety of topics too many here to go into but just know if this is the kind of information you'd like to bring to the Educators in your life that is something you're doing and we would welcome the chance to do that for you uh just to make a note that someone is not muted so if you could please mute yourself that would be great um and uh that we are a non-profit now we got our non-profit status of just a little less than a year ago today if you find our programs to be valuable to you we'd really appreciate your support in helping us continue to make sure to offer these programs for free to everyone who needs them. um so I wanted to say just a few words uh before we start talking to Andrea about why we're having this program today on anxiety management for parents and this all really came out of a project that I did because I'm also a Bridges graduate school student I'm getting my doctorate there and we had a class on social and emotional learning and we needed to write about an intervention strategy and as I reflected about an intervention strategy that had really helped me most in my parenting with my kids and I think helped my kids a lot it was really attending to my own emotional regulation you know and I had learned from various people through time that the more I could show up in in a calm in a calming way or in a way that appropriately matched the emotions my child was having the better it was going to be for my child in that experience and and so what I decided to do was really look at why is that important and what does the research say about it and and how did it connect into my own life so why it's important is that when we attend to our own emotional needs and and we have that emotional stability we're actually creating stability for our child too we're giving them a space that's that has a lot of stability to it for whatever they're going through and it's really important for them to have that stable space if we are emotionally dysregulated then the whole ship feels like it's going like this um it's also really good for modeling you know a lot of what children learn is what they see modeled almost more important how we act sometimes than what we say they're both very important but when I show up and in a way if I show up in a way that is very stressed and nervous and anxious it really sends a signal to my child that this is a stressful nerve-wracking situation it actually just increases the stress for them but when I show them how I can show up when things are difficult in um with with a more within a calmer way that still is serious if you don't if you look like you're showing up with no emotion then that's not sending the right signal either but if we're showing them like wow like we know things can be tough and and this is how we work through it it's that model for them so that when they're going through these situations when we're not around it's most likely what they're going to default to and then there is a lot of research that just shows of the importance of the co-regulation that I am when I am regulated I am sending a signal to my child that fight flight or freeze is is it's oh like we're okay we don't need to fight or fly or freeze up or if we are we can work through it and and there is actually a human experience it's it's really a human experience to go through these things and we can go through them together and that helps just everyone regulate better and the research really backs all of that up like that stuff you'll hear but it actually the research really does and and I and I am a little bit of a nerd about the research because of going through a doctoral program but parents are the central influence in our children's lives and that's important for every child that that's all children that's not just twice exceptional children but it is especially critical for the development of the gifted or twice exceptional child who may be uh more easily dysregulated than a neurotypical child and we really provide that core base influence in their lives um that co-regulation is it really can shape how our kids regulate themselves for the rest of their lives. and so I so I tried a bunch of different strategies to help work on my own stress and emotional regulation through the years because you know I think about being a parent of twice exceptional kids is really is really hard and really beautiful but there can be just a lot of dysregulation along the way and part of what I really appreciate so much about Andrea is she helps people really know like you know what like this is all okay like this is totally it's a normal way to feel it's a normal thing and I can become aware and attend to things that I'm experiencing and label them and then work with them and so my hope today is that we can really talk about some of those tools and strategies of how how do we become aware of like anxiety our own anxiety and how do we work with it and you know and so I do get to introduce you to Andrea which is such a pleasure for me because Andrea has been such a a kind of a guide in my life of someone that I keep referring back to when I'm going through different things um so she is a psychotherapist and she's an author of the book getting over overeating for teens and several other books for adults. she has been on lots of amazing podcasts and radio shows doing work and helping people to understand themselves and work with themselves in healthy ways she has an incredible amount of courses and tools available online for mindfulness anxiety relief depression relief all kinds of things I mean I really strongly encourage anyone on this call to go to her website which I'm going to put in the chat so no one has to remember it but go to her website and look at her courses um you know they're very reasonably priced and they're just really brilliant um I have found them to be just a wonderful tool in my own life so I've done a bunch of them already and um she has some really amazing free meditations on inside timer that I've loved using she just put together a really creative course on helping parents and educators help teens with mental health challenges which I know is something that a lot of our real community experiences um but she really focused what she's going to talk to us about today are some of the ways that we as parents and caregivers can better tend to our own anxiety and stress which I think is really just going to be wonderful so welcome Andrea and thank you so much for coming today. thank you so much for inviting me I'm honored to be here and I love what you said about um you know parenting is hard and beautiful and I can feel that it comes from your heart and so um yeah I was thinking about just before I give some sort of tools to help with anxiety I wanted to just talk for a few minutes about what anxiety is so I think of it as a false alarm you know we're designed to actually feel anxiety or fear stress if we're in Danger and our our nervous system is going to do what we need to do either we're going to fight or we're going to flee or we're going to freeze right and so we that system was really designed brilliantly for physical danger like you know there's a you know grizzly bear or there's um you know we're at the edge of a cliff or we're in some immediate danger and instead what's happened in our culture is you know there isn't the physical danger that much you know I'm sitting here I'm not in any imminent danger at all my nervous system hasn't gotten that memo so when I'm worrying you know oh what if people don't like my talk today you know or or what if oh my gosh this is going to happen that's going to happen when will I be worrying about the future or when worrying about the past my mind is worrying like I said something really dumb you know yesterday I shouldn't have said that why did I do that so I could be sitting here perfectly safe and but my body reacts. as if my life is in danger right if I if I am thinking um oh my gosh oh what I said before the talk started I sound like such a dork or oh my gosh you know what you know I'm starting to get a tickle in my throat what if I start coughing right the the thoughts can trigger like cortisol hormones in our body blood pressures Rising um so so I was thinking well that's kind of a long-winded way of saying anxiety is kind of it's it's it's when our body is reacting to thoughts because the primitive brain doesn't distinguish between real danger and a thought that will not harm us so to me that's really important that once people know that my I like to say my thoughts like to make me think that I'm in danger but actually I'm safe and when you said that to yourself anxiety starts to decrease we could be in Mortal Danger that's a different story right and then your nervous system is going to do what it needs to do right to get to safety so but but mostly most of the time the thoughts make us think that we're in Danger that's something awful is happening when actually we're safe so I I really think it's useful for people to notice what's in my mind right now you know I'm not in a grizzly or you know I'm just sitting here but wow what am I saying to myself. um and so I would say wow just like that my my chest my shoulders are starting to drop just like wow just being aware that oh I'm not really in danger here my mind is telling me I'm in danger so so the the I used to have really bad anxiety I still get it for sure but I had really crippling anxiety that led to addiction and eating disorders and and and so I was on a path to heal all that and once I learned these tools I really wanted to share them with people so the first thing I want to talk about is you know being aware that your anxiety is a thought problem so if you find yourself with anxiety and your you're not in imminent danger you want to get curious about what am I saying to myself I call them mental storm warnings because they're the mental storm warnings that you might not be aware of so you could be in your child could be like you know doing whatever they're doing and you're like oh my gosh why can't they just do XYZ and you think you're getting anxious because of their behavior but really you're getting anxious because you're talking to yourself about their behavior you're saying something like what's wrong with them why can't they just you know stop doing this so you really want to get curious about the mental storm warnings and give it a name some people call it you know the part of me that freaks out some people call it my little kid you know whatever you want. but but the second part of that is the Inner Loving Adult so the inner loving adult is someone who or some part of us that has we we can breathe we can calm ourselves down we know we're not in danger and we know that our thoughts are the danger the mental storm warnings so we want to build up what I call the inner loving adult that is the part of us that says wow you know you're so worried right now because you're thinking blah blah blah but you're really not in danger or I can understand why you're so upset right now you're thinking they should be doing XYZ or you're thinking that something's going to happen but really okay you're okay and so I want to say that we don't want to pretend that anxiety is not there so if you're having anxiety you want to acknowledge it like it's real I'm having it I don't want to I'm not interested in pretending that I'm not having it but I am interested in getting curious about what am I saying to myself that's causing this to happen and that's the loving adult is the part of us that can do that so does that does that make sense it makes a lot of sense. and you know what so one of the things that I really appreciate about that is like I think if we were to just think like oh it's just thought and we just like try to push it away maybe or or say like this isn't real it's not as effective as acknowledging I'm really experiencing something here and I need to attend to the fact that I am experiencing something that isn't feeling good and so let me make space for myself to attend to it yeah and in my in my book getting over overeating for teens and also the companion book for like you or parents or Educators I called in that book I actually called it the thinking self and the wise self I said the thinking self is always going to do what it does it's going to think you know it's what thinking cells do but there is this the wise self who understands and I say you know that the thinking self is sometimes great you know we need to problem solve we need to use our thinking cells but sometimes the thinking self starts to freak out and say and go to worst case scenarios and and and start just really catastrophizing and making us think we're in danger and so the wise selves like okay your thinking self is really freaking out right now you're having these kind of thoughts but the wise self knows like you're gonna you're gonna be okay yeah so if we think about like we're we're having this mental storm warning like this is happening or something bad is going to happen or we should this or we should that or I shouldn't have done this or I did it wrong these are all mental storm warnings does that mean those thoughts aren't accurate. well I wouldn't say they're not accurate I would say these thoughts are causing you suffering right now so any thought and any thought can be causing you suffering so what you want to do like the I shouldn't have done that you know I was so whatever or they shouldn't be doing that or I'm so worried that this is gonna happen like if the thought is causing you suffering you want to get curious you want to get curious about what's the loving thought to myself right now the loving thought to yourself is going to be wow you're really upset you're really worried right now you're really stressed right now what do you need like so what I learned in my own recovery is like so I would if I was having anxiety I would have always gone to food as the first tranquilizer and so what I learned was wow I'm I'm really worried right now and and so the Inner Loving Adult learned to ask what do you need you know and some people might need to journal some people might need to call a friend or a therapist or a sponsor or whatever some people might need might want to put on some you know soothing music some people might want to go for a walk and nature you know so what you want to do is learn how to not make yourself wrong for the feeling that you're having because like you were saying that's going to compound it but you want to get curious about oh what is what's going on you know what are the thoughts what's going on and what support could you use and so I think with our kids too if if if we really truly do think they shouldn't be doing something that they're doing or we you know we don't agree with something they're doing to just kind of notice this is stressing me out but to not come at them from that place of I'm stressed out and you're doing it wrong but to attend to that first. right and especially with 2E kids you know I have a I have a son who is 2E and um you know they already he already has enough should have I should have gotten that done I shouldn't be taking this long I should you know so if I come at him like that then it's just gonna shut him down right yeah right well I'm very glad we're here I know you're going to have a few main strategies to share so let's let's get into those sure so once you're sort of getting curious and you're realizing like okay my anxiety is not because of what's going on out there it's what I'm saying to myself about what's going on out there what I'm saying to myself about my kids it's not it's not really them you know we obviously we want them to show up and do their chores and get to school on time and all that but we want to attend to ourselves first so what I learned with that and that's why the first strategy I want to share is that when you're aware of what you're saying to yourself you want to identify that mental storm warning you want to say I'm calling it like a story because it is a story I'm making up a story that something terrible is going to happen or a story that whatever is happening shouldn't be happening which they're both painful and so once you have the story you want to bring yourself back to the present moment so for example I'll use this presentation because it's like fresh and on my mind so the story could be oh my gosh what if I say something um you know what if the technology doesn't work what if you know I'm just sort of like what if what if right and so when I was preparing for this I felt that anxiety and so the the mental storm warning was like these thoughts and so I would return to the present moment which is right now I'm just sitting here at my computer and if I start thinking about giving a talk then my my body reacts but if I say to myself no no no right now I'm just having lunch right now I'm just you know whatever I'm doing then my body calms down. so you're so you're in the mental storm warning when you're rehearsing the future or when you're rehearsing the past or you know when you're making up a story about something that's going on out there and so the antidote to that is to come back to the present moment right now here I am right now so bringing yourself back to the present moment now it might be that you're in the present moment and something is going on like it could be that your child is you know whatever they're doing and you don't like it and then you want to address what to do about that but your mind can bring you into the future it can bring you into all the what-ifs it can bring you into shame or whatever about the past all of those things are going to activate your your nervous system but when you breathe and just bring yourself back to here I am right now in this moment and trust me like I said I used to have debilitating anxiety so I do have compassion and understanding for how hard that can be but I really want to let you know there is hope and and you can you can do these things so so the first thing is getting the story it's really a story that I'm making up it's mental storm warnings and the antidote is to come back to the present moment so some strategies that I find really helpful with that one is to do some breaths whether that's box breathing or the 478 breath which I can just tell you real quick because it's so simple but it's so powerful so you don't have to do this now but I'm just going to tell you about it so when you do the 478 you breathe in for a count of four. you hold it for seven and you breathe out for eight and so doing that like three or four or five times actually sends a signal to your body that you're safe even though your body is like reacting as if you're in danger so it's it's really simple but it's so powerful and I just learned actually last night I was taking a class on on nervous system work and I learned that it's it's the out breath so that's why it's the longest in the 478 it's the outbreath that sends that signal to your body oh we're safe so so you can just take some slower breaths out that that tells your body we're safe and then I also I do a lot of what's called grounding so you just come back to what are my five senses so you could ask yourself like even right now like I could say oh right now I hear birds I hear my wind chime I feel my the desk you know under my hand I see sunlight you know so you just want to like bring yourself back to the present moment with your five senses and that's super calming to the nervous system so breath work five senses and the other thing I'd like to do is I have sort of a meditation or practice that I do that is like I say my name like Andrea you're okay Andrea you know what you're doing you're safe you know you've done this a million times because I had that I had had this I had a situation where I had a panic attack once and so I was like terrified that that was going to happen again that's a mental storm warning that was my thought but I'd bring myself back to the present moment I'd say Andrea you're okay. you know you've you've been through way worse you're safe so just that that you know you can do this is another kind of present moment thing just repeating to yourself I'm safe or you know I know this is hard but I can do this or I've been through worse than this before you know these kinds of affirmations people find very soothing so breath work five sentence affirmations and then you know if you have it like if you're in line at the at a you know the market and you're feeling anxious you could just pull up your phone and pull up a meditation so I do so much free stuff on Insight timer I do a lot of like calming anxiety stuff and so that could help too yeah so those are some present moment practices does that make sense yeah so you're so so in terms of if we're if we find ourselves in that mental storm warning of like the what-if or or should or whatever it is going on in our minds that is causing us suffering we need to name that and then we need to bring ourselves back into the present moment and there's all kinds of different tools we can try to bring ourselves back into the present moment right yeah and just the awareness alone that oh this is a thought problem so I have somebody might say oh but but this terrible thing is happening. so so that terrible thing might be happening but it's your thoughts about it that are making you more distressed so it's like to be in the present moment with it you know or or yeah and to notice what am I saying to myself like if I'm saying to myself this is terrible they should be different they shouldn't be doing this those are all going to increase your stress level so so so yeah and so this is this is actually like this is bringing me to the next piece which is sort of changing the thoughts so first you might identify the thoughts that are I call them untrue unkind or unhelpful and then you want to replace the thought so this is a cognitive behavioral therapy strategy where you notice what you're thinking and then you offer yourself a more true kind or helpful thought so to say so so the thing is a lot of us are walking around like beating ourselves up or worrying and we're not even aware of it and so the first piece is just being aware of it and then the second piece is saying to myself okay I'm thinking this so this is causing my suffering what would be a kinder thought what could I tell myself that would be more helpful more kind more true so it might be something like you know you're doing the best you can you've been through harder things than this before you know there's no emergency here like you know you know I have my favorite calming phrases so there's no emergency here this is as bad as it gets I'm going to be okay those are some of my favorites and I just really encourage people to learn some you know calming thoughts and there's also something really powerful to that when we when we say those things out loud. like I'm okay or I'm safe there's something about like saying it so so we can experience it in our in our bodies even more yeah you could write them down on some index cards and put them in your car you know just read them during a red light you know or before you go to bed just get them in your in your system so that it's almost like we're we're teaching our systems like we're safe we're okay and so the more we we feed it those things then it's going to go there you know in a time of stress otherwise you know you're going to just what comes naturally which is probably stress or worry or or what have you so we want to be training ourselves so we're always training ourselves so it's like we might as well train ourselves to have more calming we're feeding ourselves you know and which is why like limiting the news or limiting social media you know you want to stay informed we all want to stay informed but it's like you're feeding yourself stress and fear you know versus calming you know calming affirmations calming thoughts and then being aware of just yeah being aware of what are you saying to yourself and then what can you replace it with so I love this I used to when I first started my business I was terrified I had a lot of shame about not being a licensed therapist and I it was really hard for me to and so I I would feel so anxious when I was going to when I had to present my services to people and so my very dear friend who I used to have an office with wrote me little index cards about all the reasons why it was going to be okay. and you know and so I would pull those out and read them all the time when I was feeling that anxiety and that fear and it really is remarkable how it can help you it really can so so and so so when you know when I worked in residential treatment with a lot of kids I they would say to me you know it's like well well I should you know I should be getting better grades I should be doing and I'd say okay do you think those shoulds are helpful do you think those shouds are helping you and and and it'd be like no they they make me feel bad and so so and so we don't want to make ourselves feel bad right like what I discovered for myself but also you know with my clients is when we when we are kinder to ourselves we do better you know when we're loving to ourselves we do better so making ourselves wrong shaming ourselves like and so much self-compassion research has come out um Kristin Neff is a researcher who's really big she's um she's been on Oprah's podcast she's been on all kinds of podcasts and she's been researching self-compassion for I think over 20 years and what she has found is that self-compassion is the piece that people are missing so she calls it self-kindness common Humanity where you acknowledge like I'm having a hard time and then mindfulness so if you just do those three things it can help you so much to lower your stress or your anxiety so self-kindness common Humanity mindfulness so I'm having a really hard time right now I'm having a lot of anxiety or I'm having such a hard time with my son or or whatever you know everyone has hard times okay that's the common Humanity part so we don't want to feel isolated and alone. so it helps to acknowledge like I'm having a hard time and everyone has hard times so that's a little different than the mental storm warning of like oh my gosh this is horrible nobody else has to deal with this so you want to acknowledge the hard time and then say yeah everyone has hard times and then mindfulness is just being in the moment so again breath work or five senses or a meditation or an affirmation or a walk in nature so those are kind of just some strategies just to be in the moment with hard times and then the last strategy I wanted to mention today is sort of I sometimes call it spiritual beliefs and and this is optional you know it's not it's not for everyone but um I think for some people they're not in the present moment like when their their mind is spinning out and they can catch their stories and they can catch their mental storm warnings and they can come back to the present moment but where they have a hard time is when they have something going on that's making them want to be in the future they they know something's coming up or they have something from the past that is causing them suffering and so what helps me more than than getting myself back into the present moment is is having this set of spiritual beliefs so for me personally my spiritual beliefs are that my higher power or God or the universe whatever is always taking care of me and always guiding me. and so so that's my personal belief but it really can help lower anxiety if someone believes that so and another piece of the spiritual belief thing is the radical acceptance which is that whatever's going on is supposed to be going on so one of Cali's kids is supposed to be doing what they're doing right now no matter what they're doing so if it's time for us to intervene or say something that's gonna happen but when we fight with reality and say they shouldn't be doing what they're doing we suffer that's that's I think Byron Katie is a spiritual teacher author and she has this great phrase when I fight with reality I lose but only 100 of the time and so and so that that if you can really get with whatever's supposed to be happening now is happening now that can calm your nervous system so even you know during covet it was a real struggle for many of us you know and so just like okay this is what's happening right now you know that that can be really calming but when we fight with the present moment the irony is we still get the present moment but we also get the suffering that comes from fighting with it you know so you know in I'm really big into 12-step recovery as well and in the 12-step world they have these prayers they have the Serenity Prayer and it's really it's just beautiful so it's God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change the courage to change the things I can and the wisdom to know the difference. so so there's you know the radical acceptance part and that's going to help lower your anxiety to accept what you can't control and to know what you can control so sometimes it's more soothing for me to to move into that realm of like acceptance acceptance acceptance you know this is just this is what's happening this is what I'm being asked to be with right now and if that doesn't resonate with you fine just get back into the present moment you know and but I think for some people it may so so I wanted to mention it another another sort of spiritual belief that works for me is that um everything is happening in Divine timing Divine order for my highest good so that kind of like really helps me I take I take a deep breath and I just think everything's in Divine timing Divine order for my highest good so that helps me and I also really believe that wherever I go I am divinely guided and protected so if I'm when I remember to say that which I don't always obviously but when I remember to say that before like say like I had to fly somewhere I would say wherever I go I am divinely guided and protected and it just you know I still might think like oh but what if the plane crashes but I'll have that thought you know I'll still have my anxiety but I'll just think wherever I go I am divinely guided and protected you know so it's just it's like a coping strategy to sort of calm your nervous system in the face of things that we really can't control right. so there are sort of three big things that you've kind of shared with us so one was like be in the present moment and there's lots of tools that can help with that the second one was like kind of change the thoughts and there's lots of thoughts you can try out and the third one is kind of being at peace with what's actually happening in the moment right now so accepting what's happening even though that can be hard so even though things are hard you can find peace in the acceptance of actually this is happening right now yeah it's just allowing things to be what they are you know and not and not it's like it's such a funny thing to say like well that shouldn't that's not what should happen because that is what's happening so so it's just letting you know if you if you're feeling let's just say you're feeling ashamed or guilty because you yelled at your kids so the thing is your shame and guilt might make you think you're never going to do it again but the thing is you probably will until you learn the tools you know so just to be just to be with that like okay that happened it's not ideal I wish it didn't happen but it happened so now what can I do so the inner loving adult again is going to help like wow I don't I'm not proud of how I showed up just now and you know and can I make amends can I apologize can I you know if they're a little bit older or maybe they can understand a repair I think that that's a really important part when we do in fact make a mistake. with our kids is making the repair later after you've calmed down whatever that looks like for your child and making them understand like actually it was my thing it wasn't you right I got I got really worked up and I wish I had shown up differently I'm sorry yeah it's a huge um piece of modeling that for our kids about taking accountability and making repairs I think that goes such a long way so okay so we we actually have a few questions um and some of them are kind of tied to this so do you want me to go ahead and ask you yeah let's do it okay so the first question is if you are having a stress anxiety trigger also noticing a physical response such as chest tightness etc would you first address the body and or mind response I love that great question it's a great question so so I think and I've actually heard contradicting like some people say start with the body some people say start with the mind so this is what works for me I first want to notice what am I thinking and so I'm gonna like use the words okay that's a mental storm warning okay I'm really anxious and then I want to start doing something physically so for me you know I'm going to I'm going to take some breaths you know and I'm gonna start taking some slower outbreaths or I'm gonna start doing the 478 breath and and so what I think is we want to notice both you know what are my thoughts what's my body doing let me you know maybe let me put my hand on my chest and give myself a little love or you know just like notice it so but but sometimes we're so unaware of our thoughts you know that's the thing that's that's really surprising to people how when they start to become aware of their thoughts they'll they'll they don't even realize how much they're you know battling themselves all day long so so I think both are important I think both are important but for me I like to notice what's the thought going on you know what's the story I'm making up. because because otherwise you might you might notice your body then and then like a minute later you feel anxious again because you haven't addressed the mind side of it so yeah you know but but that's the thing I wanted to say like we can get ourselves calm you can take these breaths you can do these strategies we're talking about you can get calm but then you start thinking again you know right so so you kind of want to get in there and notice like okay that's a mental storm warning that's a story and you know and to not make yourself wrong for it so so the the thing is I used to I used to have so much anxiety I'd wake up anxious I'd go to bed anxious I'd be anxious all day long and so what's happened is I know the strategies now and so when something when I start feeling anxiety I I might be anxious but then within minutes I'm sort of starting to work with it as opposed to it just spiraling and spiraling so the more the more you the more tools you have and the more you practice them the better you're going to get at pulling yourself out or not getting in so far into the spiral so you want to kind of do an intervention as quickly as you can you know before it before it just spirals and and I just think it's it's important to also say that like you know I I really believe in you know I really believe in getting support and that could be by learning tools online it could be doing meditations it could be going to 12-step meetings if addiction is involved um you know individual therapy you know a lot of people I sometimes I say to people like so imagine you're sort of going down this path and you're like oh I'm gonna spiral I'm gonna spiral and you know you have like your favorite therapist or like some favorite meditation or some favorite resource and that can pull you over and and kind of bring you back to the center so so the more support we have and the more we use those supports the better were prepared for the storms you know yeah yeah. absolutely I I have like my little stack of things I go to when I'm like oh I need this you know right like I have my I know the people I call I know I have a journal that I write in I have I mean I have certain music that I listen to like I have I have this list of things I go to that soothe me and the more we have that and practice it the easier we can access it and kind of bring ourselves out of the spiral before we're down there at the bottom right you know to your point it's like I have my tools but I continue to experience anxiety so it's not that I experience the anxiety so much less than I used to but it's that I now have the ability to identify it and to work with it to attend to my nervous system in a way that I wasn't doing before right yeah and and we don't I always say you know I teach all these tools and strategies we don't want to make it so that we're using these tools to avoid anxiety we don't want to think oh I'm just going to be serene and calm all the time we're going to have it but we're going to start to use the tools to work with it so yeah yeah yeah okay another question so when a child doesn't have insight how do you then teach them mindfulness when they don't understand the need for it. and I would say you know I don't I don't work with a lot of children and so that's one thing I want to just disclaimer but I would say modeling is so powerful you know and and I would say you know just to talk through it like wow you know I'm feeling really worried right now because I'm thinking blah blah blah so I'm going to stop and take some breaths you know so it's like using language and modeling language you know of like this is how I'm doing this these are the tools I'm using and and so that's the that's the best I can do on that question great um is there anything unique to working with the adult child relationship that is different from just an adult working on themselves in terms of the triggers yeah so I think with an adult child relationship you know I think um it's hard when you know I have an adult child and I it's hard because I want you know it's like I'm still I'm his mom and I have a lot of concern for him you know and yet he's an adult and so I I really think that knowing what's in our Circle of control or not and learning to let go is is really important and hard and so I think um I think you know I think any of the strategies we're talking about today will help just to work with your own thinking and get yourself calm. um and to and to notice what what's your mind making up about it because it could be your mind is making up some terrible story about what might happen to them and so you want to notice that that's just a story it might happen it might not happen but you want to be noticing what am I saying to myself because that's where your stress is from is from what you're saying to yourself about it so and then and then some of it again is you know is just coming back to you know whatever your spiritual beliefs might be about trusting or or just coming back to you know to taking care of yourself and what's in your control and not making yourself so anxious about what's in their control yeah it's it's such a hard one right because like I mean my son's not I have not yet hit that with him yet but I also feel like I can already see it coming like at some point he's going to have to be an independent you know man in the world and I'm like I I already like want to like have like a helicopter fly over him the whole time you know and at some point I'm going to have to just like let go and trust that he is okay and and it's and it's he's going to have his path and I've done the best I can to to care for him and support him and guide him and at some point that's on him and it's really hard to not like want to over insert yourself. right right well that's a part that's you know that's a part where sort of the spiritual beliefs might help because I do believe you know we're all on our paths we're all being guided and you know just so it's it's not all on his shoulders you know there's there's help involved you know it's it's beyond ours it's beyond our control yeah yeah well you you said something in there that was like a more casual comment but I wanted to just Circle back to it which is you said it's like knowing what's in your Circle of control so maybe that's a tool we didn't quite talk about yet is like understanding what's in my Circle of control and what's not and staying really focused on what's in my Circle of control right so once you're aware and I think you know I think with time everyone becomes aware like okay I can't control that so so now I'm not going to use my precious energy trying to you know change something I can't change I'm really just going to go for what I can change and can I do it with kindness and compassion which you know sometimes we can't but you know that's the goal you know yeah so I guess sort of a follow-up comment I wanted to make on that earlier question too is like I think you know when we are working with our kids around their mindfulness and you know if they're seeming to have anxiety or something like that really focusing on that Circle of control so rather than trying to control how they experience their emotions making sure you're really attending to yours. and then when you're in a calm moment with them to be able to like bring it up with them of like I notice when you seem stressed it seems to happen around this time you know or it seems to happen around this I want to help you like have tools so you can like feel better to just kind of name it in a non-stressful moment with them so that you can work with them on it but rather than us like trying to control their experience yeah and also that's where it helps to know their triggers so if they're if they're if you know like okay there's certain times of day or certain situations where they have more triggers then getting support for that whether that's outside of you you know that's where it might be really nice to have a therapist that they can connect with so that so that it's not all on you to you know to teach them how to do it and and and it might even be more powerful if it's coming from someone outside of yourself you know so knowing what the triggers are um whether yours or theirs and and learning to navigate the triggers you know how do I how do I handle it when my kids freaking out or you know how do I stay calm in the face of that those are such big important pieces yeah and if they might even say this to your kid when they're freaking out that like I think you're having a really hard time I want to help you but I need you to let me know what you need right now like I don't know what you need do you want a hug do you want do you want some space you know do you want me to just be quiet so like asking them what they need rather than trying to guess what they need or impose what we think we need to do. so um we have another question which is how to become more aware of triggers and any courses or suggestions for how to teach kids about that how to practice an ongoing way to become more aware might be butterflies in the stomach or so noticing what your triggers are or perhaps you already know and getting getting support whether that's with an individual therapist whether that's Gathering tools whether that's finding favorite meditations um so I missed the question because I went on to a I went on to a tangent about triggered so how to notice triggers so can you can you repeat that yes it was um how to become more aware of triggers and any courses or suggestions for how to teach kids about that how to practice an ongoing way to become more aware there are if if somebody after we've sold inside timer so much like I said it's free and all the meditations are free if you have the insight timer app or if you go to the website and you put in um helping children or kids I think there's even a section for kids there's lots of courses there that and and meditations that are about helping children um get grounded and be calm and label their feelings and work with their nervous systems so yes I don't have any particular courses for children but like you were saying Callie you you use some of the tools with your kids and I think that's you know that's there um so yeah doing a search on insight timer with um children or helping kids that that could will bring up a lot great thank you. well I think too the more we become mindful of our own triggers and we understand how to notice our triggers that helps us then help our kids do that as well like because we are feeling more mindful ourselves then we're able to work with them more mindfully and maybe even in the calm moments have those conversations about I'm noticing you know that um this this particular sound seems to trigger you do you notice that as well you know do you notice and then to be able to have those conversations in those calmer moments about if they're notices and yes yeah what they might want like I was saying like I was saying before it's helpful to gather tools when you're calmer so that you have access to them uh and that your body experiences calm more often same with our kids it's like to try to get them to process their talk about or explain something when they're in the thick of it might not be realistic but later on you know what was going on for you and can you draw it and can we talk about it and where could you feel it or so yeah trying in the moment and then if not later is always another chance and I also think for our kids who are Autistic or have ADHD they can have a lot more sensory triggers than we realize and that is um another Avenue that you can explore as a parent is a sensory evaluation so that because they may not even understand like why certain things are bothering them in their bodies and it's it's something to do with their sensory system so in terms of just exploring triggers that's another that's just another Avenue. uh you used a word I wanted to ask you about before we close up which is havening what is havening I was very curious about that evening it's in one of my anxiety relief courses so maybe you didn't maybe that's not the course you took I had two of them um or I took it but it wasn't the one that I stuck with me so I need records I need to be retaught havening is kind of like creating a Haven for yourself havening was discovered by a neuroscientist well twin brothers neuroscientist and um they found that there were three areas of the body that when these areas were stroked with calm intention that it sent the most calming messages to the brain that they could actually see brain waves sometimes it's called delta waves or Delta therapy or Delta touch because it these three areas generated the most delta waves in the brain which are the calming brain waves that come when we're in deep meditation or deep sleep so the three areas are the palms of the hands and it's so ironic because during covert but it was like washing their hands but but doing it really calmly and you can see how that feels to you like what area feels the most effective for you and this is something you could do you know anytime I mean someone could be in a business meeting and just like under the table doing self-havening the other area is uh the upper arms so from it's kind of like giving yourself a hug too but from the shoulders down to the elbows and you just find your own pace your own pressure that feels right to you you can switch you know and then the third area is uh the sides of the face and I learned this from an anesthesiologist in New Zealand who teaches very simple ways to do now self-havening is when you do it on yourself obviously havening is when you go to someone and they do it to you but self-having is just so accessible this anesthesiologist he found it was so effective on his patients before they were going onto anesthesia that he gave up his practice and he just does havening full time now with people so it can be really soothing but you can play with the different parts the sides of your face the upper arms or the hands I even came up with a way I did this in my class oh I did this in my new depression relief course to take one long stroke so that you end up doing uh kind of getting too there you could even start here and kind of get all free but some people resonate more with one area than the other but you can notice sometimes people will write to me in my classroom and they'll say you know I thought that was ridiculous I listened to it but I did it tried it anyway I rated my anxiety or my depression it was like an eight or nine and I swear to God it's like it's a one now I just you know they thought oh gosh how is this going to help me and they try it and with the rating before and after they really people really notice calming effects I think it's amazing to me when I do it it feels different depending on which hand I have on top that's interesting yeah and it could help if you add in calming statements like I'm calm my body is relaxed everything is okay I feel safe that can help too. yeah well Andrea this has been an incredible hour I'm so grateful for you for taking the time to meet with us and share your immense wisdom and insights um with our with our group and I hope that everyone who came or who watches the video gets a good tool or tip that can help them to kind of work on that regulating themselves just because we feel better right when we're when we're regulated when we feel better we do better so and we can't always feel feel good I mean life is not all feel good moments but we can use strategies to help us ride the waves better so yeah I always say it's not always going to be 70 with a libraries but when it's stormy we have clothes and we have umbrellas and we have things that you know that help us through the storms so I will send you the name of the therapist who just happened to put out a flyer yesterday I think and you can just on our website and see if see if that's a useful parenting group awesome thank you for having me thank you so much thank you so much it was so lovely to hear from you thank you I'm so glad

Do you wonder why your brilliant child can talk for hours about their passions but struggles to write a simple paragraph? You're not alone! Teresa from REEL explains that this is a common challenge for twice-exceptional (2e) children, those who are both gifted and navigate learning differences, particularly in executive functions (EF). See some related articles: 2e Executive Function Vocabulary and Focus Areas Cheat Sheet Strengths and EF Struggles 2e Map Executive Function Scaffolding (Video) Strength Based Scaffolding for Executive Function Skills See the transcript here : Hi, I'm Teresa from REEL. One of the most common questions we often hear is why can my child talk for hours about their favorite topics but then fall apart when we ask them to write a paragraph about it? This is at the heart of parenting twice exceptional children, someone who is gifted and also navigating learning differences, including executive functions. Executive functioning includes skills like planning, task initiation, organization, and emotional regulation. These skills help us manage complex tasks and shifting demands throughout the day. It 's not uncommon to use air traffic control as a metaphor for all the many tasks and skills that are needed to make this happen. We, as parents of twice exceptional kids, however, might think it looks a little bit more like this. For neurodivergent kids, especially those with ADHD and those who are autistic, these skills often develop more slowly, sometimes lagging 2 to 4 years behind their neurotypical peers. And for gifted kids. And remember, twice exceptionals have both giftedness and neurodivergence. Development can be even more asynchronous. According to the Davis Institute, research suggests that gifted children may experience a delay in developing executive function skills due to how their brains grow. While most children begin synaptic pruning around the age of 8 which supports prefrontal cortex growth and executive function development, gifted children may stay in a sponge phase, delaying, pruning until around the age of 12. This may result in EF skills developing 2 to 4 years after many neurotypical, age-based expectations. In our small facilitated group discussions at REEL, we dive into these topics together, not just to understand the emerging science, but to share what it looks like in real life. It's a space for connection, compassion, strategy building, and understanding with families who get it. And, because we know not everybody can be in the room yet, we're starting to share some of our resources with our larger community. We're sharing 2 tools that have been developed through our community and through our workshop. The 1st one is the executive function vocabulary cheat sheet. This parent-friendly guide offers clear definitions and real world examples for terms like inhibitory control, cognitive flexibility, and goal-directed persistence. We recommend choosing one or two terms. I often have parents look at this list and say we're struggling with all of these. That's why I highly recommend you choose one or two that really resonate with your child's current struggles and strengths and your family's goals, and use those as a lens for observation and support. The next one is the strengths and EF struggles map. This tool helps you visually capture how your child's gifts and challenges often lie in the same space. In one circle, you list strengths, and in the other you note some EF struggles. The real insight comes from the overlap, the 2 E portion where strengths and challenges interact. One of our families shared that their child could speak passionately and in great detail, about Pokemon and Roblox and things like that. Their vocabulary and their creativity were off the charts. But when it came time to write a few sentences they froze. There were tears, avoidance, and what looked like defiance. But it was probably executive functioning overwhelm. Using the strengths and EF struggles, map, we can explore ways to scaffold and support without diminishing their strengths. We brainstormed options that looked like letting the child record their ideas first, using voice to text or a voice memo app on the phone, turning their Pokemon adventure into a comic strip or an illustrated timeline, and then using that as an outline, using their love of storytelling to create an oral presentation that's recorded to help refer back to as you begin writing. These scaffolds weren't shortcuts. They were on ramps, tools that respect both the child's talents and their developing executive function skills. Remember, these skills develop over years and when your child's brain is ready, and their practiced for many years to come. When you start to look at your child through this lens, things begin to shift. You can move from frustration to understanding, from confusion to a bit of clarity. And the connection you build with your child only deepens when they feel seen and supported. So , take a few minutes with the cheat sheet and the struggles map to help you begin your reflection. It's a powerful place to start, and we recommend involving your children in these exercises. They'll have insights, too. Don't forget REEL has many more resources, and join our community to brainstorm and connect with others. You're not alone on this journey. Thanks for joining us.

Processing and managing emotions is hard for even the most level-headed of us. For gifted and twice-exceptional kids and teens, dealing with "all the feels" can be exhausting. The skills needed to develop emotional regulation can be developed over time with guidance and compassion from parents and educators. Emily will break down the 4-step process of emotional regulation so we can help our kids who are "a little bit extra" find healthy ways to manage their emotions. Emily is the highly acclaimed creator of the Neurodiversity Podcast, author of several books including “Raising Twice-Exceptional Children: A Handbook for Parents of Neurodivergent Gifted Kids”, and speaks internationally at conferences about neurodiversity affirming topics. Read the transcript here I'm actually one of the few folks who is probably identified as a kid because I was identified as a kid because I was identified as ADHD when I was probably identified as a kid because I was identified as ADHD when I was in fifth grade as ADHD when I was in fifth grade and this was at a time when girls really weren't identified. And this was at a time when girls really weren't identified as ADHD, but in fifth grade. And this was at a time when girls really weren't identified as ADHD, but also it was. It was before, it was before Asperger's was even in the DSM. So I've never, it was before Asperger's was even in the DSM. So I've never been assessed for autism or Asperger's, but I know that there are a lot of those traits I have in myself. I know that one of my children does as well. And you know, it's kind of one of those things that you know, we just grew up in an age when really we didn't even, we didn't even really know a lot about that. So as we go through, I will be doing a drawing at the end for anyone who's in attendance and wants to, I'll do, I'll send an autographed copy of Raising Twice Exceptional Children to whoever the winner is. And Kelly or whomever you know if you want to jot down that that link bit. Ly slash nd hyphen pod and maybe share it in the chat that way if folks come in a little bit after we've begun they can still get registered before the end of the session and we can do that. Maybe when we stop for questions and answers we can plug that in again. So I'd like to start off by talking about Why young, gifted and twice exceptional people experience? All the fields and what that really looks like for them. So, you know, As we know, twice exceptionality really has to do with that overlapping. Of the of the cognitive ability layered with disability and that is really very complicated. For just operating in the world. We know that, for example, twice exceptional kids, when we just look at different profiles of twice exceptional kids. Gifted ADHD ears tend to struggle a lot with emotional dysregulation, as do gifted autistic kids, but for different reasons. A lot of times the hyperactive impulsive characteristic of what a lot of ADHD individuals experience is what's correlated with some of that emotional dysregulation where it's just really quick that those emotions come up related with the limbic system for our gifted autistic kids. It's more often related to kind of anxiety and not always identifying all of those different emotions as they kind of build up and then that some can sometimes result in either the meltdown or the shutdown or having difficulty regulating that. But beyond even just the twice exceptional piece there's also just evidence that gifted people in general tend to have some heightened emotional awareness or sensitivity. Now, we're talking about mild to moderate and it's not in every gifted individual but the research shows that there is that that is a piece of just Giftness and when I think about all of these things when I think about neurodiversity What we're really learning is about the interconnectivity of the brain and when we think about giftedness autism, ADHD, they're all about that different wiring that is almost hyper-connected in different ways. There are other types of of exceptionalities right where you know you have dyslexia dyscalculia dysgraphia which are all specific learning disabilities in different areas. And again, we're talking about some of the different brain regions that operate differently. And when you think about those types of twice exceptional kids, think about the anxiety that kids like that feel because they have this cognitive ability. And they know that they can do these skills and they understand these concepts, but then when it comes to some of these other more basic skills, they're really struggling. And often not enough that people really notice it. A lot of times that's, you know, our twice exceptional and our gifted kids and adults. And up spending a lot of time masking or camouflaging their differences. Whether it's a gifted middle school girl who doesn't want to be identified as smart or the teacher's pet. Or, you know, an autistic kiddo who tries to hide their sensory needs or their sensory stems, which are like repetitive movements that are often associated with emotional regulation. You know but they don't want to be appear that they are different so they kind of hide that beneath the surface or even the ADHD kid who overcompensates and becomes a perfectionist because they're so paranoid about making those mistakes. And being seen as, you know, not paying attention or not caring about their work. And so then they try to cover that up. That masking is really overwhelming. So when you talk about that emotional regulation, when you talk about all of those things that go into that. When you have twice exceptionality, that's a piece of it, that is a layer in and of itself into what magnifies some of those emotional experiences. So what are some of the other factors that influence emotional regulation? So one of the things that we just see with, gifted kids is the fact that many of them have Very high verbal comprehension skills. They have this verbal ability that allows them to hear and read and see all of the things. They hear conversations that adults are having. They see what's happening on the news or on the radio in the car. And they can cognitively understand this. And yet, they don't have the life experience or the emotional maturity to put it into context. So they may feel very helpless about those situations. They may feel really overwhelmed by what they know and not being able to figure out what to do with that. You know, I feel like in life generally. The first time that we experience a lot of things is kind of it sticks with us, right? It's like the most powerful and often the most distressing if it's a negative experience. But as we have more life experiences as we've progressed through those things and we've, we've. You know, matured, we can often look back on those things and say, okay. You know, I've been through something like this before. It was really hard. I got through it. But when you're young and you don't have those life experiences, it's really hard to know how you're going to get through that. So. A lot of our high ability kids, our idealists, they are perfectionists. They see what the way that it could be, whether that's their schoolwork or how their friends are getting along or other things in the wider world. And then another piece is that they have these advanced logic skills. That allow them to see the loopholes in various things, whether that's a teacher at the high school who is, you know, asking them to do something that doesn't make sense. Or, you know, a consequence at home that again, they're like, well, that's fine, you can take away this because I'll just find a way to do this other thing. But the frustration comes in when they can see the loopholes but can't do anything about it, right? They don't have any control. And also the other thing we have to consider is that Quite often, our neurodivergent kids are placed in educational settings that just really aren't appropriate. They're not a good fit for them. And so especially for our 2 E kids. When you have that giftedness. Layered with a learning disability, right? That's a really hard thing to find the appropriate academic fit because on the one hand, yes, they need to be the appropriate academic fit because on the one hand, yes, they need to be challenged. And hopefully we can provide some accommodations for them to experience that challenge. And we need to recognize though that like if they're only being seen as those areas of difficulty, they might be in a classroom that's really too boring for them and not challenging. All of those things like reduce that window of tolerance. For what we have, and so we are then closer to the surface of that emotional dysregulation at any time. And so we really want to make sure that we're understanding all of those factors and kind of trying to tease out what's really going on with kids. So what I'd like to do is I'm going to share with you some vignettes and I'm just going to introduce them a couple of different ways that we might see some twice exceptional kids. Who experience some of that emotional dysregulation. So I'll introduce them here at the beginning and then we'll go through the content of the presentation and then at the end we'll kind of wrap up and we'll apply what we talked about during the presentation to these situations. So Leah is a high schooler who really kind of stands out for her academic talents, but she also really has this perfectionist approach and the streak about how she wants things to be done. She has a really deep sense of what's fair and what's not. And so when she looks at problems like world hunger and then back at her own life it just doesn't sit right with her she gets a lot of feelings of guilt in helplessness. So when it comes to school work though, She's the kind of student who really likes to think outside the box. Okay. And she really wants to dive deeper, but often the rules or the teachers say that she can't have this flexibility on this assignment. So that just adds to her frustration. And then socially, she's always acting like trying to keep things undercover with her friends because she doesn't want to put all her worries on them. You know, she carries all this weight. She has all of these stressors. And, you know, it's just really overwhelming to her, but she knows that her peers don't really see it the same way that she does. So, you know, she has a lot of emotional dysregulation, but a lot of it is internalized. She kind of holds a lot of that in and that causes a lot of stress for her. So Peyton on the next is a second grade, twice exceptional, gifted ADH deer. He really, really wants a best friend and he is not satisfied when he has to share friendships. He wants someone who can meet. That exclusive friendship criteria. He's also one of the kids who likes to make up his own rules for a game and then he expects his friends to play by his complex rule book. But the other kids often want to play their own way and he does not like that. He's not interested. A lot of times that can then look like anger or frustration to those who don't really know what's going on inside his head. So he's got this really low frustration tolerance. So when things don't go as planned, it hits him hard and it really looks like explosive emotions. And if he senses even a little bit of criticism from a teacher or a peer, he gets very tearful, it causes problems not only at recess, but also in class when he's working in groups and in other social situations. So this is Peyton. And then we have Hannah. So Hannah is a, gifted middle schooler who is gifted an autistic and the world can be really overwhelming to her, especially when things change without warning. So she often tries to get a handle on her anxiety. I, trying to figure out what's going on, knowing what to predict, and then asking lots and lots of questions over and over again. But that can be a bit much during class. So a lot of times when things just get to be way too much, it looks like she's mad and that anger kind of bubbles over. Other times she just kind of shuts down and she pulls into a shell to protect herself from everything that's going on around her. And when she's in that place, whether it's that anger or that shutdown, it takes her a pretty long time to be able to re-regulate and get back to her usual self and get back to just kind of being able to get through the school day. So all 3 of these students show what that twice exceptionality and what that emotional dysregulation can look like. And obviously, you know your own kids, you know, when they experience emotional dysregulation. But what I want to walk you through tonight is a four-step process. Called the I can method for regulating emotions. Now, I just want to say this is helpful for all ages, even adults. And I want you to know that it is never too late for any age. I mean, if you've got teens, if you've got, you know, intermediate kids, if you've got a partner. Whoever it is. This is definitely a skill that can be built. And what I like about this framework is that you can use it in a lot of different ways. Basically what I've done is I was reflecting on all of the things that I was doing with my clients and my mental health practice, where I was really trying to figure out what specifically where the steps that I was helping them with when emotional regulation was one of their things that they were struggling with. And this is kind of what I came up with. So you can do you know, very direct, information sharing with your, with your kids. We're like, okay, let's talk about this. Let's talk about the ICANN method and you can talk them through each of these 4 steps. Or you can just gonna have it in your own mind. And then use some of the skills that we're talking about and try to implement them. You can use the steps out of order. It's kind of one of those dynamic processes where sometimes you're doing this step and sometimes you're doing that step in all really layers. But ultimately, it's a collaborative process and it's a tool to help all of us investigate for us to investigate what's going on with our kids but also to teach them how to understand what's going on in their own lives. So that they can build those emotional regulation skills. We want our kids to be independent. And this is a way that we can help them get there. So the first step in the I can method for regulating emotions is investigate. So what that really is talking about is building awareness around dysregulation. We have to recognize and understand those signals as they build. So this can be really, really hard for kids. And then, but if you don't know how to predict. The things that might cause stress, it's very difficult to be proactive. To reduce that stress before you get there. So it's it what would be ideal is if we're not always trying to be to put out fires, right? We want to keep the fire from starting in the first place. So one of the steps that we can do is we can track activators. What are the things that are those those things that that cause that emotional dysregulation. What are the stresses? What are the things that we notice as a pattern that cause some of that frustration? So first of all, we can just keep track of triggers and we can talk about them and notice, it's like, hey, I noticed that in the mornings when we're when you're running late for school that tends to be a time if you if you feel like you don't have enough time in your rush to you start getting really stressed and it doesn't take a lot then for those emotional emotions to bubble over. Or I noticed, you know, that when when you have your homework and you're struggling with your math homework and having a hard time getting started on it. That that tends to be something that kind of can can be the first domino that falls towards that emotional disregulation. And so we can have those conversations. We can kind of help facilitate those but also help our kids have some of that self-reflection. And one of the best things we can do here is like literally kind of track it, you know, and kind of keep keep you know, like either a tally or like a, you know, Google Doc or something where we're just kind of noticing and but doing it in a very non-judgmental way like, hey, you know what? Let's just see if we can notice any patterns. Gifted kids love looking for patterns. So how can we find some some areas where you're really you know where it seems like it's a consistent area that's difficult for you so then maybe we can problem solve through that. It's really important. As we work to track these activators that we recognize that surface level dysregulation is often not the cause of dysregulation. This means that It could be something that happened earlier. And you know maybe they got through whatever that situation was and then this is just the next thing. That kind of was too overwhelming for them but also What I find is that sometimes with kids they're kind of these like secondary emotions that they're experiencing. So for example they might be they might have something where they say that they're mad or they're acting as if they're really mad about something. But really when you backtrack through it, anger is not really the first emotion. It did maybe that they were embarrassed. Or disappointed or surprised when something changed and didn't go the way that they expected it to. And so we need to kind of be able to talk to them about that and try to figure out, what is that? Because I find that I mean anchor sometimes is I mean it's just angry or you know retaliatory or whatever the situation might be but so often it's it's disappointment or embarrassment or something, shame, something like that that's kind of like subtle and hard to talk about. And so we want to kind of help kids recognize that when that's happening. And normalize that for them. Transitions are huge and that can be any age. I was just talking with a parent earlier today about their child who is you know autistic and struggles to get to school especially when they're sick, right? Like they just have a sensitive system and so, but then the hardest thing is like even once they're well. Getting back to school after that is that transition it's like it's really hard and I know that's true for a lot of kids like anytime there's been a long break, a holiday break or a long weekend or whatever, whatever that next day is to get to school is always the hardest. And so, you know, it could be transitions like that or it could just be smaller transitions. Like I have to put away my video game to go eat dinner. But that can be a huge activator for a lot of that dysregulation because it's just, it requires. Some self-regulation, you know, in a cognitively where we're able to like. Stop this activity. Readjust. And move into this other piece and that can that's that's often hard for our neurodivergent kids. Unexpected changes is a huge one. And you know what's interesting about unexpected changes is that frequently We don't always know what the expected. See, the schedule of events is in our kids minds. And so then sometimes we don't even know that we made a change because it was just what we were thinking was the plan all along, but they had something in their mind about what they were going to do. And then when that changes, that can be really hard. One of the best things ultimately to do in this situation is really just to try to give as much advanced notice as possible and really kind of you know set everything up so that they kind of know what to expect. But that can be a huge activator as well. And then also we just want to always kind of try to notice that irritability if there is any irritability. Because irritability and increase in irritability specifically. Can be a sign of things like underlying anxiety like clinical anxiety. So when in the DSM, it specifically talks about for both anxiety and depression that one of the outward signs that you often see in kids is an increase in And so most people think like, oh, they're just grumpy or they're just gonna be being cranky or whatever it is. If it's a marked increase in its persistent and it's lasting, that's something that you might want to notice in order to perhaps, you know, talk to the school counselor or, you know, take other steps to kind of see what's going on there. Throughout all of this we're having conversations with our kids. Hopefully they're noticing some of these patterns. They're tracking those activators, but also we can just share some of those observations so we can be reflective or we can be direct, you know, we want to give lots of opportunities for feedback. But the biggest thing that we want to do with our tone is keep it really non-judgmental. Everybody has emotions. Everyone gets upset. We have to be really careful not to let their disregulation trigger our dysregulation. And the more we can kind of step back and kind of remind ourselves that like. It doesn't have to be about us even when it feels like it's about us. The better it is because All that does is escalate everything. Or if it de-escalates things, it does it at the expense of just causing more anxiety, right? Or like teaching, teaching kids to like hold stuff in without actually learning how to process it or regulate it because you know, they don't wanna make somebody man. So another piece for this is just finding opportunities for check-ins and this can vary based on age and development. You know, we just wanna normalize checking in about emotions on a regular basis. So for little ones. Make it a routine. I don't know if you've ever heard of this before, but something that my kids always have loved to do is doing roses and thorns and so sometimes it's when we're in the car sometimes it's when we're at dinner or whatever it's like and everyone gets to share what was a rose from today and what was a thorn, a good and a bad. And so, you know, you just can have these conversations. Kids kind of in the intermediate ages really love, you know, finding a rating scale. It's a shorthand. It's quick and it's easy. And then for older kids, one of the things that, you know, we just have to communicate with them and we're communicating. And so how can we integrate text and technology or memes, you know, making it kind of engaging in a way, but just like, you know, how is your day? I mean, one of my good friends, actually Amanda Morn, who is the co-author of my next book that I wrote, she and I basically communicate most of the time just in Shits Creek memes. That's like our preferred method of communication. But it's a good checking, right? And you can, and so that's a way even with older kids that we can really kind of, you know, encourage them to kind of share as well in a really safe. Way that's non-threatening. It doesn't feel too vulnerable, but it allows us to have that check-in. So taking temperature is kind of a rating scale. You can do this, you know, in a lot of different ways. Or additionally, you could also have a daily rating or a journal. Basically, one of the things that can be really great for kids, I don't know, maybe you could convince your older kids to do this, but perhaps for younger kids it's a little bit easier but having like a journal that you write back and forth with each other. That's kind of a cool way. They like getting like letters, but also you know, it gives it's kind of safer to sometimes write the things out rather than having to say it out loud. But more than anything with these check-ins, we just want to maintain this detective perspective, which just means kind of this, again, this. Very kind of neutral. Viewpoint about what it is that kids you know is going on and we're just kind of curious about it we just have a sense of wonder and just trying to figure out what's going on and that can help to normalize talking about those things. The other piece that we really want to do is we want to investigate body signals of emotions. So, one of the things that we have to recognize is that there are a lot of factors that really influence our emotional regulation. And part of regulating our emotions has to do with managing our physical sensations. So we know that sensory integration is closely tied with emotional regulation. And so When we, how do we know that we're feeling angry? How do we know that we're feeling stressed? How do we know when we're feeling nervous or sad and what are the body sensations that we're experiencing there. Now what's interesting about twice exceptional kids is that sometimes their sensory systems are wired a little bit differently. And so if they have a hyposensitive sensory system, that can be a little bit harder for them to identify that, but we can build that skill. We can help them find the things that are working for them. And just again, investigating that, trying to figure out what are the precursors to that emotional dysregulation. So after we have the investigate step, the next step that we have is communicate. So we need to find ways to communicate about being dysregulated. So this takes a lot of different forms, but the foundational piece here really has to do with building emotional literacy. How do we help kids find the words to say? Because for gifted kids especially, when they're really young, First of all, because of that, some of that heightened emotional sensitivity. And because they have this. Vast verbal comprehension. The word sad mad, glad and scared or whatever, I don't know, are not going to be enough. They are going to want to find the just right emotion word and finding that just right emotion word is really powerful. So, you know, I think one of the skills is talked about in the place that I know it from, I believe that this was originally where it was published is from the whole brain child is the name of the book, Tina Bryson and I'm not going to remember the other author's name. But. They talk about name it detainment, right? And so when you are able to step back from your emotions and label the emotion. It gives you just a little bit of distance, right? Sometimes when we're feeling emotional and we're really in it. It's like overwhelming. We're just in the emotion. But when we can step back and say, wow, I'm feeling really frustrated or I'm feeling angry or I'm feeling melancholy. I don't know, whatever the perfect word is. It gives us that that opportunity to reflect and it kind of brings us back into some of those other cognitive parts of our brain with, you know, that are, that are processing that information a little bit differently. Rather than like the limbic system and everything that's just kind of focused on the emotion. But it can be really powerful. It gives a sense of control. One of the things that can be a barrier here is a lexicon. So I was mentioning earlier about that hyposensitivity that some neurodivergent people experience. And so if you have hyposensitivity to some of those internal body signals. It can be really difficult to label those emotions and that can be associated with elixir-themia which is basically a term that means having a difficult time identifying and labeling emotions. So I can think of a client who I used to work with who definitely experienced Alexothymia. And we would be talking about whatever the situation was. And I would say, you know, well, how, you know, what do you, what are you feeling? What do you think, you know, how were you feeling when that happened? And he would sit there and he would think. And he would pause and he had he needed some additional processing speed usually and then he would like at me and he just would go. I don't know. And this was a middle school student. He was like almost in high school. And for what it's worth, like he wasn't being defiant, he really just didn't know how to really label those emotions. So sometimes we have to find other ways to to build that skill, something you can do with kids who really have a hard time and can't find that just right emotion word, you can find other ways to symbolize it. So again, using numbers as a code could be good. So like are you on a you know 1 2 3 or 4 and they can kind of decide whatever those numbers mean or they might be able to draw like a symbol like a squiggle or a spiral or something that kind of represents how they're feeling in their body. You know, any of those things can kind of be other ways to build that emotional literacy without necessarily finding the word. But one of the tools that I really love to use is an emotion wheel. You can find this. You can go and Google, you can find an emotion wheel, you can find a million of them. But basically it's just kind of a, you know, tiered circle with all these little spokes that come out and in the center you have this kind of 6 primary emotions. So basically think the characters from the inside out Pixar movie and add surprise in there that's usually the one that gets added in there but then as you go out the feelings are more nuanced the words are more specific. And so I have this tool. I've got it over there in my drawer with all my other fidgets for the kids because we pull it out and use it as just kind of a menu. How do you decide what emotions you're feeling, what's the just right word here? What I have a picture of here though is actually a reproducible page from my book Teaching Twice Exceptional Learners. So if you want to have your kids, you don't need to buy the book to do this. You can do this on your own. You can see it's a circle. It's got spaces on it. That's all you really need. But basically, get online, get on the source. Com and find your own words. Like what are the just right words that you want to put on your emotion wheel? And so for those kids who love that higher level thinking skill and want some more ownership over it, this can be a great tool for them. The other thing that you can do with kids and you can have this through conversations, this is an activity that you would do with younger kids, but really helping them focus on the fact that there are, we often have mixed emotions, right? They can layer on top of each other. So this was them something where we drew like these little thermometer scales. And they got to pick what words and what order they went in, which was kind of interesting. But if you notice there's like a little a little slit that's cut through there with a with a paper clip on it. That they could then move the paper clip up and down as we were talking about it. And so, you know, anything that's tangible like that can be really helpful for kids too to kind of just communicate about those emotions. The other thing that we can do is we can just model emotional literacy. We need to show this to kids. So often kids somehow feel like adults always have it figured out. And if they don't have it figured out and they're emotionally dysregulated, kids tend to internalize it like it's probably something that I did. Which rare, you know, it's really not. But we want to kind of verbalize our own dysregulation and kind of talk through what's going on. We can show that vulnerability to them, but we can also then explain our strategies. So for example, this is what this could look like. You get a phone call and it's extremely frustrating to you. And so you're emotionally intense child recognizes this and they are asking you what's wrong. And so you just kind of narrate it for you. You know, I'm feeling really frustrated about the phone call I just received. I had hoped that the car was going to be fixed today but they found something else wrong with it. Labeling then the what you're experiencing. My heart is racing and I feel kind of sick to my stomach because it's going to be difficult to pay for another repair. I really felt like I wanted to yell at the man on the phone, but it's not his fault. So I'm going to go and sit for a minute and kind of just relax for a minute and try to think about what my plan is. The more we can really just model that for them, we can show them like, what are my internal body signals telling me? What is my thought process like? What is my next strategy going to be? Like, what am I going to do? It can be really helpful for kids to be like, what am I going to do? It can be really helpful for kids to see that process but they don't they might see it can be really helpful for kids to see that process, but they might see it, but they're not going to necessarily be observant, but they don't they might see it but they're not going to necessarily be observant enough to understand what's really happening enough to understand what's really happening. So what we want to do is we want to be able to kind of go through and you know, show them what those steps might look like so that they can really, you know, just understand that a little bit more. The last piece here with communicating also is just self-advocacy. So we want kids to be able to self-advocate. We want them to ask for help. A lot of times gifted and twoi kids do not like to ask for help. They are used to being able to do things they are used to being able to be successful with things and it's really hard for them. So I find that one thing that can be really help. Is to kind of give them a script or if it's not a script like a structure specifically. So that they know what steps there are to to self-advocate. So the first one is. Recognize when help is needed. I'm having trouble with this thing. I identified that I cannot do this on my own. I need help. Then you have to find help. Who's the person to ask? Who do you trust? Who can it be? You know, whatever age it is, if it's, if it's the high school guidance counselor, if it's, you know, one of the teachers, you know, if it's, if it's, I don't know, one shade, whoever it might be. But who is the person that you're going to go and ask for that you trust? You ask for a assistance, but then this is the other part that I think is really important. You offer a suggestion or idea. So I will tell you that one of the things when I was a classroom teacher and I would have kids come up and they would need help or they would have kids come up and they would say to me like they would need help or they would raise their hand, I go over to me like they would need help or they would raise their hand, I go over to them and they say, I don't get it I need help. I have no idea what that means. I need you to kind of process through and try to think about what it is you need help with. But the thing that I really like to prompt kids to do and push them to do is to offer a suggestion or idea. It might be a terrible idea. It might not work, but at least it shows that they're attempting to solve the problem. Right? And I think that what they need to know is that when they self-advocate, especially if they're going to somebody who's maybe not they're not extremely close with like a teacher or whatever that might be. When they show that they're actively trying to find a solution. Even if that solution isn't a good one, It I think it goes a long way with just that communication piece. So we can encourage kids to do that. So, you know, find help who's the person you trust, ask them, describe the problem specifically, and then offer suggestion, you know, or, you know, what is the idea? So we have so that's how we can communicate about regulating emotions. So we investigate, we communicate. Our next step is that we need to activate. We need to activate our problem-solving skills and use cognitive flexibility to assess and determine best strategies. So when we're talking about this, one of the things we can do to activate is we can assess the size of the problem. Now this is tricky because the size of the problem for neurodiversity people might be much different. So for example, if you have a twoe gifted autistic hito, something that seems really small, you know, a sensory issue that they're experiencing that's that's causing a lot of discomfort or anxiety about not knowing what to expect, right? That might seem small to us. But it might be much bigger to them and we need to validate that for them and recognize that they might, it doesn't do us any good to to tell them that that's not a big deal. You get a lot further if you're like, I can tell that's why you're really, you know, distressed about this, you know, let's try to see what solution we can find. But also we can help them put this into perspective, you know, as far as their emotional reaction and how big that is for that problem. So one activity that that. I like to do, well I'm gonna get to that in a second actually. So one thing is just a quick pause signal. When we notice that that emotional regulation is elevating and we want to try to find a way to implement a strategy. We want to activate it and do a quick pause signal. Like, like, okay, we're, we're ramping up here. They can use the quick pause signal. We can use the quick pause signal, but like let's just pause. For a second and just assess, right? And it's kind of like just Taking a break for a minute. And helping to just reflect on that first second before we get into too much too much further without emotional dysregulation. As we're doing that, if we can, we can do this activity called emotional price tagging. You can do this in a lot of different ways, but I love this. Again, I've done this with all ages all the way up through through high school students and I do it in different ways like when I do it with younger kids I do it in a much more concrete way where we literally get out like index cards or construction paper. With older kids, it's more of just a discussion that we're talking about. But basically, because kids love Money and they love kind of the mathy types of stuff, a lot of types of things a lot of time Emotional price tagging asks them to assign a value. To the emotional reaction that they had. So a, you know, just kind of a sigh and a rolling of their eyes, right? Maybe that's worth a penny. And then, you know, if they kind of raise their voice and say, you know, something that's kind of, smart alecky or kind of mean, maybe that's 5 cents. I don't, whatever, a dime a quarter, a dollar, $5, you know. Maybe a $20 problem is where they've totally like had a complete meltdown or whatever. But then what you do is you then reflect afterwards. And you say, you know, how much did you spend? Did you spend or did you save? You know, did you did you spend too much emotional energy on what the size of that problem was. You know, or did you or was it just a penny problem? The other nice thing about this is as you have this conversation, it gives you a shared language that you can use. And so when you do that quick pause signal in the future, maybe you can say something, hang on. How much is this problem worth? This is a penny problem? Is this a quarter problem? To just put it into perspective. So having something tangible that they can assign that to. But again, I think that, you know, it's just helpful. To offer that reflection piece. And sometimes they will tell you, you know, it might be a problem, but let's say for example they think the problem is a $20 problem. But could you have a smaller reaction in order to save that money? You don't have to spend all of that money. Perhaps you can reduce that reaction in order to try to find a solution in that way. So, you know, that can be something that you can have a conversation about. Another piece of this, you know, activating is just really doing perspective taking and really trying to understand that that We don't always know what other people are thinking. I think that's really confusing and I know I know that there are a lot of kids and a lot of people who it's like they they feel like they should automatically know what other people are thinking and they don't but so what I'd like to do again trying to make it really concrete for some of our two-week kids I do a lot of drawings with little little thought bubbles. And it's like, okay, what? What are the possibilities? What are the hypotheses that we have about what this person might be thinking in this situation? And understanding that there's a lot of variables there. We don't always know what it is. So in this example, why isn't Won doing as part it isn't fair that I have to do all the work. It doesn't fear that I have to do all the work. So what are 3 possible things that he might be thinking? Well, he could be thinking this work is too hard, and Mali will be mad if I mess it up. He could be thinking, I wonder how I did on my math test this morning. It was really hard. It could be, I wish I didn't have to do this project. It's so boring. So recognizing that there can be multiple reactions that somebody is having and that we don't always know what that is so it's so we need to communicate with them to find out what that is so that we can then react or respond accordingly. The other piece about activating is using realistic reframes. Realistic reframes are kind of the answer to what people would call toxic positivity. I've known for a long time. It's like if you try to use positive thinking or too much positive self-talk with especially with gifted kids they're gonna look at you and go Well, that's not accurate. That's not true. But a realistic reframe is recognizing that There's just kind of a mixed reaction that you might have more of a neutral reaction I think sometimes when I'm working with kids, it's hard because They often think that everybody is happy most of the time. But really, usually it's like we're just kind of content. We're just kind of okay. Maybe, hopefully. And so we want to put this in, into context for them so they can really understand. You know, what's a realistic way to look at something? So here are some examples, right? So the first one here says, you know, I got an answer wrong when the teacher called on me. Now everyone thinks I'm dumb. So that's definitely some negative thinking. Some all or nothing thinking. And so the realistic reframe might need to be like, I'm allowed to make mistakes like everyone else. I feel embarrassed that I that I messed that up but I know that people probably won't remember you know whatever that might be a realistic reframe and really what this comes from is you know we talk about cognitive behavioral therapy which this is kind of related to but really this is also about acceptance and commitment therapy. Act. Which really has to do with kind of accepting some of those uncomfortable emotions, but then committing to take action on it and trying to figure out like what's the solution to the problem, what can I do there? It doesn't always have to be easy. What can I do there? It doesn't always have to be easy. It doesn't always have to be positive. Sometimes this kind of sucks and that's OK. But we can also recognize, you know, it's like. Another example for this would be like nobody likes me. I'll never have any friends. It's like, okay, I, you know, I have a couple of friends who I would like to be better friends and I know that that's something I can work on, right? That's the realistic reframe, just kind of keeping it in that context So after we have investigated, communicated and activated, our last step is to navigate. So how do we get through that dysregulation and return to a regulated state? So, you know, a lot of things we can do here, you know, I think one thing to recognize is like there are a lot of kids out there who think that mindfulness doesn't work. Especially gifted kids, especially two-E kids. You know, and when we talk about mindfulness, what we're really talking about is that just that mind and body connection. But the way that I get kids on board with this is I teach them the science behind it. Right? I teach them about how the key stress response region in the brain, the fighter flight. Part of our brain, you know, activates. And when we engage with some of these other strategies, we're able to get out of that fighter flight so we might talk about polyvegle theory, we might talk about how these things actually help you know stimulate our bodies to help us relax. So that tends to be. A good way to get some buy in. You know, sometimes I'll have them even do some research on it, you know, to find some ideas. But, but there's, there is science behind it. It's not like just hokey stuff. But I also would say I don't ever try to get kids to do something that they don't feel comfortable doing. So like a lot of times mindfulness activities will tell you that, oh well you need to close your eyes. You don't have to close your eyes. Just look at the ground, look at the wall, just whatever, just kind of try to focus like with like have a soft focus in your eyes without really like looking all around at everything. Or, you know, oh, and this is the other thing about just kind of some of the breathing and trying to kind of like stay really focused on your breathing. This is great for perfectionists, but literally The goal of meditating is to fail. And then to catch yourself when you fail and redirect your attention to your breathing or whatever it is that you're trying to focus on. Kids think I can't do that. I just always get distracted. Like that's literally the point is noticing when you're distracted so that you can then refocus. And so, you know, it can be helpful that way. But there are other just some quick things that you can do that can really help and that kids can kind of do on their own, especially when they're not. Like if so that other people won't necessarily notice. So one of my. Preferred. Breathing exercises that kids that have kids do is called is just counting breaths. Well really adults too. This is great for helping kids fall asleep as well if they haven't. I actually used this to fall asleep. I notice that a lot of times the clients that I work with, they don't like the really complicated breathing exercises like breathe in 17, hold for 6, you know, whatever. It's too much for them. I mean, those things work. I think they work well. And if people like them, that's great. But I think for a lot of kids, they're like, it makes me hyperventilator, whatever it is. Counting breasts is just simple. You don't do anything differently with your breathing. You just count your breaths. And so when you breathe in, it's one. Breathe out, it's 2. Breathe in, it's 3. Breathe out, it's 4. And then when you get to 10, you just restart back at one and start counting again as you go through. And so, you know, but what happens is naturally as you're counting that breathing, typically it does kind of slow down slow down your breathing and helps you kind of relax. And another little activity here that can be useful I call straw breathing. There's a quick trip right across the parking lot from my office over here. And so every once in a while I grab an extra coffee stir or 2 just because those are really good because they've got that really thin little hole but basically all this is is like you do a quick little body skin. How is your body feeling? What do you notice throughout your body? What is what are the sensations that you're experiencing? Okay, we're going to take a deep breath in. And then when I count to 3, I want you to push the air out through this coffee stir and make it last as long as possible. And then you kind of just reassess after that, it usually takes a decent amount of time to finish blowing all of that air out. But most people, and I know what I experience, it's like I feel like my whole body just kind of goes, kind of just relax, you know, relaxes or deflates a little bit. But that's another really good one. To just kind of help return to regulation. But you'll notice that either of those don't require you to go anywhere differently. Another part is just about allowing breaks. Or alone time. If you have a kid who walks away in the middle of an argument. If they walk away when they're angry. Let them go. Let them go. There is no reason for us as adults to force them to stay while we continue to to lecture them. About whatever it is because I promise you at that moment they're not hearing it anyway. We're doing that we're doing that for us we're not doing that for them. And so, but I'm not saying that they get to walk away and we never discuss it again. They walk away and if we can in that moment say, I can tell you need a break. Let's come back to this. In an hour at dinner, whatever it might be, or come downstairs when you're when you're ready to when you're ready to talk about what's going on. Whatever, whatever that space that time might need to be. But sometimes we need to do that too. You know, it's like, what I say. What I say lovingly to my husband when Because he likes to get in that cycle with the talking and I'm like, okay, I feel like we've reached the point of diminishing returns. We're not we're not making any progress here. We're just kind of talking to say the same things. And you know it's not a back and forth. You know so so we can really allow that and recognize that that is a helpful and a healthy strategy. To be able to then come back and have a productive conversation. Because when we're in that dysregulated state, it's just not, we're not getting anywhere with it. Another piece with this is just recognizing that sensory tools and stems can be really helpful. So in case you're unfamiliar with the term STEM, It's really related mostly primarily to autism, but a lot of ADHD or STEM as well. And it really just has to do with repetitive movements. That are coming. If you notice, I'm sitting here in my chair and I even swinging back and forth the entire time. I'm sorry it's probably distracting. I really can't, it's just what my body does. And so I also have like this little fidget here that I always use when I'm giving a little this little fidget here that I always use when I'm giving a presentation, it's like a little fidget here that I always use when I'm giving a presentation, it's like a little fidget ring and buy a million of them on Amazon for like 4 bucks or something. I don't know if they're really cheap, but you know. Those things, any of those types of little fidget things can be useful. Sometimes kids need to pace. Sometimes they need to rock. Sometimes they need to, you know, I don't know. Do whatever but recognize that sensory input can really be calming. So a lot of kids love deep pressure. So that's stimulating their proprioceptive sense. So weighted blankets or just tight hugs. Right? Those can be things that can also be really regulating for, for their systems. So understanding. What your child's sensory needs are is really a helpful, helpful piece to kind of recognize that those things and those stems are regulating their emotions. And so we want to we want to help them find what works for them. So, you know, I think the thing to remember with, with this step here is that we're talking about progress and not perfection. As I mentioned, any of these steps can really be done in any particular order and it's like you might jump around. But you can see how they do kind of follow each other with the investigate, communicate, activate, and then navigate. But we want to just work towards the goal and recognize that if you have a kid who struggles with emotional regulation, it is not a problem that started overnight and it's not going to end overnight. And so that's okay. We can we can work on it. Build the language, build the community, you know, communication about it, build the rapport, and just kind of keep focusing on it. So I wanna go back to these kids that we were talking about and I want to kind of walk you through. The I can method and the steps based on their situations. So if you recall, Leah was our kiddo who kind of had some of those big picture concerns about the state of the world. She kind of internalized a lot of those things. She would get really stressed when she would want to be kind of creative with her with her schoolwork because she could see different ways that it would be done and then was sometimes shut down with that. But she was always really internalizing this anxiety and was coming home and was really stressed at the end of the day. So for the investigate piece. These are based on real clients. I kind of changed some of the details, but you can kind of see how we worked on this. But you can kind of see how we worked on this. But basically we set an alert on her phone. So that several times a day she would check in and she would rate how she was feeling, you know, just from her stress level there and then tally any common factors that were going on. So there's something on my mind or something happening in class, whatever it was, we could look for those patterns. For the communicate piece once we kind of had some of that information we were able to look for those patterns. And then we noticed that when she was feeling helpless or feeling a lack of agency, that was a huge piece. So we knew that then that was something she could then go communicate. To her school counselor was a go-to person or to her mother, you know, or to me, but but being able to just verbalize that and recognize like I'm feeling really helpless about this situation or I'm feeling like I don't have any you know any control over the situation was really good for her to be able to communicate what was going on. For activating, one of the things that we did was we kind of just developed a plan for really trying to recognize. Which factors in situations were inside of her control and which ones were out. And so that was the strategy that we would activate. When she was feeling dysregulated. And then basically for the navigate in addition to just kind of getting through some of those moments it was more of a big picture thing for her but ultimately she really wanted to have a sense of agency in the world. And so she and a friend actually set up a like made a whole bunch of friendship bracelets and did a lemonade stand. This was, you'll tell you how long ago this was, you know, so they raised money to send down for the hurricane that was in Puerto Rico. I don't even remember what year it was off the top of my head but it was a long time ago it feels like. But that gave her that kind of helped her to feel like she had some control there. Helpful for her though when she had to then navigate it she could kind of plan you know what could I do how could I how could I have a voice in this situation? As well as just in general trying to trying to focus on if it was outside of her control how could she distract herself from that. So for Peyton, he was our little guy who had trouble with some of those friendships and was really sensitive about things. So we decided with him that we were going to focus specifically on group work. Because it was something that was pretty easy for us to investigate and look for those patterns. So we used an index card to track how often he went along with someone else's idea, how often he pushed for his own idea or how often he compromised. And so more than anything, we're really just trying to bring that into focus and build his awareness around that. We, for communicate, we developed a script for him to talk about how he's feeling when his group members wouldn't listen. And so just one of those very basic I feel when because and but we had that on the back of that index card so we had it as a reference. For activating, we work to develop that awareness and perspective taking skill so that when he was in those situations he could remind himself that the other group members also had good ideas and so we really just tried to do that perspective taking right like seeing what what are other people thinking what are other people feeling And then for navigating, we came up with a plan to proactively establish. Expectations with group members, you know, so that everybody was in agreement about who was going to do what. And and then also just kind of making sure that that if he got dysregulated he had a space in the classroom where he could go to work on his own for a little bit and then come back to it. Then lastly, Hannah and then we'll jump into doing some Q&A and everything. So, you know, so Hannah was the one who was having a hard time when those expectations would change. So as far as investigating, we really were working on helping her recognize the the physiological signs of stress throughout the day and kind of helping notice a ranking of what those physical science were because she was specifically like it really tight in her shoulders should also pick at her nails. And so that was one of the patterns that we noticed that was helpful to her to kind of recognized when she started to get dysregulated. For communicating just trying to ask for a break when she started to feel overwhelmed about things or or asking for clarification. For activating one of the things that we really did was we developed a plan with a teacher for plan check-ins because the teacher was getting frustrated because Hannah kept asking how much longer until this, how much longer until this, like it was almost like an obsessive type of request where she just had to ask. To find out. And so she would have these planned check-ins. She knew exactly what time she was going to have a check-in with the teacher a couple times a day so that she could try to wait until that time rather than just always going up and doing that. She was delaying that, that, you know, that impulse. And then for navigating one of the things that really helped her was she needed a place to stem she needed an opportunity to pace. Wherever that might have been in the classroom where she could just get up and walk back and forth because that was very regulating for her. So. So the ICANN method for regulating emotions, we investigate, communicate, activate, and navigate. And as we build those skills with our kids, we can really help them to, you know, learn how to manage that emotional dysregulation. So here are the copies of my books again. I will do the drawing, but I know we've got Q&A, so I will stop my share for now. And I will pull up the thing, but you know what? Let's throw that link into the chat if we can. For the for the drawing if people signed in a little bit later they can they can hop in there and then we can do some Q&A as we're doing that. Sure, you'll hang up. Thank you, Emily. That was amazing. And I, people are asking for your books. We will also share these slides, this recording. Oh, hang on that and I got to share my screen too. I went back to the presentation, but I didn't actually share the screen. That would be helpful. Hang on. Too many. Thank you. Okay. And Kelly thinks she'll put links to the book. Yeah. Perfect. And if anybody has questions, feel free to put them in the chat. We had a few. Come in while you were talking. So one that I thought was an amazing question was, I'm curious about any insights about the unfortunate baggage and stigma around negative emotions. An example in the zones of regulation, there are zones like red that sound inherently negative and they're formed applied to be inferior to the green zone. Similarly, when naming emotions are owning and explaining how you feel is often wide that it's better to have a positive emotion like being happy or fine. Versus furious or jealous or insecure. It bothers me because I think it can act as a barrier to willingness to accurately name an emotion or zone. Any thoughts or strategies to help destigmatize? At school especially, I feel like there's baggage around being yellow or red. One of my sons often says he's fine or good when he's not because he wants to be fine. Yeah, yeah, so when I talk to kids I never really I'm gonna stop this share right now, that's alright. Hopefully everyone kind of got a picture of those or whatever. But. Emotions are our body's way of communicating with us. About a situation. There's nothing good or bad about emotions. There's comfortable emotions and there's uncomfortable emotions and we can normalize talking about them with people, but I. Really with my clients definitely try to get away from Any of the valuing of a emotions like that they're good or they're bad or they're, Any of any of those types of things. So as far as, yeah, the zones of regulation, I think as can be a good tool. In some ways but I agree with you that there is kind of an insinuation. That yellow and red are not are not what we want specifically. So I guess as far as getting the school on board That's a difficult one if that's not part of their culture. You might start with the school counselor perhaps and kind of see what their thought is about it or if they have a way to maybe approach the teacher. But I think more than anything The conversations that you can have with your child to normalize those emotions, to recognize that they're okay. You know, and it's like, I was like, there's no, there's no wrong. Emotion to feel in any situation, it's just like, what do we do with that emotion and helping them to kind of figure out how they how they handle that so that they can be you know, not not feeling uncomfortable when they have when they have those experiences. Yeah. Great point. Okay, you mentioned not letting their dysregulation trigger our dysregulation. This is definitely a challenge at home. Do you have any strategies you recommend for that? You know, I think that The best thing So what I tried to do, this is, this is because my kids can get my emotions going too, right? It's hard because we're all tied up together and all of this stuff and our emotions are tied up in how they're feeling and if they're successful and all of those different things like that is just a fact. But what I try to do is like I try to like put myself in the position of what I do when I'm here in my office. And when I'm here in my office and I'm talking to my clients. I just really try to be really curious. I ask a lot of questions. I try to try keep I try not to make any assumptions. About what's going through their hat. Well, I here at the office, I really don't. It's harder with my own kids because I just feel like I know them really well. But I just try to try to get them to kind of share about those things and ask some guiding questions to say. So tell me what what you were thinking when that happened or tell me, you know, what was going on or, or help me understand, you know, like what, what is it that we could do that would help and really kind of trying to put the kids in charge of those conversations as much as possible. Okay. I think what ends up happening is when we put Like when we make suggestions and they reject them, that can get our, that can get us going, right? Or if they argue with us, right, even if even if we're right. And so, so the more we can kind of like take a step back. And Enter problem-solving mode, but but putting them in the driver's seat of the problem solving. Like we don't need to solve the problem for them. We just have to kind of be there to help help them figure out what the that solution might be. One of the things, and again, love and logic, if you're familiar with love and logic. I like some of it. I don't like all of it, but one of the things that that they talk about in love and logic. It's a little mantra that you can use to say in your head, I love you too much to argue. Love you too much to argue. I'm just kind of going to stay neutral here. And that can be, that can be helpful as well because a lot of times what ends up happening is we just get in a power struggle with them and you're never going to win. Because I mean you might win but did you really win if you know what I mean? Yes, no. You don't. No, you think you you might win in it might be a temporary win, but it is not. It does not last long. Yes. I am a notorious problem solver, so this is good advice. So the next question is I'm curious about suggestions for working with a child with PDA. I'm not sure about suggestions for working with a child with PDA. I'm not sure everyone here knows about PDA. I'm trying to figure out a way to get my kid on board with wanting to work on this even though his brain perceives the demand as a threat. Yeah, so so PDA for those that maybe aren't familiar is a term it's not it's not public display of affection it's pathological or pervasive demand avoidance. People describe it as a kind of a subtype or profile of the autism spectrum. And specifically what it is is like it's an intense need for autonomy and an intense need for independence and a feeling of control because what what often ends up happening with these kids is like any sense of demand kind of triggers that fight flight or freeze and so then they they have a hard time then regulating to get through that. Now I've lost the question. Can you repeat the question for me as I was giving the description what PDA is. It's just I'm trying to figure out a way to get my kid on board with wanting to work on this like what are suggestions for working with PDA kids? Okay, so, so what I would say is, You know, in general. Trying to really Well, pick your battles is one thing. And try to really find what to foster that autonomy, right? Like, okay, so this isn't working for you. Let's try to figure out what what will work instead. I know a lot of parents of PDA kids will talk about how like making things like kind of game like and novel can be a huge success where it doesn't feel like it's demand. There are some great resources on the PDA Society website that ask us to, you know, or that provide some ideas for how to communicate with kids because one of the things that really is influenced is when they they have the opportunity to like Use humor. You know, or, or just aren't feeling threatened by it. Like that's kind of the best way to do it, but I would definitely recommend that website. They have a lot of really good resources there. And so yeah, I would definitely check it out. Alright, hi Emily. I'm gonna jump in and give you a little break. So great, we have a few more questions. One of the ones I'm really interested in to hear what your perspective is. Somebody writes, I have a brilliant bright to E 9 year old with ADHD. What strategies do you suggest to address impulsivity and stems like coming and singing that are disruptive in a classroom setting? And I think there's more generally we hear this a lot at schools, you know, something that regulates one student will dysregulate another and and how can How can we make that work? Yeah. Oh yeah, I get it. No, I mean, you know, I love it. I love the idea that in a utopian society we can. Everyone can have all of their stems and sensory needs met, but in reality like I mean we have that like I am very I am very sensory avoidant. I like all of the sounds. Listen, I will tell you if anyone has, okay, I just did see this, this is why I don't watch the check because I get so distracted with things. The PDA website is the PDA Society. And if you just google PDA society, you'll find it. As far as sensory needs, I'm closing the chat now. I did put the link back in there for the drawing I'm going to give it away one of the raising twice exceptional kids book. So like if you have any ideas about how to get your kids to use their headphones or earbuds on their phones because my kids play their volume of their phone like just beneath the threshold of when you can actually hear it and it drives me bonkers. I hear all of the things. I'm very also Very smell avoidant. My 15 year old has discovered Cologne. Hmm, I'm really hoping that that We grow out of that phase real quickly. But the point is like going back to your question about the mouth noises and different things. So an accommodation, you just have to figure out like what's what's the accommodation balance right so on the one hand if it's one kid that's really being bothered maybe it would be easiest to give them some headphones, right, or some earbuds where they can listen to something else if they're distracted by some of those noises. Sometimes with kids I find that like giving them an accommodation where they can use gum can be helpful. But that is one of the hardest ones. Perhaps the accommodation is having a space where they can go where it's maybe not, you know, not as noticeable if they're making some of those noises, a special space in the classroom. But the biggest thing with sensory stems is it's very difficult to eliminate them. It's better to try to substitute something else in. I saw something talking about someone talking about the balancing on the back of the chair. That is definitely a stem. They're stimulating that vestibular sense where they want to balance there and they have to kind of do this. But there are a ton of different things like wobble chairs, t chairs, like there's lots of resources out there that stimulate that in a much safer way. But I think, you know, the When we ask people to, when we ask people to try to just suppress those stems, basically the amount of energy that goes into just trying to suppress it. It's just really not, it's really hard to make that. It like the you have to weigh out the benefits and the drawbacks and for in a lot of times like it's like if your kids trying to work and they hum while they work. Are they gonna be able to work if they're not humming? You know, it's it's hard to do that so is there something else that they could do that would that would fulfill that need without causing the destruction to others. Great, thank you. Okay, so we have another question that says I have an 11 year old to a daughter can you talk about hitting my daughter hits me when she's just regulated. Yeah, you know, I think Well, I mean that's one of those kind of non-negotiables, like as much as possible, right? Like, I, you know, helping kids realize like, You know, it, I guess my question would be, is that a sensory thing? Like are they looking for that that pressure and is there some other way that they could fulfill that? If it's a way that they're communicating their anger you know just really kind of trying to really express how you know, that they need to find a different way to do that. My thought would be to really try to disengage in that moment when they're doing that. Try not to. Try not to escalate this situation, but I wouldn't like try to I wouldn't try to appease the situation either. It's, it is, it is really hard with kids who that's when they get to that point where they have that physical aggression. I wish there was an easy solution for that and I think it's just one of those things where they really have to try to Probably the best way is the more that you can get it so that they're not getting to that point. Not that you have to get on there, but that they can build that skill. You know and they'll eventually mature out of that but it's it's it is Tricky. Alright, and the next one is. My 8 year old, to me boy has chuckled generalizing he thinks he learns so he learns ways to help with his emotions in one situation but he can't seem to remember to use them in other similar situations. Is there a good way to help? Make the connection that the strategies we learn can be used in more broad situations. Okay. Once you have those skills in some situations, hopefully then it shouldn't be too much of a leap, even if they need a little bit of a bridge. To go from one conversation to, you know, or one situation to the next. Hopefully you can have a quick conversation say, hey, let's think about this. This works in this situation. How could we, how could we apply it in this other situation as well? And I think that that is something that will will help. You know, get to that point where they really are are seeing some of that. Generalizing. You know, I think maybe also as they're building that skill, maybe when you notice that they're building that skill, having a proactive conversation saying, hey, this really works in this situation. Can we can we predict what other situations it might work in to kind of do it a little bit ahead and see if that can be helpful for them as well. Right, and another question about kids who are homeschooling. How do you teach this to kids who are home schooling? Do you set aside time and and do explicit teaching. You could. You could do it. I mean, you definitely could. You could do it just like I said, like in conversations, whatever works for your kid. If your kid benefits from explicit instruction, then I would definitely lay it out in a very logical way. And say, you know, let's come up with some strategies for each of these. If you want to just focus on one first and then kind of move on to another, but you know be you could be really flexible with it but the whole The hope of it is being able to then have some again, some shared language and some, and some opportunities to kind of just really intentionally reflect and develop some plans for everything. One question that I thought was very interesting because this came up a lot when my kid was little with different behavioral techniques. How do you tell the difference between dysregulation and attention seeking behavior? Yes. I don't know that there's a difference. Would say that they're probably one in the same and I guess my thought about attention seeking behavior is like When I think of attention seeking. I guess my thought is like where is that need coming from? Is it coming from a place of insecurity? Is it coming from a place of? Needing validation or needing recognition. You know, I know that this isn't maybe necessarily what that question was directly asking about, but a lot of times when I think of like kids who self-injure, right? And people say, oh, well, it's just attention seeking. And I'm like, well, then let's give them attention, right? Like, what's the harm in really in fulfilling that need? And I guess my thought about it is like If they are dysregulated and but it is attention seeking. How do you then Develop a plan to to meet that need in a way that is not disruptive. Right. So like I've had kids who have a lot of dysregulation and it looks like attention seeking where they're just asking for reassurance, asking for reassurance, trying, you know, whatever it is that they're really struggling with. And sometimes it's like, okay, we're gonna set aside this amount of time. And this is the time where you're gonna tell me about all of the things that are stressing you out, right? And then, but it's like you have this amount of time and then after that amount of time we're done we're gonna be done talking about it you know if we come up with a solution great if not I will listen to you that is your that is your time. And that can be something that can kind of help. Help put that into perspective for kids. But I don't know that it really, I don't know if it always matters if it's if it's a emotional deregulation or if it's attention seeking behavior because Either way. They need some support in that moment, whatever that might be. Alright, and what about this question? Our moments of executive dysfunction counted as emotional dysregulation. Hmm. So we just did an interesting podcast episode about this. With Danny Donovan, where we specifically talked about the overlap between emotional regulation and executive functioning is very hard to have executive functioning skills in place if you are emotionally dysregulated and if you are struggling with executive functioning skills you are probably emotionally dysregulated. So it's kind of this overlap of like cycle with both of those things that kind of get wrapped up together. I think in general, I, you know, if you're talking about like which came first the chicken or the egg, I think in general emotional regulation kind of is the foundational piece if you're you know as far as then developing. Developing executive functioning skills and being able to implement executive functioning skills. But it is You know, I think. I think it's very hard to sort out. Which you know when you're having that executive dysfunction. There's almost always an emotional dysregulation piece that's maybe underneath it. And this is most likely our last question. Maybe we can stick in one more, but my son is 16 autistic demand of and can explode violently at times. He's resistant to therapy. Do you have a recommendation for a book or video series to help him take ownership of anger management and emotional regulation. Hmm He's a language or intellectual disability. He is too E as you described today. One thing I would suggest as far as the therapy piece goes, even though he's kind of resistant to it, is if you can find, there are some resources out there and I don't know them off the top of my head. But there are some PDA friendly like therapist directories. I think maybe PDA North America maybe has one. If I recall. But, but if you can find at the therapist who's familiar with that type of demand avoidance, they may have some strategies to kind of get them engaged with some therapy. Like I've had kids before who it's like, I started off just by writing emails back and forth, you know, it was like very, very non stressful, not a lot of, you know, no real demand, just kind of, you know. Putting some things back and forth. And then you kind of build up from there. So, so that might be one thing. As far as books. I don't know that I know any off the top of my head. I'm sure that there are some out there. I don't know if you've ever heard of the term strewing specifically, which is kind of, you know, this term that they've come up with in the PDA community. But basically like if you could find a book something or something like that you basically leave things around the house so it's not like hey you need to read this book because then that can elicit that demand response. It's like, oh, I'm just gonna kind of have this here in this area. And, you know, maybe it's something that if you, you know, maybe they'll see it and they'll kind of pick it up. I'll try to think on that. And if I can come up with anything, maybe you guys can email it out. I like I said, I just don't know anything off the top of my head. So I do, I do have, I don't know if we time, but well, I know we have time for this, but I don't know if we have time for another question or not, but this is our drawing connect. Let me go ahead and do this real quick. Yes. Alright, the big winner is Sure, yes. I do love the wheel of names. It sinks with my Google. Yeah. I love this! All right, more a Jansen, you're the big winner. And so, keep an eye out. I will send you an email, tomorrow or if not tomorrow than Monday and I'll get your address and everything and we will get the book sent out to you. So awesome, thank you. For letting me do that little piece there. That's so fun. Congratulations, Okay, I'm gonna end it because it's we have 1 min. I'll end it with just someone asked. How do you know when it's time to get professional help? So you do all these techniques. How do you know where that line is? Yeah. I'm writing now Mora's name, so I don't. So I don't forget who it was. Okay. Yeah, so finding professional help. Anytime your kids are talking about self injury. You know, death and dying. You know, suicidal ideation, obviously that's kind of a giveaway. If it's gotten to the point where it is a disruption on a daily basis or even a few times a week. I would try to find somebody who can help. It doesn't ever hurt to just have somebody That is is a resource and is available. And that you can develop a relationship with. And so then they're there if you need them in the future. So yeah, I would. But any time that you notice that increase in irritability that I've mentioned at the beginning of the presentation, that's another one. But lots of lots of those pieces. And if you just feel like you're in too deep and you're not making any progress. I mean, there's there's a lot of people out there who could who could help with all of those things which I think would be useful. Yeah Emily, thank you so much. I literally think I wrote 20 pages of notes. I love all your practical strategies. I wanna try them with my kids. We can't thank you enough and thank you everyone who joined tonight. We will be sending the slides, the recording and everything so you can all watch it again. Awesome. Thank you so much for having me. Good night, everyone. Thank you. I love the spinny wheel thing. We should use that. That was so fun. Yeah. Can you guys hear me now? Yes. Yeah, now, now, now that we don't need to, now you can talk. Well, I figured it out about 5 min. I mean, nothing I did. It just for some reason my AirPods would not connect tonight. That's frustrating Very frustrating. Alright, shall we end? Yeah, can I? Good morning. RightBye

Need a holiday gift or some winter break reading? Check out this list of books featuring neurodivergent characters, organized by grade. Elementary Just Ask: Be Different. Be Brave. Be You. by Sonia Sotomayor and Rafael Lopez (differences) The World Needs Who You Were Made to Be by Joanna Gaines (differences) The Invisible Boy by Trudy Ludwig (feeling invisible) The Girl Who Thought In Pictures: The Story of Temple Grandin by Julia Finley Mosca (autism) You’re So Clumsy Charley by Jane Binnion (neurodiversity, dyspraxia) My Brother Charlie by Holly Robinson Peete (autism) The Girl Who Heard Colors by Marie Harris (synesthesia) Thank you, Mr. Falker by Patricia Palacco (dyslexia) Aaron Slater, Illustrator by Andrea Beaty (dyslexia) All Dogs Have ADHD by Kathy Hoopman (ADHD) Middle grades Forget Me Not by Ellie Terry (girl Tourette) Stanley Will Probably Be Fine by Sally J. Pla (boy anxiety) Can You See Me? By Libby Scott and Rebecca Westcott (girl autism) Mockingbird by Kathryn Erskine (girl aspergers) Fish in a Tree by Lynda Mullaly Hunt (girl dyslexia) Ungifted by Gordon Korman (ADHD, boy) Out of My Mind by Sharon Draper (Cerebral palsy/non-speaking, girl) Mango Shaped Space by Wendy Mass (girl, synesthesia) Mighty Jack by Ben Hatke (boy, autistic sibling) High school The Spectrum Girl's Survival Guide: How to Grow Up Awesome and Autistic by Siena Castellon (founder of ND week) The 57 Bus by Dashka Slater (nonbinary, autism) The State of Grace by Rachael Lucas (girl, autism) Challenger Deep by Neal Shusterman (boy, mental health/anxiety/depression) Curious Incident of the Dog in the Nighttime ( ASD boy) Marcelo in the Real World - Francisco W. Stork (ASD boy) 10 Things I Can See From Here - Carrie Mac (Anxiety girl) Kat and Meg Conquer the World - Anna Priemaza (ADHD, Anxiety, girls) The Love Letters Of Abelard And Lily - Laura Creedle (ADHD, girl) A Dragonbird in the Fern - Laura Rueckert (dyslexia, girl, fantasy) Underdogs - Chris Bonnello (ND, dystopia) Adults Being Twice Exceptional by Melanie Hayes Normal Sucks by Jonathan Mooney The Dyslexic Advantage by Brock Eide and Fernette Eide Divergent Mind by Jenara Nerenberg Differently Wired by Deborah Reber Originals by Adam Grant Uniquely Human: A Different Way of Seeing Autism by Barry Prizant The Journal of Best Practices: A Memoir of Marriage, Asperger Syndrome, and One Man’s Quest To Be a Better Husband By David Finch My Thirteenth Winter: A Memoir By Samantha Abeel (Dysgraphia, girl) The Rosie Project by Graeme Simison (Fiction, man, autism, a little trite, but quite charming) Raising Twice-Exceptional Children: A Handbook for Parents of Neurodivergent Gifted Kids by Emily Kircher-Morris --- Additions from our community: Elementary: Hey Warrior by Karen Young Elementary: Fifty-Four Things Wrong with Gwendolyn Rogers by Caela Carter Elementary: Twice Exceptional Number One Boy by Brooke Shapiro Elementary: A Friend for Henry by Jenn Bailey Elementary: A Boy Called Bat by Elan K. Arnold Middle / High School: The Awesome Autistic Go-To Guide: A Practical Handbook for Autistic Teens and Tweens by Yenn Purkis and Tanya Masterman High School / Adult: Taking Flight: College for Students with Disabilities, Diverse Learners and Their Families by Perry LaRoque High School / Adult: Sharing the Transition to College: Words of Advice for Diverse Learners and Their Families by Jennifer Sullivan Adults: A Boy Made of Blocks by Keith Stuart Adults: ADHD is Awesome by Penn and Kim Holderness (Audio book recommended) Adults: We're Not Broken: Changing the Autism Conversation by Eric Garcia Adults: How to ADHD: An Insider's Guide to Working with Your Brain by Jessica McCabe Adults: Ungifted by Scott Barry Kaufman Adults: To Be Gifted and Learning Disabled: Strength-Based Strategies for Helping Twice-Exceptional Students With LD, ADHD, ASD, and More by Susan M. Baum Ph.D., Robin Schader Ph.D., Steven V. Owen Ph.D. Adults: Is This Autism?: A Guide for Clinicians and Everyone Else by Donna Henderson, Sarah Wayland, Jamell White

Last updated 11/20/2025 Fall 2025 - We are excited to announce that our new 2e Support Directory is now live! Visit our EXPERTS & RESOURCES page to find experts and resources beyond REEL for families navigating twice-exceptionality, from diagnosis to thriving. https://www.reel2e.org/parents/parent-resource-lists

Short answer: Yes, it’s possible. Our son is living proof of this every single day. ADHD AND Gifted When our son was in preschool, he could name every planet in the solar system and share obscure facts about each one, in both English and his second language, which we didn’t even speak at home. He knew everything about the Titanic and spent hours building “inventions” out of cardboard boxes: a snack machine that made you “work out” before dispensing treats, a picture that would talk to you as you walked by. His imagination seemed limitless. Learning about ADHD But as he grew older, school began to tell a different story. Teachers described him as bright but distracted . Homework that once sparked curiosity now led to frustration. We could see both his brilliance and his struggle, yet it felt like the world only ever saw one side at a time. At first, we believed the school’s narrative that something needed to be “fixed.” They focused on what he couldn’t do: sit still, finish worksheets, stay organized, let other kids speak in class. We were sent home with suggestions and strategies to help him “focus better” and be “less disruptive.” At night, we searched for remedies for what everyone called his “inability to sit still.” Eventually, we had him evaluated and learned he had ADHD. It was both a relief and a heartbreak, a relief to have an explanation, and a heartbreak because the conversation quickly turned to deficits, not strengths. While we spent two years trying to find the right medication and navigating classroom expectations, another ache was growing: our son was also struggling socially . Birthday parties became painful reminders of how “different” he felt. Group play didn’t come naturally; his intensity and literal thinking sometimes pushed peers away. He wanted friends desperately but didn’t always know how to join in. Watching such a kind, curious child struggle to connect was, at times, harder than any academic challenge. We kept wondering what we were missing. How could someone so empathetic, so aware of others’ feelings, have such a hard time fitting in? Why did environments that should have been nurturing leave him anxious and withdrawn? Then, on a Cub Scout camping trip, I found myself venting to another parent.I had said, “He’s so smart, but something doesn’t make sense. He can talk about galaxies for hours but can’t sit down to write a 10-minute paragraph on what he did, or memorize multiplication tables. How is that possible?”The parent replied, “You should get a full neuropsych evaluation. My kid was the same way, he also has ADHD, and that’s how we learned he was gifted, too. They can be both!” That one conversation changed everything. Discovering the term Twice-Exceptional (2e) The neuropsych assessment  revealed that our son wasn’t just struggling, he was also soaring. His cognitive profile showed both exceptional strengths and real challenges. For the first time, the contradictions made sense. We learned a new term: twice-exceptional , or 2e , a child who is both advanced in some areas and neurodivergent in others.  He was that asynchronous, “spiky” profile  teachers had struggled to understand: smart, but scattered. Insightful, but socially behind his peers. It was then that we began our journey to understand   everything we could about being 2e . Understanding this didn’t fix everything overnight though. It meant unlearning assumptions about effort, behavior, and what “success” looks like. It meant advocating for and finding environments where curiosity mattered as much as compliance and where social differences were met with understanding, not judgment. We began that search with REEL’s Bay Area 2e school list  and surrounded him with the right therapists and supports  because no family makes this journey alone. Environment Matters As he transitioned from elementary to middle school, we made every effort to set him up for success. His new school focuses on curiosity over compliance, hands-on learning over worksheets, and personal growth over perfection. He went from being described as “too much for his classmates” to being called “a confident, happy, future leader at our school.” Both quotes from teachers at his old and new schools show just how profoundly the right environment matters. Now, our son gets invited to represent his school on shadow days and speak on school panels. He’s thriving in a place that sees him for who he is. The transformation wasn’t instant and it’s still ongoing, but it is real. Along this journey, we realized his struggles actually helped him define and build up his character. He showed us what resilience truly looks like. When a coach once said he “didn’t have the instincts for competitive play,” he practiced harder. When homework felt overwhelming, he found strategies that worked for his  brain. When he was nervous to attend overnight space camp across the country, he reminded us  he was ready. Each experience, in the classroom, outdoors, or under the stars, has shaped him into a learner who leads with curiosity, courage, and self-understanding. And it’s shaped us into parents who listen more, worry less, and trust the long view. The journey isn’t linear, and we’re still on it. But we know this to be true: our 2e journey isn’t about fixing our son who happens to be really smart with ADHD. It’s about seeing him clearly, his spark, his struggles, his drive to understand the world, and helping others see him too, including himself. That’s why I’m sharing our story with the REEL community. Because every child deserves to be seen for their whole story , not just the parts that fit easily into boxes. And because behind every 2e child is a family on a journey: one filled with challenge, hope, and moments of wonder that remind us why we keep building bridges, one understanding at a time. -A REEL Parent

REEL's community consistently voted self-regulation as a top topic of interest. Self-regulation was a complex concept that was often referred to in discussions about how to manage emotions, behaviors, and reactions to various stimuli that could lead to a stress response. 2E children’s (and 2E adults’!) experience of self-regulation was often more complex and unique compared to their neurotypical peers. Attendees joined Teresa Nair, REEL's Parent Community Program Manager and expert, at this lunchtime event to explore: - What is Self-Regulation? - A 3-Step Pathway to Better Regulation Management - The Role of Co-Regulation - Examples and Scenarios You can read more about Self Regulation in this article series . Transcript below Yael Valek:  Welcome, everyone, to REEL Self-Regulation Lunchtime Chat with Teresa Nair. We do have a Spanish translation going in another channel, so you can access that at the bottom of your Zoom screen. And Callie will write that in Spanish in the chat. So, in case you're not familiar with REEL, we are a local nonprofit in Silicon Valley trying to help twice-exceptional students thrive in school by raising parent awareness through events such as this, and educator awareness as well, to address the needs of 2E learners successfully. So what is 2E? This is a definition that we often use from Bridges, which is students that have both distinguishing strengths, high abilities, or potential in one or more areas, and complex challenges such as autism, ADHD, dyslexia, anxiety, and others at the same time. And it's critical to address both the strengths and the challenges simultaneously—not only the yellow or the blue, but the green. And so it makes these students complex to address their needs in the classroom, and that's why REEL exists. REEL provides parent services, almost all of them are free, such as the Expert Speaker Series like you're attending today, a bi-monthly online parent support group, a Google group with hundreds of parents that ask and answer each other's questions and share resources. A lot of online resources, such as our IEP guide, a schools list and school guidance, and parent toolkits that I'll show you in one moment. We also have small paid facilitated groups run by Teresa, and we do one-on-one consultations on a variety of topics as well, if you need to dive more in depth. The parent toolkits are something relatively new on our site. You can download a kit on any subject. These are all free. Do you need to know how to speak to your school more? Do you need to know how to lean into your child's strengths? We have toolkits on about 10 different topics. The material covered in this guide is applicable everywhere. REEL a We also have an IEP guide, which is 46 pages, with every information you could want to know about getting an IEP for twice-exceptional learners. This is the California Bay Area edition, but we say 90–95% of tlso provides custom professional development resources and talks and an educator newsletter. You can bring REEL to your school to do a learning difference simulation, or to discuss our Educator Dear REEL model, how developing connection, embracing flexibility, attending to strengths, and reframing behaviors can help 2E and neurodivergent learners. Just so you know, most of these events have passed and are now recordings on our YouTube channel, but you can still sign up for our Behind the Mask: Understanding Anxiety, Perfectionism, and Masking in 2E Kids  on November 12th, and our November 6th Parent Support Group on our site. You can join REEL on our Google group, you can follow us on a variety of socials, and watch all our past events on our YouTube channel. And without further ado, I will stop sharing and introduce Teresa. Callie, if you want to… I don't know if you want to pin Teresa? Teresa Nyer:  Thanks, Yael! It's a pleasure to be here. I'm excited to have this opportunity also. So I'm going to put my slides up real quick. Give me a thumbs up if you can see my slide deck. Perfect. Welcome! I'm excited to be here today to talk about self-regulation through the twice-exceptional lens. What I think is important to note, just from the get-go, it's a complex idea with a lot of different layers, and then you add our twice-exceptional kids on top of it, and even more so. So, let's take this time to share some thoughts together, introduce some concepts, and hopefully get a little bit more of an understanding of self-regulation through the twice-exceptional lens. So, once again, my name is Teresa Nyer. I am the REAL Parent Community Services and Program Manager, and mother, teacher, neurodivergent myself, and I joke that I'm a 2E wannabe, because, you know, back in the 80s and 90s, we didn't have that really cool term, but I'd take it. And so, as I think my kids' journey has led me to believe, twice exceptionality—that's something I'd like to be. So, I joke that I'm a 2E wannabe. So, what is today about? Well, first, let's welcome everybody. Thank you for taking this time in your afternoon to be with us. It's really exciting to see how much interest we have. So what I'm going to do is just go over why this topic matters. We'll go into a little bit about what is self-regulation, touch on what I call the three-step pathway, and then the importance of co-regulation. So, that one is going to be a big one. Real-life scenarios, and then a short Q&A. So, if you do have questions or something comes up during the chat, feel free—or during the talk—feel free to put it in the chat. I've got both Kelly and Yael from my team keeping their eyes on that. They'll be putting links in there too, so keep the chat busy. Tell me who you guys are, what you're interested in knowing, hearing, or understanding a little bit more about. So, as we go further, keep in mind this is about compassion, curiosity, and community. One of the biggest things that I love about REAL is our community. So, thank you for being a part of that today, and hopefully, thank you for continuing to be a part of that as we go forward on this exciting journey. So why does self-regulation matter in a twice-exceptional lens? First and foremost, it's a topic that many of you want to know more about. When we do our community surveys and we ask, “What topics are you interested in? What do you want to know more about?”—literally 75% of the people who take the survey want to know more about self-regulation. They want some more insight and understanding. That's a really big number for our community. But it's happened year after year. So that's why we always try and make space and room for these conversations about self-regulation, the concepts and ideas behind it. Recently, we did a four-part facilitated small group discussion. That's where a lot of this material will come from. I had a group of eight parents and caregivers, and we spent four weeks together walking through ideas such as self-regulation. Other topics are executive functioning—we have another motivation group coming up. So some of these ideas that you're going to see in here are topics and experiences that parents and I have shared through these discussions, and also many years of working with kiddos. Why self-regulation and twice exceptionality? Well, many twice-exceptional kids and parents feel deeply, right? This is just something that we see, and that can lead to—whether it is deeply felt emotions around excitement, or frustration, or injustice, or curiosity—here they are, diving in and really putting a lot of energy towards this experience. Experience of frustration, experience of injustice, experience of curiosity. Our kids come at it with an intensity. That intensity is part of their gift. So without these regulation tools, it can lead to misdirection of where they're putting that energy. Instead of in their dance routine, instead of in their chemical equations or programming languages, they're misdirected, and they're putting way too much energy into their frustration, or way too much energy towards this injustice instead of solving the injustice. So we're gonna learn some tools so that we don't run into exhaustion, shutdown, and misunderstandings—because this intensity is magnificent. So let's make sure that we can help with the right regulation tools to show up as the child that they want to be, that we know that they can be. Another good thing I want you guys to keep in mind is you're already doing self-regulation, right? So this is just a way of—how can we be more intentional about applying it to our kids? Because, like Dr. Ross Greene says, “Kids do well if they can.” So what can we do to support that, so that they can do well? So, another good thing I want you to keep in mind is that the brain is developing—and with that, so are the skills. I use this analogy quite a bit: it’s the idea that there is always a lion in the room with our children. So if we take the idea of a dyslexic, twice-exceptional student, they may be delightfully involved in the discussion about characters and loving the idea of talking about who’s doing what and why. The classroom is very exciting for them because they’re having this great discussion. Their vocabulary is off the charts as they dive into these concepts verbally and just really enjoy it. But in the back of their mind, there is a lion there. There is this anxiety, this tension of knowing that it’s possible, very soon, that what they can’t do well is going to jump out in the middle of their enjoyable time. They’re having this great time, but maybe they’re going to have to write about it. Maybe they’re going to have to be in a small group and read paragraphs out loud to each other. Or maybe they’re going to have to share their writing. So there are so many other things that can be interplaying at the exact same time—feeling this wonderful joy of this gifted brain, but then knowing that at any moment, they could be called on, which could bring shame and embarrassment and anxiety. So with that becomes a challenge for regulating. How do we regulate those high highs? What is self-regulation? In our group, we came at it from a lot of different ways. If you Google self-regulation, you’re going to get hundreds, if not thousands, of definitions. So what I did is I took some of the ones that I felt really helped us move toward a healthy framework for our twice-exceptional students. We can start with something like: self-regulation is the ability to understand behavior, and your reactions and your feelings, and things like that. That’s probably a familiar one from Raising Children Australia. Then we have our go-tos, like Dr. Stuart Shanker and his Self-Reg framework. He describes self-regulation in a lot of different ways. He’s got books on it, he’s got workshops on it, he uses five domains. What’s nice about Dr. Stuart Shanker is I love the fact that he oftentimes will say the ability to self-regulate only begins in a child around the age of seven. Before that, they don’t even have the cognitive ability necessary to start the process of learning how to self-regulate. So at the age of seven is when you can start to expect maybe some self-regulation starting to come online cognitively. Let’s pause there. Once again, come back and experience this through our twice-exceptional kids. David Yun recently put out some information on research that shows gifted children stay in the “sponge phase” of their synaptical exuberance in their brains sometimes two to three years longer than their neurotypical peers. So a gifted brain doesn’t even begin to prune the pathways to the prefrontal cortex—it’s all connected, sometimes for three to four years. ADHD brains are also lagging three to four years, possibly behind their neurotypical peers when it comes to a lot of this work. Dr. Stuart Shanker starts with it. There are other organizations such as Autism Level Up, who also talk about self-regulation, but they don’t use that word. For them, they use it in the framework of energy regulation. So I kind of take all of this into consideration because we have information that comes to us—but does it really apply to us, and how can we make it apply? Because there will be this constant interplay between our children’s struggles and their strengths at the same time. So what is that doing to the regulation, the dysregulation? How does our child show up as their best self? As Dr. Stuart Shanker says, he wants children to thrive, not just survive. So what does that mean for our twice-exceptional kiddos? So, as I mentioned, we kind of put this into a way to streamline the complexity of it all. These are simple three steps—but they’re actually a little bit more complex. Hang in there with me, because what I want to do is say: let’s look at what happens when the world is both too easy and too challenging at the same time. How do we begin to even approach that? Step one is going to be to identify indicators. I recommend that parents—even in my discussion group, we talk a lot about this—start with yourself. Use yourself, maybe, as the first experience of walking through this three-step pathway. Because indicators can be somewhat hidden. But if we’re listening to ourselves, if we’re paying attention, indicators start to show up. Well, what’s an indicator? Indicators are when you start to notice that this behavior is trying to tell me something. There’s a misalignment between what’s going on and what the child is experiencing. It can be a misalignment in a lot of different ways. But acknowledging that behaviors are communication—what is being indicated during this particular time? We see things starting to wobble the wrong way, let’s say. Common 2E indicators are often behavioral, emotional, or physical. Examples of that can be behavioral outbursts or irritability. Physical could be headaches, stomachaches—things that are indicating to us that we need to look a little bit deeper into starting to regulate. A good example is an after-school meltdown. Before the meltdown happens, most likely there are some indicators that are stepping up into this purview. It might be that the child is irritable and snapping in the back, and all of a sudden, it just starts to go downhill quickly from there. What we’re going to want to do is look at this as data—not defiance. This is information. This is actually good information that’s going to help us as we take these steps to realize it’s not about defiance. We’re actually gathering information here so that we can start to help our child show up as the person they want to be. Where their energy is going is where they want to direct it. So: data, not defiance. That brings us to the second step. First, we’re looking for indicators—whether it’s indicators in ourselves (“Gosh, my heart is pounding, what’s going on here?”). That’s the second step: curiosity. What’s going on here? And we want to shift it from right or wrong, good or bad, into curiosity. What’s happening? There’s also another phrase that’s used: “Why now?” Like, what’s happening? Why now? Curiosity—not “That behavior is wrong,” or “I don’t want you to do that,” or “That’s not good.” It’s more like, hmm… we’ve got some data here. Why? What is going on that’s showing us indicators of stress, that’s showing us indicators of dysregulation? That curiosity is going to be our second step. It’s going to take us a little bit further into the experience. This is where reflective questions come into play. Asking questions like “What’s happening?” or “Why now?” is just the start. But are these questions going to help us identify some of the triggers? We might need to do a little bit more detective work. So: when did this start? Dr. Shanker has the five domains that I mentioned, and there’s a worksheet. We created a 20-some-page self-regulation document, and within there, there’s a link to the domains. I encourage that throughout this process, you involve your kids—because when they’re not dysregulated, when they’re in a state where they can have these conversations, you’re going to be able to get a lot from them. Was it something that emotionally occurred? Cognitively? Is it that, once again, this is way too easy while it’s being way too challenging? Is there something physical? Are there fine motor issues going on when your child already struggles with that? Keeping in mind, often as we ask these questions and we’re getting curious—not only knowing ourselves if we’re doing this reflection step, these three steps for ourselves—but also as we get to lean into supporting our children. Curiosity and asking questions. So, examples of some of what might be the “why now” or “what’s happening” can be what we call hidden drivers. There could be hunger going on. This is actually not my child extremely upset about traffic—I don’t know, actually they’re hungry. Could we look at this and try the HALT tool? Can you ask: Is it Hunger? Is it Anger? Are they Lonely? Thirsty? Tired? So going through some of these questions, digging a little bit deeper, figuring out what’s going on and why now. So that’s the second step. You’ve got indicators, and now you’re curious as to why now. Why are these showing up now? Another thing that I like to talk about is that there are some common 2E triggers, and I’d be curious if you guys have some of your own. So go ahead and put in the chat—do you know that there are some common triggers in your child, in your home, for yourself even too? So one of my kiddos is extremely sensitive to wind. Like, who knows, but for some reason, wind makes them very angry. So it’s one of those things that I’ll be like, “I see that this conversation is getting really tense, what’s going on?” Then I might notice we were sitting outside, and they’re cringing because the wind is blowing at them too hard. Showers can be another really big moment of “something’s going on here.” Like, I don’t know that this is necessarily about the shower. Is this about the shower? Is it about the sounds, the water temperatures? Showers have a lot—there’s a lot going on with showers. So what’s happening? What are the indicators? My child knows that shower time is coming up. All of a sudden, they’re starting to get irritable. It’s starting to escalate. Why? Is it the shower? What’s going on there? Sounds can be another one. What’s happening? Well, there’s a lot of background noise, or they’re sitting next to grandpa who eats with his mouth open. That could also be something that just sends self-regulation out the window. And frustration—when tasks are too easy and too difficult at the same time. I think we’ve seen our kids’ experiences. How do we help them through that? How do we help them show up in the best ways that we can? Boredom can also be another one. Why now? Well, maybe because they’re bored, and we might need to look a little bit more into that. So ask questions. Go through some of the hidden drivers that you know your child has, or start to be that detective—looking at what could be hidden here that I don’t know, that has thrown my child’s self-regulation abilities out the window. Hungry, angry, lonely, tired—those kinds of things. And then we’ll go into the third step. So we have identified that there are indicators of stress, there are indicators of a misalignment of expectations or experiences for that situation or where the energy is being placed. Two, we got curious and we started to ask, “What’s happening?” And we come up with a couple different things like, “Okay, we know it’s X, Y, and Z—that’s what’s happening right now.” Then we have our third step: let’s mitigate with the three R’s. The pathway will take us to the idea of the first R: Reduce. Can we remove any unnecessary stressors? Is that a possibility—to reduce some of these triggers or some of the things that are causing the regulation and the energy to go in a direction that’s not as productive as our child wants it to be? They might want to be building Legos, but all of a sudden, they’ve gotten extremely frustrated. Self-regulation has gone out the window. Is there anything that we can remove so that they can get back to creating their amazing creations? So one of them is Remove—tags, noises, expectations. These things, once again, like I said, can get somewhat complicated, but they play a role. So if we simplify it by identifying, getting curious, and then working through mitigating it through reducing and removing… Restructuring. Can we adapt the environment? Can we change different timing? Can we use different tools? This is something—I had a conversation with some parents in our group. We were talking about… I think it was showers once again. One parent had a lot of dysregulation for their child around not wanting to get out of the shower. Another one had trouble getting into the shower. So even the same situation can mean different things. But finding out—well, timing actually worked for one of our parents, because they made the shower earlier in the evening so that the transition was easier. Because they looked forward to bedtime, or they looked forward to being able to read after the shower. So for them, it was changing the timing, kind of getting curious as to how can we restructure this misalignment so that the energy gets put in a healthy way toward what our child’s hoping to accomplish. So… Last one is a morning routine, but I want to think about it in the idea that this can be more complex. Let’s say you notice the indicators started right away—this was as soon as the kid got up. It was a challenge. You might be dealing with something more than shoes. What’s happening behind the scenes could be something more than just where you place your backpack or slip-on shoes. School refusal can be part of this role. Social dynamics at school might be happening. So really, as things get more complex and as your child really starts to expand in those different five domains, asking questions, sitting with them, exploring when things are okay, and talking about what works, what didn’t. “I noticed the other day it was a little bit smoother.” “Yeah, because I didn’t have P.E. I hate P.E.” “Blah blah blah. ”All of a sudden, you’re like—whoa, okay, detective work got me to P.E. What’s going on in P.E.? Trying to understand that it might not be right in front of you, but with that curiosity, hopefully you can get a little bit further into, “Okay, now we know it’s a bit deeper. How do we start to reduce, restructure, and restore?” Maybe they need a change in their schedule so that they have a study hall before P.E., because they’re already exhausted. They don’t want to go into a loud gym. Maybe they’re already shot before P.E. even starts. So strategizing once we know a little bit more. You’re going to have to do this over and over again, but hopefully the framework will get you through even the complex times. So, once again, we’re going to go through the three steps: Step 1 – Identify indicators. Step 2 – Get curious. Step 3 – Mitigate with the three R’s: Reduce, Remove, Restructure. Now, I want to talk a little bit about co-regulation. This is a big one. Co-regulation is the idea that we are not just helping our children regulate—we are regulating with them. This means our own nervous system, our own tone, our own body language, our own energy is part of the equation. If we’re dysregulated, it’s going to be very hard for our child to regulate. So we need to be mindful of how we show up. That doesn’t mean we have to be perfect. It means we need to be aware. Are we escalating the situation? Are we modeling calm? Are we providing a safe space for our child to land? Sometimes co-regulation means just sitting quietly next to your child. Sometimes it means narrating what’s happening: “I see you’re really frustrated right now. I’m here with you.” Sometimes it means breathing together, or offering a sensory tool, or just being present. This is especially important for our twice-exceptional kids, because they often feel misunderstood. They often feel like their reactions are “too much” or “wrong.” Co-regulation helps them feel seen, accepted, and supported. So, as we wrap up, I want to remind you that this is a journey. Self-regulation is not a switch—it’s a skill that develops over time, with support, with practice, and with compassion. You’re already doing so much. These tools are here to help you do it with more intention, more clarity, and more connection. Thank you for being here today, for showing up for your kids, and for being part of this community. We’ll move into Q&A now, so feel free to drop your questions in the chat. 💬 Q&A Highlights Q: Criticism seems to be a major trigger for my child—even when it’s gentle or constructive. Any suggestions? Teresa: If criticism is a known dysregulator, ask: is it necessary? Do they already know and are working on it? If so, repeating it may just escalate things. Try restructuring: offer space to explore or self-correct. For example, I’ve given students answer packets so they could check their own work privately. That way, they weren’t receiving correction from me—they were building confidence through self-reflection. Also, if criticism must happen, follow it with restoration—humor, quiet, or space. Q: When my child is in full meltdown mode, my presence seems to make it worse. How can I co-regulate when they just want me to leave? Teresa: If leaving works, honor that. But you might also try sitting quietly nearby—low to the ground, non-threatening, no eye contact. Just being present can signal safety. Co-regulation doesn’t always mean talking—it can mean simply staying close, showing you’re there, even when things are hard. Q: My child knows all the self-regulation tools in theory but can’t use them in practice. How do we make it instinctual? Teresa: First, consider their age. They may not yet have the cognitive development to apply these tools. Gifted kids can recite strategies but still lack the executive function to use them. Scaffold the process: support them step-by-step until they can do it independently. Practice tools when they’re calm—not just in crisis. Ask them what they need when things go well, so you’re prepared when things don’t. Q: My child shows gifted traits like perfectionism and fear of mistakes, but meltdowns only happen when they’re hungry. Is it hunger or deeper feelings? Teresa: It’s likely both. Hunger lowers their threshold for handling stress. The underlying perfectionism is still there—it just surfaces more easily when they’re depleted. Address both: meet physical needs and support emotional regulation. And yes, perfectionism deserves its own deep dive—it’s a big topic for 2E kids.

Myths About Twice-Exceptional Students  Because twice-exceptional   students have remarkable strengths, several myths about them have emerged: Myth #1 : “They’re just lazy or difficult.” Myths about Twice-Exceptional (2e) Students A student might passionately discuss World War II, reciting battles, facts, figures, and political nuances with the depth of a history professor. Yet when asked to write an essay on the topic, they produce work far below grade level. Teachers and parents may assume the student is lazy, but the reality is that real skill deficits are getting in the way. The student may struggle with executive functioning , making it difficult to organize thoughts logically. They could have dysgraphia, a learning disorder affecting writing ability, or slow processing speed , which makes completing tasks laborious and frustrating. These challenges, not lack of effort, often prevent the student from demonstrating what they truly know. Myth #2 : “They’ll be fine because they’re gifted.” As we saw in Myth #1, 2e learners may have exceptional strengths, but this does not guarantee academic success. They may struggle to complete schoolwork at the expected pace or may be unable to demonstrate their abilities because they are overcompensating for their challenges. In either case, they often work much harder than their peers yet still fall short of expectations. Combined with social, emotional, or sensory challenges, and the fact that many 2e students are overlooked for IEPs or other supports - this can lead to anxiety, depression, low self-esteem, and school avoidance. Without appropriate support, even highly gifted learners may struggle to thrive and reach their potential. Myth #3 : “We should focus all our time on a 2e learner’s weaknesses.” While it’s important to support 2e students in areas of difficulty, spending all their time on weaknesses can lead to burnout and low self-esteem. Imagine working eight hours a day on something you struggle with—and then having to continue at home! Now imagine if, instead, they had opportunities both during and after school to focus on their strengths. For example, if writing is a challenge but music is a strength, a student could compose a song to demonstrate what they learned in class, write a persuasive letter to a music producer, and perform in front of their peers. Focusing on strengths helps children build confidence, develop resilience, and create a foundation for tackling challenges more effectively. Myth #4 : “2e learners can’t get an IEP if they have good grades.” Good grades alone cannot be a basis for denying eligibility. However, a child's grades can be considered. IDEA calls this out specifically - each State must ensure that FAPE (Free Appropriate Public Education) is available to any individual child with a disability who needs special education and related services, even though the child has not failed or been retained in a course or grade, and is advancing from grade to grade. Under IDEA, any of the 13 identified “disabilities” may affect a student behaviorally, emotionally, academically, etc., and must be supported by the school. We see in 2e students quite often that good grades can include debilitating anxiety or depression. Children can keep it together at school, but they fall apart at home. IEPs can help address these types of outcomes by providing students with more support in the classroom. While grades should not preclude a student from an IEP, they can make it more challenging to receive one, often because educators may not see the struggle a student is having. If the struggle happens at home, educators may not be aware of the “spiky” profiles of 2e learners. Or, educators may be so focused on meeting the needs of students with lower “performance”, that those students who are “performing” close to or at grade level academically are missed. For more information, please see REEL’s A Parent's Guide to IEPs for Twice-Exceptional Students . Unsure if you have a twice-exceptional child or student? View our twice-exceptional (2e) checklist for signs.