VIDEO: Slow Processing Speed and the 2e Child
Updated: Sep 6
Dr Marcy Dann gave a talk for REEL about Slow Processing Speed and the 2e Child. Here is a writeup of the event.
Unraveling the Challenges and Triumphs of Slow Processing Speed in Education
In the realm of education, the concept of processing speed is often misunderstood, yet its impact can be profound, particularly for twice-exceptional learners. Marcy Dann, Ed.D., a seasoned educational therapist with over three decades of clinical practice, recently shared her insights on this topic in a compelling talk hosted by REEL. Dr. Dann's expertise shed light on the complexities of slow processing speed, offering valuable perspectives on how it affects learners and how educators and parents can support them.
Understanding Slow Processing Speed
Dr. Dann commenced her talk by defining slow processing speed as the delayed ability to take in information, process it, and respond effectively. Contrary to common misconceptions, slow processing speed does not correlate with lower intelligence. Instead, it reflects the unique cognitive profile of individuals who may perceive and interpret information at different rates. Understanding this is crucial, especially in educational settings where the pressure to perform quickly can overshadow the depth of a student's intelligence. Quick processing speed often leads to tasks feeling automatic, while slower speed may necessitate more effort. However, this disparity does not diminish the intellectual capabilities of individuals with slower processing speeds.
The Impact of Slow Processing Speed
The impact of slow processing speed extends beyond academic spaces. Parents and educators are familiar with its demands, particularly regarding writing tasks. Completing assignments within time constraints can pose significant challenges for students with slower processing speeds, often leading to emotional and behavioral issues.
Moreover, slow processing speed permeates daily routines at home, influencing activities such as morning and nighttime routines, as well as mealtimes. For example, a child may find it challenging to transition from one task to another, such as moving from getting dressed to brushing teeth, within the allotted time. As a result, the morning routine becomes stressful for both the child and the parents, leading to frustration and tension. The effects ripple into social interactions and emotional regulation capacity, highlighting the interconnectedness between cognitive abilities and emotional well-being.
Dr. Dann emphasized that by recognizing and understanding these challenges, parents and educators can implement strategies to support the child, such as providing extended time allowances, breaking down tasks into manageable steps, and offering verbal or visual prompts to facilitate transitions.
Recognizing Strengths and Talents
Dr. Dann underscored the importance of recognizing students' strengths and talents beyond their processing speed. She urged educators and parents to focus on nurturing these strengths and accommodating processing speed challenges to foster a positive learning environment by prioritizing understanding and confidence-building over the end-product.
Strengths-Based Approach: Dr. Dann shared examples of students who struggled with slow processing speed but excelled in creative arts. Despite facing challenges in tasks requiring rapid information processing, these students demonstrated remarkable creativity and originality in art-related projects. By acknowledging and nurturing these talents, educators were able to boost students' confidence and self-esteem, providing a counterbalance to the frustrations caused by processing speed challenges.
Accommodating Processing Speed Challenges:Â Another strategy involves implementing accommodations such as extended time allowances and alternative assessment formats for students who struggle with processing speed during timed tests and assignments. By tailoring assessments to accommodate students' processing speed while still assessing their understanding and knowledge, educators help mitigate the negative impact of processing speed challenges on academic performance.
Emphasis on Understanding and Growth:Â Dr. Dann emphasized the importance of prioritizing understanding and growth over the outcome of tasks. By celebrating students' growth and emphasizing the journey of learning rather than just the finished product, educators foster a positive learning environment where students feel valued and supported despite their processing speed challenges.
Confidence-Building Strategies:Â Lastly, Dr. Dann discussed various strategies for building confidence in students with slow processing speed. These include providing specific, affirming feedback that acknowledges students' efforts and progress rather than solely focusing on areas of difficulty. By praising students for their resilience, perseverance, and problem-solving skills, educators can instill confidence and self-belief in their ability to overcome challenges related to processing speed and succeed academically and emotionally.
Dr. Dann stressed that learning should not solely revolve around the end-product but should emphasize understanding and confidence-building. By prioritizing process over product, educators can empower students to embrace their unique cognitive profiles and thrive academically and emotionally.
Non-Negotiables for 2e Learners
Dr. Dann outlined several non-negotiable factors for all twice-exceptional (2e) learners, in particular those with slower processing speed, across different environments, emphasizing the importance of recognizing students' strengths and accommodating their unique cognitive profiles. Here's a breakdown of the non-negotiables for 2e learners discussed by Dr. Dann:
Intellectual Environment: Authentic and Meaningful Tasks
Dr. Dann stressed the significance of providing authentic and meaningful tasks with real-world applications for 2e learners. Engaging tasks that connect to students' interests and passions can increase their motivation and willingness to participate in learning activities.
Creative choice and options for accessing the curriculum are essential components of the intellectual environment. Students should have the opportunity to choose between different materials, formats, or approaches to learning, allowing them to engage with the content in ways that suit their learning preferences.
Social Environment: Sense of Belonging and Role Clarity
In social learning environments, such as classrooms or group settings, 2e learners need to feel a sense of belonging and understand their roles as social contributors.
Assigning specific roles within group activities, such as researcher, practical manager, or note-taker, can help students with diverse abilities contribute meaningfully to collaborative tasks. Establishing rapport between teachers and students fosters a supportive atmosphere where students feel respected and valued.
Emotional Environment: Psychological Safety and Acceptance of Mistakes
Creating a psychologically safe environment where students feel comfortable expressing joy in learning and making mistakes is crucial for emotional well-being.
Students with slow processing speed may feel sensitive about their learning pace and may compare themselves unfavorably to their peers. Cultivating a culture of acceptance and celebrating cognitive strengths while acknowledging challenge areas helps build students' self-confidence and resilience.
Physical Environment: Movement and Sensory Considerations
Allowing movement and considering sensory factors in the physical learning environment are non-negotiables for supporting 2e learners.
Students should have the freedom to move around and choose seating arrangements that best suit their needs. Paying attention to factors like posture, lighting, and potential distractions helps create an optimal learning environment for students with diverse processing speeds and sensory sensitivities.
Process-Oriented Approach: Prioritizing Process Over Product
Dr. Dann emphasized the importance of prioritizing process over product in educational settings. Instead of focusing solely on the result or grades, educators should value the learning process and provide opportunities for students to explore, experiment, and engage deeply with the content.
Task analysis should consider factors beyond speed and accuracy, considering students' individual strengths, interests, and learning styles. By nurturing and bolstering students' cognitive skills across various environments, educators can support their holistic development and academic success.
These non-negotiables underscore the importance of creating inclusive and supportive learning environments that cater to the diverse needs and abilities of 2e learners, allowing them to thrive academically, socially, and emotionally.
Strategies for Support
Dr. Dann offered a wealth of strategies for supporting students with slow processing speed. These strategies include:
Establishing Routines
Routines provide structure and predictability, which can help students with slow processing speed navigate daily tasks more efficiently. By establishing consistent routines, students know what to expect and can anticipate transitions, reducing anxiety and overwhelm. Tailoring routines to accommodate individual capabilities, whether through verbal or visual methods, can help students navigate daily tasks with greater ease.
Scaffolding Transitions
Students with slow processing speed may need more time to shift between activities. Soft transitions with verbal or visual prompts give students advance notice of upcoming changes, allowing them to mentally prepare and transition more smoothly. Providing clues and laying out materials in advance minimizes disruptions and helps maintain focus.
Checking in for Accurate Perceptions
Ensuring students understand instructions and expectations is crucial for success. Breaking down tasks into manageable steps helps students process information more effectively and prevents feelings of confusion or frustration. By reframing expectations within feasible timeframes, educators can set students up for success and build confidence.
Prompting for Task Initiation and Providing Feedback
Verbal prompts help students initiate tasks and stay on track, especially when processing speed challenges may cause delays in starting activities. Providing specific feedback acknowledges students' efforts and progress, reinforcing positive behaviors and boosting confidence. Encouraging self-advocacy empowers students to seek support when needed, fostering independence and self-awareness.
Language Use
Using clear and affirming language reinforces desired behaviors and builds students' self-esteem. By fostering trust and rapport with students, educators create a supportive environment where students feel comfortable expressing their needs and preferences. Promoting self-advocacy empowers students to communicate effectively and advocate for themselves in various situations.
Checking in with Students
Regularly engaging students in discussions about their learning experiences allows educators to understand their perspectives and challenges. By validating students' experiences and helping them recognize their strengths, educators can build positive relationships and tailor support to individual needs. This collaborative approach promotes self-awareness and resilience, empowering students to overcome obstacles and succeed.
Subject Area Accommodations
Accommodations such as alternative formats for assignments and extended time allowances ensure equitable access to learning opportunities for students with slow processing speed. Allowing students to demonstrate understanding in ways that suit their strengths promotes engagement and confidence. Providing choices in demonstrating learning outcomes fosters autonomy and encourages active participation in the learning process. Bulleted answers instead of full sentences, permitting dictation of answers, and providing fewer items or more whitespace for written responses are among the accommodations that can support students in demonstrating their learning outcomes effectively.
School Recommendations
Implementing transitions with extended time allowances and providing support for tasks in middle and high school ensures that students with slow processing speed have the necessary resources to succeed. Accommodations like extended time for standardized testing level the playing field, allowing students to demonstrate their knowledge and skills without time constraints. These recommendations promote inclusivity and support academic achievement for all students.
Can Slow Processing Speed Skills Improve?
One burning question addressed by Dr. Dann was whether slow processing speed skills can improve. With optimism, she affirmed that improvement is indeed possible through practice and support. By engaging students in activities that challenge their processing speed and offering targeted interventions, educators can help students develop strategies to navigate challenges more effectively over time.
Q&A
How do you differentiate between slow processing and dysgraphia? Dr. Dann explained that both involve difficulties with output tasks, with dysgraphia specifically concerning forming letters and numbers, while slow processing speed can affect various tasks. She highlighted the overlap between dysgraphia and slow processing speed, emphasizing the need for a thorough evaluation by a specialist to discern the specific issues.
Are there specific assessments families should ask for to sort out ADHD and its impact on processing speed? Dr. Dann suggested leaving the choice of assessments to the evaluator, advising families to share their observations with the evaluator to help determine which measures to use.
Can untreated ADHD affect processing speed, and can pharmacological treatment help improve it? Dr. Dann shared her observation that students with ADHD who received treatment, including medication, showed improvements in processing speed and oral fluency. However, she emphasized that improvement wasn't solely due to medication and recommended working with medical professionals to find the best approach.
How does having superior working memory but low processing speed impact a child, and what kind of support can be provided? Dr. Dann explained that having superior working memory but low processing speed can make it difficult for students to translate ideas into production. She discussed strategies to support such learners, emphasizing understanding their strengths and challenges and providing appropriate support.
Dr. Dann's talk offered a comprehensive exploration of slow processing speed in education. By shedding light on its complexities, providing practical strategies for support, and fostering a deeper understanding of its impact, she empowered educators, parents, and advocates to create inclusive environments where all students can thrive, regardless of their processing speed.
Read the transcript here
[0:00 — Intro — the "poppies" analogy & what processing speed is] Callie (likely): are you seeing anything now we see your screen that has slow processing speed in the two can you go to the poppy slide and see if we see it yay just do that just go through that okay okay
Marcy:Â these are my gorgeous slides I'm gonna start at the beginning just to show you how gorgeous these are as a reward for that kind of chaos um I was explaining that you know we all have a a different um different brain brains and we're just experiencing life differently and that we don't need to grow in the same height with the same level of straightness so to say so it's my analogy of how we're all these different kinds of poppies I was talking with you about what processing speed is it's a cognitive ability and these um processing speed skills allow us to do things at a certain rate some of us do things more slowly others do things with a longer period of time and what I really wanted to e emphasize is that slow processing speed isn't related to intelligence and you may know of others who are just so impressive but they don't do things quickly and that's okay so then I was talking with you um about this kind of simulation where I'm showing you a picture of the night sky and you can see stars now some of you may have already identified a constellation has anyone in this group already identified a constellation no it's not not coming to you yet so when we talk about processing speed we are aware that some of us see things we perceive things more quickly than others and I thought some of you might have already automatically known what some of these planets are and what the stars were and what some of the star constellations were or whether you could see part of the Big Dipper so some of us can see these things quickly I just wanted to give us a chance to understand that sometimes when we see things it takes us time to make sense of what we see and that also is part of processing speed so for those of us who have are quick who have quick processing speed we experience a great deal of ease things feel automatic to us we can do things quickly without thinking about them for those of us who have a slower processing speed things feel like they take a greater amount of time more effort and because we've had experience doing the behaviors before and I'll get more specific about what those behaviors might be but because we anticipate that things are going to take us longer than others and we might compare ourselves to others and we might think that things will be effortful for us to do them a whole bunch of other kinds of thinking show up regarding the expectation for that kind of task so many of you here are parents and you know what processing speed demands of students at school so you know that there are issues relating to writing in particular I would say that's probably um a very common kind of beh learning behavior that parents are concerned about when we talk about processing speed skills and so here I've got a picture of both someone holding a pencil so a paper and pencil task and also typing on a keyboard which what with what looks like a one-finger approach to the keyboard so I purposefully chose both of these images because we're going to be talking about different kinds of motor responses and then also because your parents you know that slower processing speed skills impact daily routines at home so I have a picture of the morning routine which of course is impacted by a slower processing speed as well as remembering how many things to do at night but we could also talk about meal times I know that some of the kids processing speeds are an issue at meal times as well so my jumping off point um
[3:47 — Reading a sample WISC score profile] given that kind of um introduction is by pulling up a sample of a profile and these are whisk scores and the Whisk if you're not familiar with this it's a um cognitive measure that is given in a battery of tests or assessments that might be included in a psychoeducational evaluation or a neuros pychological evaluation so many of you may have had your children uh assessed previously and you may have scores that look somewhat like this so I just want to quickly go through and spend time talking about processing speed so in terms of this um whisk profile you may notice that I only have subtest scores that's purposeful I really use the subtest scores more than any other scores because the other scores are averages for that index or average for the section and I'm looking at the score that's most closely tied to the subtest so I can see what we're actually measuring so knowing what these subtests ask students to do is really helpful because then we know what the the scores will will mean so the first index you may notice that there are a lot of scores in the teens so the scores range from 14 15 15 and 17 I'm not going to go into a lot of details but I'll say that the subtest scores are all in the superior range so we can say that verbal ability for this student is quite Superior so that means that verbal skills come very easily to this child in the next section there's visual spatial ability and you'll notice two very solid scores 14 and 14 so this means that the students ability to visually look at the changes in non-verbal designs and being able to pick from array of what might come next is as strong as the verbal section but it doesn't have the same high scores like 15s and 17s so it may be a comparatively weaker section then you look at fluid reasoning again I'm just going to go over this really quickly so that's a combination of of language ability as well as visual spatial ability and you see that this student is able to get back um the higher scores 15 and 16 get back out in that higher Superior range because the student probably can talk his or her way through the tasks that are being presented um while they're looking working memory just average the twelves are on the cusp of the average range it's high average but not quite in the superior range so you may be getting a sense of this child's profile and now we're going to look at processing speed and you'll see these two numbers one and a five maybe numbers like this are familiar to you so this might look like this student doesn't really have processing speed skills so let's just talk about what these two subtests um ask so these are two coding and symbol search are what give um assessors an idea of a student's processing speed ability so these are both timed tests they're both paper and pencil tests and they ask students to do some visual scanning where they have to look quickly at small figures and then cross them out or not cross them out so they're given a certain menu and the kids have to cross them off and um it's really tied to kids moving quickly so they're looking at a motor response to what's seen which is visual spatial so what's what kinds of tasks are like that in school you know none except for maybe mad minute which is like a a quick Max fluency type test so most learning isn't like this but it gives us a very nice sense of a student's processing speed where we can kind of separate it out from verbal visual spatial fluid reasoning and working memory now some students might have low scores in more than just one index but I was proving a point in this presentation by really kind of making this child 's sample profile very clean so we can just talk about processing speed but in real life processing speed
[7:36 — What slow processing speed looks like for students at school] is related to so many other things which we'll talk about in a moment so let's extrapolate what this might mean for a student so this might mean for a student that worksheets at school are going to be a problem and for twoe students who have Superior verbal comprehension ability they have so many ideas in their minds and when they get a worksheet or they get a project they really have to decipher which of those ideas they want to um identify in their on their worksheet so that means they kind of have to sift through all the ideas that they're thinking of and that process of sifting takes time and many children enjoy thinking about their thinking because they've got Superior fluid reasoning ability but in the meantime the rest of the class is just simply filling out the worksheet or simply following the steps of the project and a student with this kind of a profile might really struggle and then when the time is up up and the classroom is ready to move on to another activity or the teacher collecting the pages or they could be online Pages as well but when the time period is over for that assignment this student then has to beat the clock and just finish it up so what do we typically see we typically see the minimum of a written answer or a blank space or we see um writing that isn't very legible or we hear from the student a lot of reasons why the task isn't important or why it's boring or um why they don't want to do it so it becomes more of an emotional and kind of behavioral issue than just the straight processing speed but I wanted to just show you what this looks like because when I see low scores like this I think when I speak with parents I think that their child has really spent a lot of time building up the confidence to handle written uh expression and yet also having to really handle their feelings about written expression given the timeline that asked to complete things so guess what my understanding is that most students think of themselves as a learner not based on their cognitive scores that are superior in verbal ability not on their uh visual spatial abilities not on fluid reasoning certainly not on working memory but on processing speed so unfortunately some children think of themselves as Learners based on how quickly and and how well they write the responses to the things that they're learning in school whether it's a worksheet or an essay Etc so we'll be talking more about um writing tasks but I just want to talk I just wanted to kind of bring up the idea that we really need to look at where students are connected to their strengths and where they are interested in showing what they've learned or what they know and not make all of learning about the product that we really need to assist students who have Superior skills to know how to handle um an assignment where the processing speed skills might be an issue and I think that's why most of you were curious enough to show up for tonight so um I'm going to be leaving the sample profile but the takeaway from this slide is that I think that many kids think of themselves as Learners based on their processing speed ability which couldn't be farther from the truth and I'd like for all of the parents and Educators who are here tonight to really think about students and their profiles and really focus on what it is that they love to do gifts strengths and talents and emphasize that and different ways to show what was learned as opposed to only uh expecting written responses certainly not necessarily worksheets that have small spaces to write answers to but having a better understanding about the process and how this process relates to a child's self-confidence and uh we may talk more about this in some future slides but I'm ready to leave this slide now having
[11:26 — Processing speed's impact on daily life, and overlap with ADHD, autism, dyslexia] talked about it so so you know here we have you know processing speed skills impacting everything so daily routines both at home and at school academic tasks we talked about written expression while all content areas expect written expression as a product social interactions we haven't really talked about that yet and then emotional regulation which I kind of alluded to because a lot of students who don't have strong processing speed skills can feel frustration can feel anxiety can feel anger can feel less than good enough can feel perfectionism so there are a lot of emotional things and most of us then handle the emotional issues without recognizing what it is that is the processing speed in that picture it's really hard to kind of just look at processing speed that's why there aren't a lot of studies on it it's really hard to just like the closest we could get were the the subtest scores where we can ask students to hold a pencil and be timed with paper but you know real life you're living it already you know you know slow processing speed and also you know quick processing speed and I I'm here to say that sometimes having a quick processing speed isn't good for some students yet let's go back to this profile for a moment and just talk about for a student who might have Superior processing skills but then weaker skills in other cognitive areas then they may work too quickly for their own good and then we're looking at maybe issues relating to attention which have to do with impulsivity so we really have to be mindful of what does the task require what kinds of processing skills are needed for the child and how can we assist in the process of learning so that learning remains joyful rather than frustrating or joyful rather than um anxiety producing and then joyful instead of frustration with the adults who are around so when I was saying that we don't often see processing skills you know on their own we often see them related to other cognitive abilities so that could be a student who's on the autism spectrum it could be a student with ADHD I think that there are many questions parent have parents have about well is it ADHD or is it SL processing speed is it s processing speed or is it active working memory so the the next few slides we're going to be talking about how to determine what that is I'd like to leave you with that information um slow processing speed can be related to a specific learning disability so um in terms of Dyslexia you may have heard the the term fluency well fluency is processing speed and related to reading it's how smoothly a child can read the words on the page so there fluency has a very specific meaning related to reading skills but in life we all have fluency remember when you first began to drive a car you probably weren't quite that Adept at driving the car and rolling down the window now I'm old enough to say that when I learned how to drive the windows were cranks none of the windows were automatic quite yet so that was a really big deal um and then cooking you know when we made our first batch of baked goods maybe brownies you know we really had to look at the recipe we weren't fluent at all but after we've made brownies enough times we barely have to look at what ingredients to pull out of uh the pantry so processing speed skills are related to other kinds of motoric uh responses and um they're related to um specific learning disabilities I mentioned dyslexia but it could be disg graphia it could be um disc calcula it could be auditory processing it could be visual processing so there really is um quite a bit of comorbidity or co-occurring difficulties that students are dealing with and processing speed may not be the priority but it's in the mix and I already mentioned that students who are diagnosed with anxiety may have difficulty starting tasks and so again it looks like so processing speed and so that's definitely part of the mix so you know I
[15:38 — Can processing speed improve? An input/output framework for task analysis] know it's on everyone's Minds this is the big question everyone always wants the answer to which is can processing speed skills improve over time and I just love this image because part of it is really in focus and another part is very out of focus and it kind of shows how much support this race car driver has to do this race and so I want you to think if you're parents or Educators you know we are supporting the race car and some race cars have an engine that can enable the race car to propel itself across the Finish Line whereas other cars may not have the same kind of engine remember I talked about the poppies we're all growing at different rates and in different forms and we all have these brain differences it doesn't mean we're not smart we will get to the finish line but not in this kind of a speedy way so I don't often see that processing speed skills improve over time when I'm working with clients but when I work on processing speed along with other academic skills I do see them improve through practice so I'm going to give you some tools tonight so that you have an awareness about that and these are the tools so when we talk about processing speed skills I'm always asking Educators and parents well on what tasks are you talking about where are you concerned about about processing speed skills and so I'll often ask um parents and Educators to talk about what is their child being asked to perceive so are they looking at a screen like you are now where there are letters which is verbal input or where there are pictures and that's non-verbal input so first of all knowing what is it that the child is is seeing is it visual verbal is it visual nonverbal and then I don't have it listed here but um what is the student hearing um is the student hearing auditory verbal or auditory non-verbal information so auditory verbal might be the words or sounds and then non-verbal might be tone of voice or a passing um fire engine siren and so um the other kind of input that I can talk about is just sensory input how do you feel um you know with your senses and the best example I can think of that I use in lectures is on Halloween sometimes there's a fun game that the kids play and that is that they stick their hands into a paper bag and they feel what's inside without looking and based on the feel what is it so is you know if it's brains is it spaghetti you know um if it's eyeballs is it a peeled grape kind of thing so that's kind of a sensory input so even though you don't see these different types of inputs there are visual inputs there are auditory inputs and there are sensory inputs that are more tactile then the next question I ask parents and Educators is okay what's the output what is the child being expected to do and you'll notice that each of these outputs has the word motor there so there's oral motor which is speaking that's an oral response where the mouth moves in a way that we can create sounds and then fine motor which is using our fingers that could be holding a pencil or a paintbrush or a toothbrush or typing on a keypad graphomotor is specifically related to letter formation grapo is letter motor is motor as you know so grapo motor is really about you know planning where does a pencil go on the page what needs to be written with any Clarity and legibility does the student start at the top of the page or the bottom and of course that includes issues relating to pencil grip Etc and then gross motor has to do with moving the entire body so that could be movement that includes you know getting up from one seat and putting something in the trash bin or it could be um walking up the stairs you know it could be OT occupational therapy related so when we're looking at processing speed skills we have to ask what is the most important aspect of this task is the most important aspect to read is it to listen um based on reading or listening what does the student need to do to show what was learned is it something that's going to be written or spoken or acted out or built or painted so this is really important to look at in what way are processing spill skills impacting the task now in some cases doing something quickly doesn't matter but we don't have forever and I think that's where our parents get the most frustrated especially with transitions in and out of the car for daily routines like going to school and it's also frustrating for teachers because teachers believe that once they've given the instruction that the students should internalize the instruction but students with with weak or slow processing speed skills are always proving that they're weak or slow so every time a student is being asked to write that's an isue for them that's what they're proving now what does oral motor um as a response seem like for with relation to processing speed skills that's noticeable when a student is asked a question in class and they need time to formulate their oral response so we're not just talking about only writing activities we're also talking about oral activities so for a student who um often knows the answer but can't get it out the words are like on the tip of their tongue it's helpful of course to ask the questions in advance have the student prepare possibly rehearse if that's allowed and then be able to answer the question without it being a surprise and allowing a student to restate what they want to say taking the second thing that the child has said or the third thing not necessarily the first and moving on to the next student so for processing speed in terms of written expression there are a lot of accommodations that many of you are familiar with but they probably aren't enough to kind of alleviate the issues so maybe we can do some brainstorming tonight you may be putting items in the chat but because of the way my computers configured I can't see it so I'll look at that when I get the chance but I'm
Callie (likely):Â with the way we started tonight and I are tracking the chat so okay good
Marcy:Â yeah because the way we started I'm really leery to do anything you know that won't be able to get me back to the start we can read the chat too
Callie (likely):Â okay good
Marcy:Â so I just want to say as we leave the slide that when we talk about processing speed we can't isolate it we have to look at it in terms of what the student is perceiving and considering whether it's visual or auditory or or tactile and looking at what it is that the student being asked to do whether it's oral motor fine motor grapha motor or gross motor so that we can determine what's the most Salient aspect of that task is the most Salient aspect of that task to know something or to write it you know and so we kind of enter the conversation in terms of what's ACR but that's premature but we will talk about that so um you know parents will ask me during homework time you know you know how do we keep homework from taking three hours and so I go through this process well what's the input what's the output what are the expectations are the expectations relevant for the child's um age and grade level and then what are the issues because then we can decide the best way to support the child especially and I'm coming back to this slide especially the child who has these Superior cognitive abilities where written expression may not be the best way for them to show what they know so I'm going to move on now that I've given you these tools to really Analyze This is called task analysis educational therapists use this to look at what accommodations or what modifications or what differentiation we need to provide by looking at what's intact and then supporting or scaffolding instruction for what students have or need support with so task analysis is great for you at home with these daily routines as well as for help during homework what's okay to help your child do so we may come back to that and I'm ready to talk about it now I loved this picture too because I was talking about the type of engine in a car and then here's this great picture of all the different uh cars lined up as if they're going to be racing and we have to be very mindful of the students who have you know different kinds of parts and um really keep their self-esteem intact moving forward with what students can do and what they'll need support with in order to get to the same destination but I also want you to think about the process again it's not just all about the product and that motor outcome it's also about how does the student go about showing what was learned and my hope is that learning is as joyful as possible and I think that's where the bulk of our conversation will be for the rest of this presentation I focused a lot on what are
[24:35 — The five non-negotiable learning environments for 2e learners] uh slow processing speed skill concerns and so now I want to quickly go through the element of who we're working with who are our 2E children so what I want to talk about are what are the non-negotiables for two e-learners in different environments and you may see that there are five environments in this poster I'm just going to start with anyone because they're all equally important in terms of the intellectual piece what needs to be in the learning environment for twoe Learners is that the tasks are authentic and meaningful and have real world application when tasks are engaging students kind of forget um to resist or avoid because they love what they're learning and um it's helpful for students to really show what they know and dive in deep Dives so they have to have options and that leads us to to the creative section they have to have options about ways to access the curriculum maybe having two books to read or two op an option between the two books to read or it could be uh listening to a video or an audio of an interview before diving into what's learned so they see a real life application so students who have Choice are much more engaged and when the intellectual or cognitive level is challenging and they have creative choice then students are more willing to take the support that they need for their executive functioning skills and for their slower processing speed skills which again are sometimes confusing for for individuals because they both impact each other the next area that I'll talk about I'm going to skip over to Social in the classroom whether um the well whether it's of whole class or a small group or paired learning students need to feel a sense of belonging and they need to know what their role is as social contributors to a group so it might be that um one student is coming to a group and has the role of a of a researcher and they're coming in with information that they found in another source another student might be someone who is a practical manager and is going to remember the due dates another student might be the notetaker not likely the one with slow processing speed skills but this is why it's good to know who's who because then we know what to rely on and we want to be able to rely on skills that are intact and abilities that are intact so teachers establish Rapport teachers and students in social learning environments because everything is social in a classroom that kind of environment the teacher setting the tone and the teacher shows respect for the student and two we students need to feel that respect and that connection and that Rapport if that's missing and can't be repaired or it never was established then it's even harder for a student with slow processing speed to be able to write a response because of all of the uh issues related to relationship with the teacher the next environment we'll talk about is emotional um students need to know that there's a safe we call it psychologically safe environment where they can express their joy in learning and a lot of kids hide that depending on the environment that they're in but also that it's safe to make mistakes that mistakes are welcome and for students with slow processing speed they really feel um well many feel that that it's just known it's so obvious you know that their rate of learning isn't like others and so they can be very sensitive and compare themselves to others and that kind of comparison isn't helpful and it isn't healthy because we'll all do things different ways and still get to the end so having a culture of acceptance and being being able to talk about skills in a very um Clean and Clear way enable students to uh gain self-confidence despite weak areas because there's also a focus on these areas of cognitive Superior skills and then the fifth environment I'm really whipping through these but the fifth environment has to do with um what needs to be in place what's non-negotiable for some Learners and that would include allowing movement movement is allowed for twoe students to engage in learning and so that might mean where they sit and where they sit might impact their processing speed so note the child's um posture note if there are two elbows on the table note if they're crouched over their keyboard note if the lighting is good enough note if it the student is distractable um so you know these are all really important aspects and if we look at processing speed skills you know I think if a student had slow processing speed skills it's going to show up in almost every one of these environments isn't
[29:32 — Accommodations by grade level: elementary through high school] it so that's really pretty important to remember so what is the priority when you're doing a task analysis is it that the student works independently and quickly and has all the right answers and it's all product oriented or is is it possible to look at other areas that can be nurtured and bolstered and thinking about processing speed skills in these five environments it becomes very clear how sensitive we need to be with students who have slow processing speed skills and also for those who have very quick processing speed skills where they need to slow down and be more aware of their process so I'm talking a lot about process and really deemphasizing product even though that's scary for many of us because the product is what the grade is based on so I've prepared this this section now where what do we do what are the accommodations what are the modifications what can be done and I've broken this up into elementary middle high school and then adult and you've got these great boxes so let's just go through these so what would we recommend for students at school so the red box has to do with establishing routines so until students can do this on their own until they can be autonomous with their with with themselves the adults in the learning environments have to provide this for students so that's parents at home home and teachers at school and sometimes with when students are being homeschooled it's one and the same and during the pandemic it was one and the same so many of you know more about your children's processing speed skills because of the pandemic than you might have otherwise but anyway it's really important to establish routines now think about input output think about the students capabilities is it best to establish routines and structure time and space with words because the student's highly verbal or with a visual calendar and visual reminders because the student is highly V uh visual spatial so there isn't one right way for every student we really have to think about what are those students capabilities what will be meaningful for that student so structuring time can be emphasizing the passage of time so that means having a clock face as opposed to a digital clock so an analog clock can be very helpful for many students because then they see how long they've been thinking about an answer and how much time is left to produce it now that's not great for all students I'm sure many of you parents know this but it could make your child more anxious to see a clock and so that might not be the best way for them so there isn't one right way to go about this but there are many questions to ask about whether or not it'll work and then of course it can be tried so how do we uh how do we structure space well we look at the area where the student is sitting and we look at how many brakes are needed and we look at whether a motor break is helpful between a task that has been U man well structured into smaller more manageable parts so I'm sure many of you have at home established routines where your child comes in the door and puts their backpack in the same location every day now this might sound like we're talking about a student with attentional issues but students with processing speed may also have attentional issues so clarifying the expectations for establishing routines is really helpful even though it sounds like it might be something that we might do for a student with attentional issues so structuring time and space to make a routine is great because the more often we do routines the the stronger students get remember we were talking about fluency now again some kids don't respond to routines you're still doing the same thing that you've done for a long period of time and you may be feeling frustrated with child and so what's important is just to keep scaffolding those executive functioning skills and enabling routines to one day get better because I'm sure you all know and I would love to see the chat to when I pose this but maybe I'll just do that I'll pose it and then Callie and you can tell me but you know justes saying hurry up or rush or go quicker does that help you know thumbs up thumbs down no it just doesn't work so are losing our frustra are getting frustrated and losing our parental cool doesn't help so we really want our students to or our children to establish routines and kind of be independent but we're really in this for the Long Haul like I said about the car the car engine and the car makeup you know we're all going to go let's just go back to that car analogy for a second we're let's say we're all going on a road trip okay and we're all in our cars let's just go back to this little image here right here um we're all in our cars and I'm in Los Angeles so let's say I'm going to go up to the Northern California coast and we're all going to get into these cars right so those of us with fast processing speed are going to want to gun the pedal to the metal and want to get there maybe fast right or fastest or first and other of us might want to stop along the road side and get a snack maybe that's just or you maybe taking a little detour and looking at this little area or going to the coast along the way so it's like things catch our interest and we're all motivated in different ways some of us might be motivated to take more breaks some of us might be motivated to get there fast some of us might you know want to just as I said gun it so there are so many issues related to motivation and interest but we can't drive through stop signs we have to recognize when it's time to stop and when it's time to pause right we don't want a speeding ticket on the way we're getting and we might need to take a break and someone else might need to drive the car so you kind of get where I'm going with this kind of analogy I just kind of wanted to come back there and reiterate that we when we're in a family on a family trip in a car we have all the different needs in the family and that trip is going to be fun so parents know that they're going to plan for that and I'm thinking maybe we could do that for students who have slow processing speed during homework time so keep that in mind for a moment students with slow processing speed I'm going to go to this kind of yellow box they need more time to transition now at home that's about getting in the car I think many of you as parents say okay we're going to leave in 10 minutes we're going to leave in five minutes we're going to leave in 2 minutes we're going to leave now um that's very common another way to kind of help that transition is to say look around and tell me what you need to pick up or pack and what that requires parents is that you have all the time in the world so I know that's not always realistic but to whatever extent you can allow yourself to create that time these kinds of transitions will be lovely and I I'm going to give another example because I'm hoping that the examples are helpful at Bridges Academy where I uh consult there is a lovely time of day between classes where there isn't a bell system so the students are attuned to the teachers giving directions that it's time to go outside and the teachers determine that based on the students Readiness and then they go outside and they play or they have a snack and then when it's time to come back into class they look at the visual field because either the teacher or the teacher's assistant has come out and the kids gravitate around the teacher or the teacher's assistant and then they go enter class but they don't enter class until they've had a conversation the teacher greets the students so it's a lovely what I call a soft transition if a student were in a traditional classroom there would be a lot of difficulties during this time period don't you think so what happens at home is that we as parents are juggling a lot and we want to rush and we want to get there or we want to do whatever and we have to be able to remember what it's like to have this kind of a soft transition now sometimes it's not possible we just have to get there but other times it is possible so consider how might you make a transition at home possible um and then you know being able to give the clues is the student going to listen to verbal prompts or visual prompts and um kind of lay things out whether it's clothes or materials having a drop spot making things as easy as possible I'll go to the next box which is green so this uh checking in for accurate perceptions so this is a big one and this is more related to Executive functioning skills the way I I teach it so in executive functioning skills I'll just say that most parents are most concerned with being their children being organized and meeting deadlines but there are a lot of skills that are required before that can occur one of the very first executive functioning skills is making sure that the student has an accurate perception of what's expected and so accurate perceptions could be knowing the oral directions or it could be um knowing what the product might look like but again there's such a focus on product that we also want to make sure that we are guiding the student with the learning process so how is the student thinking about the directions how is the student thinking about next steps if we ask the student how they're thinking and what they're perceiving then we have a better sense of where that student is on the right track and we can say great I like how you're thinking or whether the student is is misperceiving or has missed a Quee and we have to provide that or reframe it so I'm not going to talk about this for much longer although I could but that's a different topic uh on Executive functioning but if a student um is expecting uh a very complicated written response and the time frame isn't um possible for such a complicated project then we then the teacher or the the parent has to reframe what's possible within that time frame looking to the Box on the right prompting for initiation of tasks providing feedback for ongoing process progress again this is very much attuned to what students who have attentional issues need um and also students with anxiety sometimes students don't get started the longer that they've talked about the instructions or the rationale for not having to do it they could have finished the task already right so these are highly verbal students again it's the highly verbal skills that are being shown off in this kind of negotiating it goes back to the important intellectual environment here where students who are really interested and engaged and motivated they're more likely to take the prompts for processing speed and executive functioning because they're loving what they're doing and it's meaningful so keep that in mind when you're thinking about what students need to initiate a task and what kind of feedback is provided for their ongoing progress when students hear that they're on track or that someone likes how they're thinking it can make a huge difference and most of the time as parents we just want our kids to do it and we want them to do it without our asking first and then when they finally do it we're we're silent so we have to give as many prompts for when the students are doing what we're asking versus when they're not so keep that in mind too the blue box talks about the language that we can use when we're working with children so I like to be very specific I'm sure you've all heard this before but we can say something like I notice how well you're doing X and make sure that X is very specific to the task don't just say you're doing a good job just say I really like how you gathered your backpack before I asked you to or I really like how you're thinking about this answer or I really like that you're looking online for this that's exactly the right place to be looking for it so when you give give specific feedback the child gets the message that they're on the right track but it also gives the child a sense of where support might be needed next and that has to do with self- advocacy now some students can ask about their learning needs and other times it's the teacher or the parent that has to solve the mystery of what's really going on and so a self- advocacy can take place when a student has self-confidence and rapport with the adults and feels that it's safe to do so self- advocacy is based on a student knowing what they can do well as well as knowing what they need support with and an example I can give you as adults is think of something in your adult life you can put it in the chat what's something in your adult life that you could do but it would take you forever and you'd rather pay someone else to do it or you'd rather someone else helped you out right you as an adult you can choose to do that if you have the funds you can pay for someone to do it right mow the lawn fixing appliances taxes laundry folding laundry right okay so oil right exactly that's exactly those are the perfect kinds of answers so this is real life so what I'm saying here is that we know we could do it we could do it well if we had two weeks but we really need to do it now for whatever reasons so how do we get over that hump of the kind of thinking that we have going on in our heads that kind of selft talk um I wonder if I should say this here I think I will what we're talking about now is another executive functioning skill where students are uh either talking themselves towards a task or away from a task and it's it's like U modifying not modifying it's kind of um that selft talk can either be helpful or not and I'll give an example uh that um I often use and that's um I love potato chips and French for that matter um and when I see a bag of potato chips I just want them they're not on my diet I'm not supposed to have them but I want them I'm sure you all can relate be it potato chips or pretzels or whatever you love so I can see a bag of pretzels and I might think to myself again I'm giving you an example of what it's like to think things through I can say um I'd really love that bag of potato chips and that could Propel me towards it I could also say no they're not on my diet I'm going to be disciplined and I'm not going to have them today so students are having that same kind of internal dialogue and they're they're modulating that dialogue in a way to protect themselves either from humiliation or from being found out that they're not going to be good at it or whatever and sometimes they don't say it out loud so we have to be able to ask the right questions to find out how kids are thinking because I can modulate thoughts that will enable me to avoid those potato chips or to just eat them and then what about the thoughts that I might be thinking after I've had the bag are the thoughts going to be self-critical are the thoughts going to be encouraging oh maybe next time I won't eat them so it's like kids are having this dialogue and we're not necessarily checking in with them about how they're thinking about their learning process and if processing speed is a big issue then what do you imagine they're thinking this is going to take forever I don't want to have to do this I have to work harder than everybody else they're going to finish before I do and some of that may not be an accurate perception looking at the green box it could be completely inaccurate so we really need to be able to check in with students whether that we're the teachers or the parents to find out how they're thinking because if they know their strengths talents and interests then they can put in perspective their slower processing speed or their to Quick processing speed so that it's relevant for the task at hand and that they know what to ask for how to ask for it and when to ask for it which are also more executive functioning skills so in the purple box I was talking about content areas I'm really talking about writing where I've written that students should be allowed to provide bulleted answers as opposed to full sentences students should be allowed to dictate their answers to ascribe whether it's a peer or an adult or a parent during homework students should be allowed to provide fewer items once Mastery is shown um a common example of that is like every third problem in math you know if it's a lot of math items but then again in math which requires a written response there should be fewer items per page so it's not so overwhelming for a student with processing speed issues and there should be a great deal of white space to record answers for Le legibility in particular and then of course I have allowing Choice which I've already talked about in terms of one of the non-negotiable uh environments of creativity so these School recommendations are are much easier to implement in elementary school and it's much easier to allow a student in elementary school to dictate their answers and often parents will ask me should I allow my child to dictate and my answer is always yes because what's the point let's do the task analysis what's the point of the assignment is the point that the your child has to write it out and it takes for you know an hour and a half or is the point to learn what's being taught show that learning took place dictation helps that student along so I don't see it as a crutch once a student can write on their own they're not going to want to dictate once a student can write within the time period available they're not going to want to um use a alternate way of doing things so I trust students I think you should I think you also trust your children so a lot of the school recommendations here in terms of processing speed are related to transition times during the day and they're related to written responses and then also don't forget an oral response some students need to know the questions in advance so they can provide an oral response before being called on because they need time to formulate their answer so the next section has to do with well what do we do for students in middle school and guess what the answer is the same as what you do in element elentary School the biggest difference is that many Middle School teachers expect students to be autonomous and independent and they're not yet and then parents expect their students to be autonomous and they're not yet so a lot of the same issues uh exist here although there may be more standardized testing and there may be longer projects and there may be um issues that need to be addressed on a caseby casee basis in Middle School um Extended time becomes more of a factor and prompting and Scaffolding for next steps becomes a factor in middle school and then my next slide of course is high school and more of the same what we tend to see in high school is that students are cognitively ready for AP courses and honors courses but they aren't able to keep up with the the production demands of writing um different responses to reading and they're not ready for essay writing every week and they're just it's just a lot of repetitive written work so there's that issue okay how do students then access the content in an AP class which then of course leads to other um benefits at the high the college level but how to how to handle that do um what kind of support can a student have can a student work with a tutor to move things along can the student use an audio recorder can a student um have Choice with showing how something has been learned and um the college level it's more of the same um I think there are some parents here that have college age students and there was a question about how to handle a college application process well can you imagine for a student with slow processing speed needing to juggle current demands in high school having to add to that applications and deadlines and essays while maintaining grades at school so when is there time in the day for students to both apply to school and keep up their grades in high school so the the biggest issue for college is finding the support for students so they don't feel so overwhelmed um overwhelmed I don't think I've talked about that yet I've really talked more about frustration levels and anxiety but when there's a sense of overwhelm for a student with slow
[50:53 — College and self-advocacy] processing speed it feels as if we're never never going to be able to finish that no matter how much effort I'm not going to be able to finish and why bother and there's a deist attitude and when it's a why bother situation then we're not seeing what's in this blue square here which is a student asking for assistance so self- advocacy is so huge because we want students to be very aware of their profiles and have a sense of ownership about both their strengths and any weaknesses and be able to ask for the help that's needed so I often teach students how to ask for help so that um it's really well received by adults in their environment but self- advocacy in college can be very hard for a student who doesn't have a sense of their a synchronous learning profile it's much easier in elementary school because of the developmental stage that students are in it's really hard in middle school I don't know why it's so hard I think Middle School uh Educators feel they're preparing students for the real world in high school but then it's easier in high school for students to get accommodations through an IEP or 504 and um then in College of course everything that's been established in high school continues after K through 12 but in college students have to bring to the attention their issues in the Student Learning Center whereas in K through 12 it's the Educators who check in with the children in college the children have to check in with the Educators otherwise the Educators don't know that there's an issue so self- advocacy becomes a big issue and a very common uh accommodation is extended time either 50% or 100% but that's not enough to solve all of the issues we've been talking about it's it's it's an option but it doesn't solve so that's why it's so important to know what is possible and then also what are the non-negotiables and then also to be able to identify in terms of task analysis what's the most important thing here and then also having a sense of how to have compassion for a student who's proving every day some of the weaker skills that they have so I'm going to be wrapping up in a few Mo a few moments I know we didn't solve all of the world's problems tonight and not anything is going away rather quickly
[53:23 — Lessons from nature & using games to build skills] but it's it's really important to think about it and for those of you who are more visual spatial than verbal I have these gorgeous images you may notice that I've chosen a land animal a winged animal a water animal and a human all sentient beings and what I want to talk about with you is that we have to consider the context and expectations we would never expect a hummingbird to run like a lion we wouldn't ever expect a hummingbird to behave like a turtle but I feel like we can lose that fact very easily with a sing synchronous Learners and especially those with slow processing speed which impacts all other kinds of learning issues that are co-occurring so you know really think about what it is that's make or break for the kids and think about ways in which they can be supported to be their you know their best selves with their self-confidence intact um the next section is that remember I told you earlier on that that I don't often see processing speed skills improve but I do see them improve along with other uh skills I play a lot of games with students card games they can be homemade they don't have to be store-bought but I use the game blink a lot have you heard of blink b l i n k blink is a fun card game for all ages adults as well and students the goal of the game is to be able to get rid of all your cards but the only way to get rid of your cards is by placing one of your cards on a pile and the images on the cards are all non-verbal so they're either one 2 3 four or five images so they're either based on color on number or by the symbol so students who first play this game with me are very who have slow processing speed are very awkward and again if we do task analysis this is a visual non-verbal input and it requires a tactile input because students are holding cards in their hand and the output is fine motor or gross motor if they drop a card and they have to bend down to pick it up so it's that kind of a task visual non-verbal and then um find motor response and um the students start first when they first start to play it if they have slow processing speed they tend to place a card that's only number or only the shape or only the color as they begin to juggle handling all three number color and shape they begin to beat me and once they beat me I can never beat them again so yes processing speed can uh improve but tied to in this case visual spatial scanning and motor dexterity
Callie (likely):Â Marcy yes I wanted to mention that someone in the chat brought up a game that I know you and I talked about was spot
Marcy:Â yes spot is fine spotted it's spotted I think yeah Spott it absolutely and you can put in all the games in the chat we can share them with each other um many students will who have slow processing speed will never gravitate or choose a game that requires speed they just won't it's not fun for them so it has to be presented if it's with a family it has to be presented in a way that the student is really learning something meaningful or is excited about it but these are wonderful ways to improve uh processing speed um did I talk about um waving mad minute waving math fluency assessments I don't think I did did I um on this slide I'll go back for a moment I know I'm trying to wrap up but I'm also thinking about things that are important on school recommendations for a student with slow processing speed I like to wave any mad minute or math fluency assignments because that's just making the child prove over and over again that they don't know their math facts quickly and a use of a calculator can be very helpful playing games with math numbers and math effects can be fun again we want learning to be joyful but we don't want students to keep proving their disability especially when they've got Superior skills and they're twice exceptional so um waving any Ed tasks is really important at school whether it is Elementary Middle High School okay coming back to this beautiful visual imagery so we would never expect an an animal to behave like a different animal we don't want to respect our students and children who are slow processors to suddenly be be be fast processors even though it would make our lives and days so much easier so keep considering the context and the expectations and then um recognize that when students practice tasks tied to other skills they do improve over time but the games if you're parents and you're playing at home the games have to be lowkey high interest they have to have personal meaning for your child they have to be personally motivated to win the game and handle losing right so those are some social emotional issues and it must be joyful and the second it's not stop it indicate or present it to your child that this is for fun we're having fun and I wish homework could be this way as well I wish homework could be a fun period of time and maybe you can introduce a game in between homework tasks or play a game after homework so um games are are really a fantastic way to teach skills and I love to play games with middle school students and high school students because I feel like we've lost out in a couple of years of those board games we've moved right into internet games so I'm encouraging everyone to play fun games um this is another beautiful page where I've brought in some imagery for all of you visual spatial learners and not as much language um I want to talk about some final Reflections which is taking lessons from nature so you see that again I've picked the different elements so I have this beautiful crushing wave that I imagine is somewhere in Fiji or Hawaii or somewhere with some fabulous Beach you know think about the joy of watching The Sea if you live near a coast and think about the the swell of a wave and think of the crest and think of the crashing and how each of those aspects of a wave are so pleasurable it's not like we're looking at a wave and only looking at the product like and first of all is the product the crust is the product the crash like what anyway what is it so in nature we are shown progress and process there isn't one aspect that's more important than another that's very helpful for a student with slow processing speed because no one sits on the beach looking at the waves and time them and say ah that one's taking two minutes longer to swell or you know when's the next wave coming it's supposed to be here already like those aren't thoughts ever have so let's take this lesson from nature and I'm hoping that you'll remember the ocean waves when you're working with your um children same thing with I I picked sunflowers you know they grow into tall stocks and they only um bloom in the summer right do they bloom in the spring maybe I'm wrong but sunflowers I associate with summer we never expect them to bloom in Winter right it's just we wouldn't think about it so again what are we expecting our children to do and can we look at lessons from nature same thing with the cherry blossoms that I have a photo of and um then I've got a really nice speech there so to to I'm just going to wrap up and give us time to uh ask and answer questions we're looking at learning as being a joyful process and it's a natural process and we can take these lessons from nature and and really look at what our children are able to do and protect their self-confidence and their self- advocacy Foster their sense of self and esteem as Learners in the world and we trust that when they become autonomous they won't need us anymore but until they're autonomous they need these supports I never view them as a crutch so I hope
[1:01:45 — Resources and closing remarks] that I've I've really set that across what do I have left oh this is the resources I gave you an article from understood.com there isn't a lot written about processing speed because it's very hard to separate it out from other learning skills and that's why I think so many of you were interested in tonight's talk and um the next thing is playing games to improve processing speed skills along with other skills they may be language-based they may be visual spatial they may be sequencing they may be associative lots of games out there I have spotted and blink listed so thank you to whoever contributed that earlier and I think this is my last slide yeah it is and um I want to thank you for um inviting me here to talk about this I know that it's something that everyone's concerned about and that we have an idea that slow processing speed needs to improve and I'm asking everyone here tonight to think about what can we do in the context of learning that enable students to really shine and be who they are and live their magic without processing speed being as integral an issue as we thought it was so maybe you have a different View and your perspective has shifted after this um brief presentation so again thank you
[1:03:06 — Q&A begins — dysgraphia, ADHD, and working memory vs. processing speed] Marcy can you put your contact slide up and we'll uh put your contact information in the chat because I'm not
Callie:Â I know I have a different email address for you but there I've put that one in the chat so great so Marcy thank you so much this presentation is chalk full of information um no doubt and we actually had like 13 or 14 questions come in the chat and I know we got a little bit of a late start so I wondered if you would be willing to stick around a little longer
Marcy:Â yeah um and yeah
Callie:Â L I don't know what questions stood out to you but I just started at the top and kind of jotted them down from top to bottom which which first was you know how how do you differentiate between um slow processing and disg graphia
Marcy:Â well they're they're very much the same issue if you do task analysis and you look at the input and the output so um disg graphia is a learning disability a specific learning disability where students have difficulty forming letters and that can be um sequencing you know literally knowing how to where to put the pencil to start the letter is it a bottom up or a top down is there a curvy linear line um so that is very specific to uh forming letters and numbers uh with paper and pencil and slow processing speed can uh impact that and also the um dyslexia can impact slow processing speed so students who have difficulty with writing we tend to bypass it by um having students start to keyboard as soon as possible or to use special pencil grips or to be able as we mentioned already dictate their answers so there's a huge overlap between slow processing speed and disg graphia mostly because of the motor response that we talked about earlier and I think the response that I gave when this question came up was you know just the importance of a thorough evaluation with some with a neuros pych or an edsy who really understands these issues very thoroughly and can really tease apart what's what's going on um because it can all these things do overlap and can get very complicated
Callie:Â absolutely and excuse me I want to say one more thing they're measured differently so dyslexia is you know the assessments for dyslexia are different than processing speed what about I'm sorry dis graphia
Marcy:Â yeah and it's the the um the assessments are different yes
Callie:Â okay um Are there specific assessments families should ask for to sort of sus that out
Marcy:Â um I would leave it up to the evaluator I I think sharing the OB observations of what's going on with a child uh when talking with an evaluator helps that evaluator decide which uh measures to use
Callie:Â well and then we had a couple questions around ADHD and you know whether untreated ADHD might impact processing speed and kind of on a similar note was you know if if phological treatment pharmacological treatment of ADHD could help with posit uh processing speed
Marcy:Â okay I have seen students who were diagnosed with ADHD and whose parents um put in place quite a few recommendations including medication and that student these students were able to answer questions with greater fluency so the oral fluency improved so the response time between being asked a question and responding to a question improved and also written response because attentional issues had improved so I have seen that there are gains but under those conditions so it's not a direct line because as I've mentioned the parents uh received quite a few recommendations and implemented them it wasn't only medication so it's not a direct line but I have seen students processing speed oral and motor uh improve once they are on the right medication and titration has occurred and it depends on any co-occurring issues and of course we should say we're not medical professionals so if medication is something you want to pursue make sure you're working with a good medical doctor or psychiatrist who can really help you figure out what's best for your child and monitor monitor that so
Callie:Â absolutely um one question that stood out to me because my child is like this he actually has I know often uh working memory and processing speed um are linked um but in my child's case and some some else asked this as well they have a superior working memory 99% but only average or low processing speed and how does that show up what kind of impacts might that have Superior working memory Superior working memory with slow processing speed both at the same time
Marcy:Â yeah see this is difficult for students you know so um Superior working memory uh indicates that that student can juggle that student can handle different elements uh simultaneously so those of us with Superior process working memory we're short order chefs we're airplane pilots we're parents um we don't let a lot of balls you know drop you know we're holding on to them those who have weaker active working memory tend to do deep Dives because they can do one thing really well and not juggle a lot of different pieces in their learning so that's a sign of it so um those who have really Superior working memory they can think of a lot of ideas but then when it comes time to produce their ideas it's really hard to move to production because it's so exciting to be thinking about that they're capable of it it's kind of what I was mentioning at the very beginning about preparing for a worksheet worksheets and students who have Superior skills are really tough to narrow down the answer because there could be multiple excellent answers so active working memory is about juggling processing speed is about the speed at which the answer is provided so um active working memory really um impact a learner because they've got these great ideas but it's going to be so effortful to produce them and so the what can talking about process
Callie:Â yeah what do you do to support that kind of learner
Marcy:Â so as with all students all twoe Learners it's really important that they know their strengths gifts and talents and they know what skills they can rely on day in and day out you can have this conversation with a very young child and also with an adult so what skills can they rely on that they know where they and then what skills need to be supported and where does that individual want the support to come from do they want the support to come from a parent and if so which parent a sibling a teacher if so which teacher who's the best delivery um does the student feel comfortable asking for help does the student know how to ask like literally know how to ask for help is it safe to ask for help um so you know there is a lot that we can do to talk about students learning profiles from a strength-based perspective knowing what what they can do easily and what they can rely on and what they need help with earlier you were talking about what are the adult tasks that would take us a long time or that we dread taxes being one of them so many of us do our own taxes and some of us are quick processing that because we've kept good records and we have good executive functioning skills other of us just throw up our hands and we hire a tax accountant and we're willing to pay that money and we have that choice so it's the same in talking with students but not in a shameful way but talking about a an asynchronous learning profile in a way where we ask the students how do you want to be seen how do you want to be seen by your teacher how do you want to be seen by your peers how do you want how do you want to see yourself as a learner a learner of the world not someone who gets to the answer quickly I didn't mention that there's always somebody in a class who's saying done finished hands up what do I do next and that can make other students who have slower processing speed feel pretty badly because they want to be the first to finish right so talking about what it means to finish first and what it means to finish second or last talking about racing but framing it in terms of a strength talents and interest so I doubt any of your kids have have talents and interests in actual race car driving I doubt it but that would be so great if they did but think about again um examples from nature and examples from what they love where does being quick matter and where doesn't it I can bet that Einstein who um you know we know as a learner had a lot of difficulties but yet made so many contributions to society we can bet he had slow processing speed right so how can we look at those of us that we admire in our society and and enable our kids to look up to those individuals as examples as models and as experts and
Callie:Â and kind of following up within this question there was sort of a question embedded within it which is that a child might have like a very Superior working memory but not have like I mean sometimes I mean honestly we we get emails from families who say like my child is in the you know second percentile the first percentile in in processing speed right like they're high and everything else and then they're super low but I think what more families face is something more like where they're really Superior in their working memory and they're more like low average or average in their processing speed and then schools just think that's okay that child's fine they're average here they're great there whatever you know but can that be enough of a discrepancy to really cause some of the the frustration that kids experience
Marcy:Â yeah absolutely you know if there's a one or a five as I showed you in this in the in the sample of the Whisk scores that it's as if that skill is not there and for a student who has Superior uh cognitive abilities that's really frustrating if a student has average processing speed but Superior cognitive abilities in the other indices that feels like a learning disability it feels effortful it feels hard to get started there's the comparison with others so um I think it's a big deal but then I work with students oneon-one and I'm not in a school district and districts will um interpret those scores in the way that you know they see fit so um it's important to understand the kind of inner workings of a student to know how impacted they are by these asynchronous skills you know is the point spread significant and even if it's close to significant we're asking kids to show what they've learned as a measure of assessment every day in school and so if if we had if we as adults had to face something we didn't like to do whether it's bik riding or some other motor activity like bowling I always recommend bowling for students to go out on play dates together because neither are going to be good at it you know they're going to have the bumpers and they're just going to be able to do their best you know and in a game like that does speed matter or does having fun matter so you kind of get where I'm going you know we we as parents have to look at what enables our children to maintain their sense of self and know who they are as a person who they are as a person in a classroom or in the school Community who they are within our family and not each of us are going to have equal ability we have to be able to celebrate what we each offer and focus on that as opposed to accentuating or focusing on what's not right what's not working what's not good enough that can create even more emotional issues and um often perfectionism is a part of this so we have to watch that carefully but again that's another topic
Callie:Â yeah I don't know if you had any other questions I have several so um well somebody brought up um is it common not to no slower processing speeds until Middle School
Marcy:Â um I noticed in general that I noticed many more things in middle school and my son got there that um weren't a problem in Elementary uh I don't know I I can see it in elementary um we're not looking for Speed in elementary they're still learning right and then in Middle School we're looking for more automization I mean that really is what middle school is all about and the load on active working memory in middle school is astronomical um so the expectations are different and I I had mentioned earlier about understanding the context of the age and grade level expectations um so yeah they may become more noticeable in middle school but I can see it in a student uh in their motor uh engagement uh in elementary I mean you can tell when when when you go different places you know you may have one child who just rushes out of the car barely looking to see if it's you know safe and you have another student who's observing and kind of hesitating and then you know is still standing next to you and there are different ways to kind of that wasn't an example of processing speed it's more an example of um you know visual spatial you know checking the environment and uh some attentional issues but they kind of all get mixed together in real
[1:17:01 — Q&A continued — supporting big projects, extended time, and closing thoughts] life
Callie:Â well and kind of related to um related to that I think you know as as kids progress through school their projects do get longer sometimes more complex more parts to them and so you talked a little bit about that but like how do you actually handle that so if you have a child you know they have slow processing speed and and you like celebrate everything that's great about them and you've got just a beautiful household going but there's a big project and you know it's coming and how what what should you actually do to support a child who has slow processing speed who now is facing facing that
Marcy:Â okay so I'm going to go back to that um colored Square about structuring time and space so getting started earlier and talking through or showing a list of steps so talking through or showing steps so these are kind of the same things we do for student who had has attentional issues because it structures and makes very clear expectations and then uh provides um it it enables us to provide feedback for each of those steps so students can keep moving along when there are attentional issues attached to SL processing speed kids find other things much more interesting than what's expected and um it requires the adults and the environment to really structure that time and space well now I think I'd mentioned that um we don't often have that time in life there's just so much to fit into a day but the more we are patient with ourselves with each other and with our children um and the more we're clear about those expectations the better so typically I like to make sure that a student has accurate perceptions for what the assignment will be so first of all are we thinking about the same assignment what will be required um will a parent need to take a trip to the store um you know does the student have to have other materials that they've got to gather somewhere at the library on school's campus or something um so what will be what will be entailed and then uh who's going to do it assigning who's going to do it if the student is going to need to read is the student going to need to interview is the student going to need to listen or watch so depending on what it is that the student has to do to take in the information then what are the choices for a student to show what was learned can there be options beyond the written response and and um that's really ideal for all kinds of asynchronous learners but especially those with slow processing speed so during that kind of a multi-step project that takes time where can that student be supported that would make uh things seem less effortful where where can a parent or even a teacher say how can I help you but I don't like to use the word help but how can I be of assistance what would you like me to do find out from the student what the student is excited about doing or what the student is willing to let someone else do I find working with uh clients um they don't want me to do their work for them like you know like I said earlier there's no crutch in this conversation everyone's worried about things being a crutch and not being the real world but the truth is is that students grow into these skills even if they continue to have slower processing speed but they grow into these skills and as soon as they're independent they're autonomous Learners which is our goal that's the goal of educational therapy so it's not forever so asking your child or asking your student how can I be of help to you or how can I be of assistance really gives an empowering sense to the student to make that determination but we have to have a strong enough relationship that we don't think that the student will take advantage and we have to have a strong enough relationship that the student isn't going to come to a different conclusion about that interaction we don't want a student thinking H I did it again I'm not good at this I don't want to do this have that dread have that avoidance have that negotiating rather we want to be teaching life skills which is how do you interact with another individual when we both need to work together and support each other that's the real world so I'm more interested in how students are integrating their learning experience in a way that maintains their self-esteem and self-confidence um then I am looking at specific processing because there's so much to look at
Callie:Â well I think what you're saying I I kind of want to tie a couple questions together and we probably have three or four more questions left just to give you a little sense for timing and and maybe think about your timing but I think what you're talking about too is like we talked a little bit about self- advocacy but are there like specific ways um kids at different ages whatever can talk about their slow processing speed and what their needs are because it's slow process process speed isn't always something that's really well known but there must be ways for kids to words and language kids can use so that they can help people understand what will help them be at their best and this sort of ties into a question that someone asked about about college you know and this feeling that maybe there are a lot of accommodations you can ask for in high school but then what happens in college if if professors aren't as flexible which hasn't always been my experience I see a lot of professors a lot of colleges really embracing Universal Design for Learning but you know there will be those situations throughout your life where you're going to run into people who don't understand or maybe aren't as flexible and you need to explain to them what will help you work and self- advocate so what is like language you might recommend or what what do you coach kids to say
Marcy:Â um okay I want I I'm going to answer that in a sec but something's caught my eye um and it's in the chat oh my gosh where did it go um okay where do you find trained people okay I wanted to say something you know um as educational therapists rarely does a student come to us to work with them on slow processing speed that's just that just isn't how it happens we might have students come to us because they need support with school handing in assignments on time um you know we we aren't looking at processing speed per se but we have to identify what it is that's getting in the way so to focus in on processing speed in and of itself is kind of missing the bigger picture which is what the context was that I was referencing earlier so I just wanted to make sure I clarified um that it's processing speed in relation to school functioning um so you know what is good language so you know a student um might be able to say I really am excited about this project it may be um such a huge project that I don't know if I have the time to complete complete it you know it needs to be handed in on Friday or it needs to be handed in in two weeks so asking the teacher you know a question about do you think this is reasonable within this time frame I know it takes me longer to do something than most I mean gosh doesn't that sound adultlike wouldn't you love to hear your child say something like that so that would require a lot of support a lot of you know parents or teacher supporting a child to have that much confidence in a learning situation um so we're really talking about building confidence and saying things like I I know I can do this but it may take me longer or I know I can do this but I may need to talk about it with you first before I get started or I know I can do this but I may need someone else to write it for me or I know I can do this but so it's it's indicating what I am able to do and what I know combined with where it's very effortful and where I'm going to need support it's a very balanced way to ask a question it's a very balanced way to self- Advocate if I went to a university instructor and I and and just threw up my hands and say I don't even know what to do like the university instructor is not going to want to help me out first of all because I look unregulated right but if I go to a university professor and I say you know I've read the chapter and I answer the questions at the end of the chapter and I felt like I understood it but then when you discuss this concept in class today I felt lost again now the instructor has a place to start because the instructor knows what I've done and that I've made some effort towards that goal I've talked about my process and then the instructor can jump in it's not too big of a question and it's not too small of a question where the instructor can just send me back and say well just look on page 72 or look at the chart on 104 so looking at the context and having words to describe um a learning while that isn't judgmental is key and usually when we are in a rush and we are being demanding and we want our kids to get ready or to go or to you know whatever um that's not the time when we're at our best selves so we have to remind ourselves what are the words that we want our child to internalize that the more you can be non-judgmental the more you can be clear in expectations and the more you can um really feel for what the child is going through and we're working together as a team and there's a sense of belonging and a tremendous amount of support so I'm hoping that I give you enough examples for a young child as well as for an adult that you have a sense of how to use words that really encourage acceptance and excitement and knowing that you know we don't have that option every day and every night in our lives we we just we're just human but we've got to do the best we can
Callie:Â Marcy one thing you sparked for me is my son was having a lot of meltdowns when homework was assigned and it was because he is has slow processing speed he wasn't able to articulate I know this is going to take me forever um but after having the conversation which I hope he can have eventually on his own but with the teachers to help them understand what's going on when they're assigning homework they actually came up with the idea of creating a study hall for him and that has been life-changing so he now knows when he's assigned the homework that there's an extra time during the day that he will have to work on it and he doesn't have to have a meltdown um so anyway just wanted to throw that out there as an option for people because that was um lifechanging for us
Marcy:Â so again I want to just kind of break that down so there's an extra time and space built into the day where kids aren't in trouble because they needed more time and then they're completely free to do what they love outside of school so when I was talking about structuring time and space that's a beautiful example not all schools are set up that way so if at home you're doing homework and other kids are in the family are finished with their work and they're playing in the background that's going to compound the difficulties the child with slow processing speed has so I had talked about earlier about what motivates your child and thinking about what what can be done at the end of that homework period or that homework time sometimes just having that child get through the work as quickly as possible is best so you can make that determination on the day it doesn't have to be that way every day but you can say it sounds like there's something fun that we can do as a family let's finish this as quickly as we can how can I be helpful
Callie:Â love it so I I know we I want to be mindful of time I don't know there's a couple questions about oral um uh processing speed one says when your child asks a question it takes when you ask a question it takes the child so long to answer like how was your day what was your favorite part of the birthday party is it best to just wait and wait if it takes so long to answer is it to prompt socially this can be a big issue where they get left behind in a conversation
Marcy:Â okay that's a fantastic question and that kind of veers us into language processing you know which is a whole another subject so it's important first of all to recognize the type and again I'm doing the same thing I do as I've shown you earlier tonight which is what's being perceived and what is the out what is the expected outcome so the child is perceiving a very open-ended question and that can be difficult for some students for a lot of different reasons so it's really important to ask a question that is answerable without it um without it opening up so many options so instead of saying how your a tight question he says ask my son says ask me a tight question right
Callie:Â oh yeah perfect asking a tight question
Marcy:Â so just like the example of going to an instructor and saying I don't know what to do you know that's not you can even do that with your spouse it's not going to be met with a very a very positive reaction I don't think so you know for a child you know you really do want to um oh I just lost my train of thought so what was your question again I apologize
Callie:Â it was how to help a child who's taking a long time to answer basic questions like how was the birthday party how was your day
Marcy:Â yeah so you know instead say who did you sit with at lunch today so the assumption is that something positive happened you know or you know anything that's like that so some a question where there are two known answers not like 400 unknown answers there are also emotional issues now sometimes parents have the need to know and I know none of you here are like this but you know parents have the need to know and you're asking in the car on the way home your child's not thinking about it in that moment right so be talk think about time and space When's the best time to ask a million questions this is executive functioning again but a lot of parents uh have things in their mind while they're in the car their child doesn't of course but they want their child to remember to do this and do this and do this when they get home the parent feels relieved because it's been said and then everyone gets home and the child has no memory of what was discussed right so I'm no longer answering your question y I'm answering a different question but it's like what does the parent need and and being able to be being able to perceive is this my need as the parent or is this my child's need we haven't talked about it I think we could donate another night to this but you know who's needed is this so parents want to know that the day was great and and we think we're going to be satisfied by asking an open-end question and being relieved of our anxiety and for kids with language disabilities that can be very difficult to answer and it can be very emotional and loaded because the kids know what you really want to know and maybe it didn't happen that day so how are there other ways to connect and uh find out how the day went if a parent is anxious can you email a teacher and just say how did my child do on X Y or Z and then you have that background knowledge can there be other ways that you and your child connect on on activities that you both love as a family so I know that just opened up a whole another you know no but you
Callie:Â totally hit the nail on the head for me and this was someone else's question but I do that to my kids on the way home how was cool how was this and how was it and they're like ah stop
Marcy:Â yeah because then we make the kids and I'm not saying anyone here of course but we make the kids look like they have attentional difficulties you know because we have these unrealistic expectations that they're going to hold on to something we've said in the car when we get home and that's no longer the same context I'm I'm as I've mentioned I'm older and so I'm now getting you know clients and colleagues who are texting me you know I'm holding up my eyewatch and I'm finding that when I get to another office I've forgotten what I got in the text you know what I mean it's like I have to learn that skill to hold on to a text because when I get to the next office I'm looking at my emails right in the old days we had phone messages who has those anymore so we have to kind of teach ourselves a way to remember a new Behavior so that for me texts don't fall off of my uh frontal lobe but I'm no longer seeing them so it's the same thing as parents and children and pretty soon our children will know much more about technology than we were ever trained to know so there's this nice kind of relationship we can have with with kids and you can ask your kids and again it's getting a little late but you could ask your child when I want to remind you when do you want to hear it do you want to hear it in the car or do you want to hear it when you put your backpack down you know you can ask your child do you want to talk about going on a trip now or do you want to talk about going on a trip at dinner or do you want to talk about it at dinner or at bedtime a lot of kids who have anxiety don't really want to talk about that at bedtime but you know you get the idea you're giving the child choice we're going to talk about it but when is it best for you and when we start to do that as we with a spouse or a colleague then we're showing a tremendous amount of respect it's not just a demand do it do it this way do it my way again I'm not talking to any one of you here
Callie:Â I love that though that that's true I like that the the respect and it is getting really late I'd love to end with one last question I'll do my best which is you know I think one thing that that comes up a lot with kids with slow processing speed or with any other number of learning differences is extended time more time and I'd love to hear if what are alternatives or why why should you ask for for it what what are alternatives because we know so many twoe kids don't want extended time or they don't use it um or they won't use that kind of accommodation so are there other things that they should be asking for instead or should we is there language we can use to help them understand that extended time is whether it's on a test or extended deadlines or whatever I mean we we just heard from twoe kids that all it does is make work pile up or they don't feel like it's there if they get more time on a test than someone else
Marcy:Â so okay I'm going to unpack that because there are a couple of different answers to that seem seemingly simple question the first thing I want to say is that I always want to make sure that uh when I write up a student's plan that the maximum number of minutes allowable is on there so if it's 50% or 100% I just want to make sure that that student has it they may not need it but they know they have it if they do need it okay that's the first thing so from from that perspective I want to make sure that students are eligible for what they are eligible for now the next aspect is how the students think about extended time so it's going to be different from student to student some students who are have Superior language skills May believe and again we're talking about accurate perceptions again but some students may think that they're unfair because not everyone has access to them if that's the case then they may reject extended time on that basis so we have to think about what makes sense for that student now a lot of the work that I do whether it's in clinical practice or at Bridges Academy we provide differentiation differentiation is that students get what they need in the moment they need it and what's it based on it's based on the respectful relationship between the teacher and the student so if the teacher says I'd like you to take time to do this now even though others are doing something else the student trusts the teacher enough to do it because it's a differentiation we reach the same end goal whether it's a differentiation or an accommodation but the delivery is really important so why would a student accept something they don't perceive as being helpful perceive as making them different from others or less than or unfair so we have to address each of these ways of thinking based on the individual student and I wouldn't blame a student for not wanting to do something that separates them from their peer group or does something that even the student may perceive that the teacher has a negative perception about right like we don't even know if the teachers are supportive of the um accommodation so again everything is relationship I think we can end the evening on that and answer every question that way it's all about relationship and um a student will be willing to do something based on how they want to be seen by others so the question isn't about you need this you must have it you know take it it's more about how do you want to be seen do you want to be seen as someone who knows this information and if so do you need more time to show that it's you know I'm talking about apples and oranges aren't I I'm kind of waxing poetic um in the in the daily life we have to look at all of these situations on an individual basis and again couch all of what we're talking about in context for that individual student because what might work for one student won't work for another I'm a um a proponent of extended time if there are high school students or middle school students that are feeling that it just there's a NeverEnding due date then again we're focusing on product and not as much on process so intervention can take place and by intervention I just mean a heart-to-heart conversation what might that high school student need what would be helpful and provide that student with the words to self- advocate so that more items are taken off their plate than remaining on just because the due date was extended so we're teaching life skills as adults what would we do if we felt overwhelmed with too many things at once we would take something off our plate kids don't have that option in school so it's all about problem solving based on strong relationships are respectful so good luck to all of you
Callie:Â thank you for ending on that note I think it's so important and I really appreciate you sticking around longer um to get some of those those questions in and um appreciate everyone who stuck here till the end we had 40 people who stayed until the very bitter end here the happy end as it may be um so thank you all so much for participating and asking such great questions and being a part of this night and talking about this really important topic there were Marcy just so you know because I know you couldn't see the chat all along there were a lot of very this is helpful thank you so much um this was so informative
Marcy:Â so I'm really pleased that was my hope I really hoped so because the world just feels like so much is out of control and processing speed can make us feel that much more so so I'm hoping that this was helpful and you know take each day as it comes thank you for inviting me it's a pleasure to be here thank you good night