2e Private School & Educational Options Panel (2025)

Parents of 2e learners often have trouble finding an ideal learning environment for their child. Should you stay in public school, try private school, homeschool, or try a unique school format? The answer is: It depends!

Hear from our panel of experts:

• Local schools consultant, Lauren Meltzer of Parent Resource Advisors, discussed 2e private school experiences.

• Local advocate and former educator, Heather Johanson of Mosaic Minds, shared insights on working with public schools and creative accommodations.

• Homeschool consultant, Lisa Jobe of Sequoia Gifted, explored alternatives to traditional education, such as homeschooling, dual enrollment, early graduation, and more.

Attendees learned about the pros and cons of various learning environments, the signs it was time to make a change, and the process of finding a good-fit school for their 2e learner.

Check out these posts for insights from our past private school panels:

• Private School for 2e Learners? Key Considerations

• 2021 Panel

• 2022 panel

• 2023 panel

• 2024 panel

Chart of local schools and remote 2e options: https://tinyurl.com/REELPrivateSchoolsList

Read the transcript here:

Welcome, REEL overview, services, events, and speaker introductions

Welcome, everyone. Thanks for joining us tonight for REEL’S 2E Private School and Educational Options Panel.

In case you're not familiar with REEL, we are a nonprofit in Silicon Valley that strives to ensure twice-exceptional students thrive in school by raising parent and educator awareness

An understanding of practical, research-based strategies to address their needs successfully. This is an example of what we do for parents tonight's talk. So just so we're all on the same page, many of you probably know this, but this is how we define 2E.

It is the combination of distinguishing strengths, high abilities or potential, and complex challenges such as dyslexia, ADHD, anxiety, autism, and more, and

We think of these individuals as green, combining the strengths and the challenges, and what makes these learners complex is that you have to address both of these, the challenges and the strengths, at the same time.

REEL provides many free parent services, including a speaker series like the one you're attending tonight, and we will post the rest of the season series shortly.

We also provide a bi-monthly parent support group online, a private Google group with over 900 members that ask and answer each other's questions.

A resource of,

containing all online resources that have been recommended in our community, so, occupational therapists, ed therapists, writing tutors. We also have… and an IEP guide, many online resources and articles about many topics. We also have a school list. Callie will post some of these in the chat so you can, learn about school selection related to tonight.

a list of local schools. And then we also offer small, paid, facilitated groups with our amazing Teresa, and one-on-one consultations if you'd like to speak, to anyone in the specific case of your child.

We recently put together these parent toolkits that you can download for free on our site, that cover all kinds of topics, like how to start the school year off right, all the way to how to get ready for college, and everything in between.

And as I mentioned, we offer this free 46-page IEP guide specifically made for twice exceptional learners. It is,

pertinent to California, but most of it would be applicable anywhere. You can get that again on our site.

We also provide educator services.

We do custom professional development. We just came from a workshop today. You can bring REEL to your school to learn more about choice exceptionality, neurodivergence, learning different simulations or other custom options. We provide a lot of online resources, recordings about how to help with writing.

And other, articles that can support your school. And we have a bi-monthly educator newsletter with all kinds of resources and tips for working with neurodivergent learners.

And we also have a… our free, model, educator model, that you can download, the Dear Reel model that talks about solutions for the classroom based on developing connection, embracing flexibility, attending to strengths, and reframing behaviors, with specific examples in elementary, middle, and high school.

So, we are already halfway through our fall events, but in two weeks, we are going to have a lunchtime talk with Teresa about 2E and self-regulation. On November 5th, we have an in-person event where you can experience the real learning difference simulation that we do with educators. This is the first time we're doing it with parents.

And then November 12th, we have our final talk of this, semester, Behind the Mask, Understanding Anxiety, Perfectionism, and Masking in Two-Week Kids with two amazing ladies.

And then November 6th is our final 2E Support Group of the year, all available on our website, and the recordings of all the previous events, if you missed them, are also available on our website.

You can join our Google group, you can follow us on all these socials, and see all of our previous recordings on YouTube.

And now I'm going to introduce our amazing speakers for the night.

So, we have Lauren Meltzer, who's the co-founder of Parent Resource Advisors, which helps parents of neurodiverse children find good fit private schools and resources. She is also a parent coach and educator for several organizations, including REEL, you can get a one-on-one consultation with her through us, and JFCS.

She received a master's degree in education from Harvard University and is a certified parent coach. Lauren has been a lifelong advocate for social-emotional learning and has played leadership roles for the parent organizations at the Keys and Synapse schools in Silicon Valley.

As the mother of a twice-exceptional and select…

intellectually gifted children who have one or more learning disabilities, daughter, she is passionate about helping families develop strategies to support their children's unique needs.

Heather Johansen is the founder of Mosaic Minds Consulting, where she helps families understand and support their neurodivergent learners. A former teacher and inclusion specialist, Heather has spent over two decades designing programs for students with dyslexia, ADHD, autism, and anxiety, always with a focus on strengths, connection, and collaboration.

Known for her warmth and creative problem solving, she helps parents and schools work together to create environments where every child can thrive. Heather is also a mom of three, and a lifelong learner who loves being outdoors, from gardening to hiking to planning her next travel adventure. I would like to hear where that is.

Lisa Jobe is co-founder of Sequoia Gifted and Creative, internationally recognized for her expertise in supporting gifted TUI families in both school advocacy and homeschooling. She is also the founder of Sequoia Gifted Academy, the first homeschool umbrella providing educational guidance specifically tailored for highly and profoundly gifted TUI learners. A former corporate attorney, Lisa pivoted to education two decades ago after raising her own profoundly gifted

to Chewie Sons with her husband, Greg, in Northern California.

She is an avid believer in the benefits of strength-based, interest-focused learning and personalized learning pathways, particularly for asynchronous learners.

And Lisa also has a… an amazing… if you… if it's okay, Lisa, I'm gonna summarize. She also… she has co-written chapters and books about gifted education. She's on the board of directors for the Gifted Homeschool Forum. Yeah, I think you're good. Okay, she has a lot of amazing accomplishments.

I am going to now switch to their slide deck, and I think Lisa's going to kick us off.

Lisa Jobe — Opening remarks, research, and the Five Environments for Growth

I am. I'm so glad to be a part of REEL. This organization is such an important piece of our community, not only in here in the Bay Area, in Northern California, but really nationally. So many families I know, perhaps, are even joining from other areas of the country, and I

I think I actually saw someone international in the chat, so welcome to everyone, and thank you to REEL for having me.

You know, oh, go ahead and you can flip the slides. So, one thing, the three of us are all in the same slide deck, so you'll hear us, give a little cue to slip, to change our slides here.

primarily with learners who have a disconnect with the traditional school system. So, today we're going to talk where, we're going to have, Lauren and Heather talk about the public school systems.

Particularly there in the Bay Area, and then the private school and those different options. And when you listen, you'll hear that a lot of the schools can overlap.

And, share a lot of commonalities. So it really isn't three silos. Today, I'm representing the third silo, which is that dreaded word that most gifted chewy people never even think of when they start their journeys.

And that's that word, homeschooling. So I'll talk about that later. But first, I want to jump in and just say, boy.

just about every one of us with two-y kiddos, I think, at some point wonders about whether we're in the right school system or school environment for our kiddos. And it's such a big conversation

that I actually did some research. I'm a doctoral student in 2E, I'm about to finish with Callie, and so I did some research last year to find out why are gifted 2E learners specifically changing schools frequently, and how often do they change?

And luckily, my case studies cover just about most of the common learning differences that our TUE learners have. And interestingly, there really wasn't a big difference between learning differences, or even learners who aren't diagnosed.

But what was interesting is that a lot of people think that we jump because of academics, and we know that the social piece, the emotional piece, and other parts of the learning environment are really important to our learners, and without that connection, it's really hard for them to thrive.

So go ahead and flip this slide for me, please, if you can.

And so, I guess I should have said on the last slide, too, just as y'all was sharing, you know, we think about the fact that a lot of our learners

are either being left out of the gifted program, or their learning difference might be creating a barrier of some kind. And so, when we think about having both their high abilities, their interests, their strengths.

met and matched and challenged in their way, and then also for them to be able to thrive and be successful with those learning differences, it takes a lot of movement, and a lot of thought. And I know a big question, I believe, that was coming in before this conversation was.

Well, when do we make a choice? When do we change?

So this is going to be something that I think we're going to talk about a lot more later tonight, but I just want to share just some kind of two cents as we're thinking about this going forward. Go ahead and switch this slide for me, please.

So, coming out of the Bridges community, which is the first graduate school specifically for 2E, and where a lot of our research on Twice Exceptional Learners is coming through, my mentor and chair, Dr. Susan Baum, and another renowned expert.

framework, and I know REEL uses this framework a lot, and I think it's really helpful for parents, as they're listening tonight, to think about this framework. Sometimes you may hear it called the 2E Friendly Environments.

Dr. Baum, because she's working on my dissertation with me, tells me the new name, or the official name, is the Five Environments for Growth.

So the concept here for all parents is that every TUE learner has 5 areas of non-negotiable needs that must be met for them to thrive and be their best.

And academic and cognitive isn't just a privilege, but it's a true need for most of our learners. So we know that burnout and bore-out can be similar physiologically.

So we want to make sure they're in that Goldilocks spot where they're learning without being overwhelmed, they're challenged without being bored, and so those pieces are always important to our TUE gifted learners.

The social part about feeling belonging, feeling that they're part of the group, feeling that they're understood by others, and that they, can form those relationships, that is another equally important aspect of our kiddos' learning environment.

get emotional. You know, if our kiddos have anxiety, if they're feeling overwhelmed, if they're feeling school reluctance, and certainly school avoidance, we want to make sure that when they are in that learning, that they feel that they are regulated, and that they can be their, best in terms of their well-being.

Then we have that physical environment. Interestingly, a lot of our 2E learners need a little bit different of something besides a standard classroom. Some may need some fidget space, or the ability to get up and take breaks.

I know my own TUE learner, who just graduated from high school, he prefers to work in the dark. I used to call it the cave, until I realized that that was his learning environment where he does best.

When he was little, his learning environment physically was hanging off the back of the couch, because he ended up homeschooling. So we know that that can look different for a lot of our learners.

And then another piece we just want to keep in mind is that creative piece, and that creative piece is really important. In fact, Dr. Daniels and Dr. Peters out of Summit Center have said… have written a book on creativity, noting that a lot of creativity

diminishes after 4th grade, and a lot of our TUI learners thrive in those creative environments, where they can use their originality, their deductive learning skills, all those pieces.

So I hope that as all of our friends, share together tonight, with all these different learning ideas, that you keep these five areas in mind for your own child.

And one more flip?

And I'll just very quickly, because I know it is on a lot of parents' minds as you look at this today, and this question, again, comes up all the time, when is it time to make a change? So I won't go into this completely right now, but I will just simply share, for those who have to run fast and don't get time to watch the video.

That really, there's often no ideal situation for any learner, but specifically for our out-of-the-box, unique learners.

So typically, I tell families that, to the extent that you can balance those five environmental needs, that's really important. But we always want to prioritize the emotional well-being. I don't think any of us, certainly I'm not a psychologist, I don't think anyone here tonight is.

So we don't mean to tread into that space, which of course is best for our professionals.

But in general, anxiety, school reluctance, school avoidance, those are all known to be signs that advocacy is needed, or that perhaps a change might be in the works.

So I think on that note, I'm going to hand this over and do I mean, is it Lauren or Heather, who's next?

Heather Johanson — Public schools: tiers of support, SST, 504, IEP, and advocacy

Because we're going to start in the public school realm, and that's sort of, I would say, probably my most… my area of most expertise after spending 25 years in them, and then spending the last 7 working as an ed consultant and advocate. This is sort of where I live a lot of the time, and kind of when we're thinking of our 2E neurodiverse learners.

I just kind of wanted to, like, kind of present it in, like, boxes and tiers, right? Kind of, like, where… where do we start? Where do we go in this process, right? And kind of at that bottom layer is our universal accommodations, those supports, and, like, I'm going to kind of answer, how do you even get that started? What do you mean? Like, what do I even do?

kind of the next level up is in kind of what we call a student study team or student success team, depending on which district you're working with, and then that section 504, and then finally IEP. I'm going to kind of talk us through each piece of how these

Layers in public schools could potentially help support your kiddos.

I mean, each of these boxes could probably be, like, an hour-long talk itself, so I'm gonna keep it kind of tight, but feel free to put questions in the chat. All right, Yayal, you want to flip for me?

Thank you. Okay, kind of, so step one, right? This is probably where you're maybe just… you're just

having that twinge of something's not going well, maybe you even haven't even talked to a doctor, you're just like, something doesn't feel right, I just want to reach out to a teacher. This is sort of step one, is kind of getting those universal supports in. About a month ago, I did a chat with REEL and PHP,

And it was all about writing collaborative emails. How do you get your teacher in on your side? And there's a little tiny URL right here on the screen where you can just pull… and I have a whole folder, like, where it's like, how do you write it? I have templates for you. I have templates for your kids to write letters to their… emails to their teachers. So all that's just stuck in that folder right there.

Just on kind of those initial communications, right? Because you really want to get that partnership going. Your teacher, especially in elementary school, you want that partnership with them, so there's a ton of good information in there. So kind of step one.

you're thinking, okay, if we just tweak this one thing, maybe things will be better. That's maybe where you reach out to your teacher, and you have a 15-minute meeting. It doesn't have to be huge, but just a 15-minute meeting. You say.

Hey!

Bobby, he's got some real sensory sensitivities, and so if you try these two things, I think things will go a lot better. Could we give him a whirl? 99% of your teachers are going to say yes, and there, you just try it and see how it goes. You didn't have to go through a ton of, like, meetings, whatever. This is, like I said, we're just sort of in the beginning, right? We're just trying some stuff out.

Or maybe you want to do… kind of take it up. You have, like, you have an OT you're working with outside of school, right? And maybe you can bring that OT in with your teacher, and you have another 15 to 20 minute meeting, and that OT just gives some great… brings in a box of fidgets and whatever this kid needs. It's not formal, just, hey, and it kind of keeps things really calm.

What this does, though, is even these little steps…

Sort of lay the foundation for, look, we're working really collaboratively, we're trying to work this out with this teacher, we're trying to get this to work.

before we kind of got to start going the more formal mess, it doesn't mean you have to start here. If your kiddo is in crisis, you're probably not going to start here, right? Like, you're going to probably try one of these other layers, but this is sort of just, like, that base layer.

Alright, Yael, next one.

So, step two…

A lot of families, by the time they're talking to me, do not want to do this step, and that's totally understandable, but, like, once again, if you're kind of like, okay, we're… I've talked to the teacher, we've tried a few things.

I need this to be way more formal. You can ask for what's called a SSD, Student Success Team, Student Study Team. Once again, everyone kind of has a different acronym for it. And this is where that formal documentation starts. Usually, it's kind of your teacher or teachers, if you're high school, middle school.

a high administrator, and then your school psychologist or a counselor, kind of depending on which grade levels, right? And in this meeting, they're going to take… they're gonna… they're gonna take a lot of data from you, right? They're going to tell us what's going on, what does this look like, they're going to take a lot of data, right? And then they're gonna… we're going to talk about a plan at the end of this.

going into that meeting, I would recommend if you have any reports from outside providers, like, let's just say you have a kiddo that's doing ABA,

bring that report with you. Or if you have a kiddo that's in OT, bring… it doesn't have to be formal, just can be… bring that and share that with the team. And then…

I would also suggest that you bring in some of your own data. It's really easy to kind of speak hyperbolically in these meetings. I'm a mom, I get it, I've been there.

But really, if you can kind of bring it in to, like, giving them real data, like, 3 out of 5 nights, they have a 20-minute meltdown over… and even if you can spit around the reading log.

that's great, right? We want to get really specific, and we want to give that team that data. So what you can ask for in this meeting, once again, all those informal accommodations. Could we try a wiggle seat? Could we try 15-minute breaks every 2 hours?

If you have a kiddo that is in that bored phase, say, hey, he's got these amazing math tangram things. Can we have those set up in the back, and as soon as he finishes this, could he do this? This is the time to maybe try something a little different, bring a little spice in for them.

Tier 2 supports, like, if your kiddo is one that's really struggling, if it's a really bright kid, but they're really struggling with, like, they have that dyslexic profile, maybe there is a reading group that they could join. These are all times to ask.

for what are the supports that aren't an IEP, that aren't specialists, what are the supports we can have my kiddo access? And then ask for that data to be tracked.

And then, before you leave that meeting, get another meeting on the book for 4 to 6 weeks, right? Because it's really easy to lose track. So, like, okay, great, when we come together? You have all those people, you get that done in that meeting. This really gives a nice, solid, concrete start to this process.

All right, yeah, y'all, next one!

Okay, Section 504. So, you… once again, maybe you've never had an SST meeting, right? But your kiddo…

you went and you had an outside evaluation. You've been noticing for a while things…

and, like, I'm gonna back up, I'm gonna put a pin there, I'm gonna back up. If you can go through these layers, I'm gonna tell you right now, your path is going to be much more streamlined, right? Because schools and these systems

really like for you to kind of go through their steps, right? It doesn't always have to happen that way, but if you can…

it does make the whole process a lot easier. If you've had an SST, you're more likely to sit down at a 504 meeting and have a 504 granted.

just kind of, once again, instead of trying to skipping right there. Doesn't mean you have to do it that way. If your kiddo's in crisis, absolutely not, but just something to kind of keep in mind. So, Section 504 is, basically, we are now in the place that, under the Americans with Disabilities Act, we're saying you're… this kiddo.

has to have accommodations to access their education, right? And I'm going to kind of give us a quick thing, is in the law, it says, basically, they need to have a major physical or mental condition that substantially limits a major life activity.

That term, substantially limits is so vague, and is interpreted so different depending on which table you're sitting at with which team. Here's the thing I think we need to remember, that basically, you don't… if your kiddo is getting good grades, but they're up till 4 o'clock in the morning every single night trying to get those good grades.

that it could absolutely help them qualify for a 504, right? Schools like to say, well, they're doing great.

But…

that is, like, part of the piece that they could… they may be exerting extraordinary effort and distress to kind of get there, so we could talk about what are the accommodations they need. Once again, this is where that paper trail is super helpful. We tried all these things, we've been working with you guys, obviously none of this is working, right?

once again, we could probably talk about this particular thing for, like, hours, and we don't have it, so I'm gonna kind of jump ahead.

So what do you do in a 504? You really formalize accommodation. And accommodations, I have ones that are very simple, like extended time, all the way to, like, sensory breaks built in at an interval are into a 504 accommodation.

the kind of unknown piece is that you can kind of have services very much in quotation marks, so they're not going to be written in as services. If there's kind of sneaky ones, you can kind of get sometimes into 504s of maybe having an OT, a behaviorist, an SLP, come and observe your kiddo.

And then consult with their teacher, right, as part of that 504+. Or weekly meetings with a counselor, a therapist, or a school psychologist, that can go into a 504.

Consultation with outside service providers, that's somebody… you're going to have the school psychologist touch base with the kiddo's therapist, like, once a month. That can kind of go into a 504. And academic supports, all those Tier 2 supports, those can also go into a 504. They're not going to be written as services, they're not guaranteed like an IEP,

But it's sort of like you're coming up with a plan, and that's why they're kind of services, like I said.

in quotations, but they can absolutely be built into a 5. You can make a 504 pretty darn robust.

Alright, and then finally, Yael, if you wanna…

the good old IEP, and this alone could take… we could go here for hours. So, how is an IEP and a 504 different?

is quali… basically, for an IEP, you have… there's a qualification under 13 different categories, right? There is a process to that. There's formalized testing, there's meetings, there's a lot that goes into that qualification process, right? And as if they qualify, then they have annual goals and services.

Right? So that's kind of, like.

variably kind of what an IEP is, right? So, how does a 2E child qualify for an under IEP under IDEA? Because a lot of times when I hear, like, when I'm kind of working on these cases, a lot of times, kiddos are kind of doing, especially in elementary school, you kind of see them, they're doing fine.

Right? They're doing fine. Like, when they do those academic tests, they're kind of falling in the average to low average range, and then they have these… some of these incredible highs, right? And they're cognizant… whoa, like…

So the team is kind of looking at you like, why are we talking about special education, right? So really what it needs… you need to really work with this team is to get them to use multiple pieces of data.

Right? So finding a standardized writing test that's really going to show dysgraphia, that's going to be hard to do, right? So it's really helped, like, bringing in a ton of writing samples.

Right? Making that part of the process, right? For them to see, oh wow, this dysgraphia is really intense. We're past the point of just needing some accommodations. This kid absolutely needs some services to help them with this writing process, right? So it's really sort of building

Outside of these standardized tests, a lot of that other data that we talked about earlier.

So, and then there's these other pieces that really kind of run into it, right? So, decoding the discrepancy model for qualification, right? So, the SLD qualification is the only one where the discrepancy model is still used, where you need those kind of, here's cognition, and here's a standardized score.

Right? So a lot of times, like.

When schools want to use that kind of universally, this is where we kind of want to pull out from just that discrepancy model, and once again, really kind of look at.

Callie Turk, REEL Team — Interjection

Heather, I think you muted yourself somehow.

Heather Johanson — Continued: IEP nuances and related services

How did I do that? That was impressive.

But yeah, just kind of that, once again, outside… all that outside data is going to be really important. A lot of the times, once again, kids don't… and then for the SAI, SLP services versus related services, this one comes up a lot, too, of, like, if…

a lot of times, kind of, the primary service is time with a special education teacher, right? That's like a pull-out where they're doing a small group.

And that does need to be part of an IEP.

But it can look a lot of different ways, right? Because if really what your kid needs is some OT, maybe some behaviorist, all of these other pieces, you can still get that SAI in as a consultation or some other ways with a special education teacher. Maybe they can do push-in.

To make sure you get that piece, so that you also can get those related services. And then this is the one I run into the most that's really hard, is… but I have an outside assessment that says my child has autism, or ADHD, I should just get an IEP.

Right? And this one's the hardest, I think, for families, is because they've gone through this whole process, they've got this beautiful neuropsych report in their hand, they're like, here!

And because of the way IDEA is written, a school still needs to go through their own assessment, even though they're going to take your assessment into account, but they're going to go look through it, and they're going to look at those 13 categories and the qualifications for those 13 categories, and if they don't meet those criteria.

they probably aren't going to qualify. There's a million ways we can kind of work around that, but it's just something to kind of think… I think, keep in mind, because I've seen so many heartbroken parents of, like, well, I've got this neuro… neuropsych, and it says my kiddo has dysgraphia, they should have an IEP.

And if they can't… if we can't make it work through those 13 categories and their qualifications, they probably aren't going to qualify for an IEP. So just really keeping in mind neuropsych report doesn't guarantee IEP, and I just think that's a good thing for families to know as they go into that process, so it's not like this is the most heartbreaking thing ever.

Alright, I, like I said, I breezed through probably, like, so much information, and there's, like, I could go deeper than we ever would have time for, but that's kind of just, like, in terms of schools, right? So then you've done all these things, and it's not working. You have got an IEP, you have maxed out all the services.

It's not working. I'm gonna bring up our next presenter to talk about what to do next.

Yael Valek — Transition to next speaker

Lauren?

Adam, we don't hear you.

Oh, there you are.

Lauren Meltzer — Private school selection: pros/cons, types, and visit tips

I don't… so it… I don't know what's happening. It just did it… had a mind of its own, I wasn't touching it.

So, anyway, so I'm gonna talk tonight about,

the… some tips, tricks, and trends in the private school selection for twice exceptional kiddos. You can go ahead. And we've, you know, as Heather kind of talked about navigating the public school districts,

I see a lot of people, when now they want to start to explore private school. So, what are the…

Why, why private school? Well, to begin with, the classes…

are going to be guaranteed smaller. So, in some cases, it could be 6 kids, in some kids, in some cases, it could be up to 20 at the most, but generally, it kind of floats around 15.

The focus, can… depending on the type of school, there's different… we're going to go into the types of schools, but they can be more specific to the needs of your child.

In the private schools, the teacher-student relationships are strong. The teachers tend to, and the staff tends to know all the students, and vice versa, and it's lovely.

And there's no teaching to the test. I mean, sometimes private schools will have tests that they're matching to just make sure the kids are on track, but really there's more room for creativity.

The cons are that because there's a smaller group for your kids.

There's less variety in terms of who your kids can hang out with.

Also, unfortunately, sometimes, administration or teachers will decide, you know what, we thought your kid was a great fit, but we're seeing that they aren't, and they can kick you out. They'll just say, this isn't a good fit, we think you need to look elsewhere.

There's less resources in a lot of cases than public school, unless you're in a very specific kind of school for a certain learning challenge. And of course, the expense, although there are workarounds. I think there's more latitude in the Bay Area in terms of getting some, financial support.

But, anyway, so those are kind of the general pros and cons of private school.

Yeah?

So, in terms of selecting, here's some of the realities.

You want, as everyone has mentioned, it's really important, the most important thing is that you find a place where your child can feel safe, accepted, and understood.

Without that, it doesn't matter. And then the next is really some kind of, you know, a place where they can blossom and grow, creatively, intellectually.

One other thing I think's really important to keep in mind is that

I work with a lot of schools where one student has left.

they didn't like it, but it's the perfect place for another student. So, if… as you're kind of thinking about different private schools, keep in mind that, you need to look for your child and not get too… into…

You know, if you've heard a couple people, it wasn't a good place for them.

Not all schools will accept your child, and so thinking out of the box can be really good, and that's what Lisa could help you with.

Also, it's best not to… a lot of people ask me, should I hide my child's struggles?

And this kind of gets back to what I was saying about, you know, that the private schools can kick you out. It's best to really be forthright with what your child struggles with. Some people prefer not to say a label, and that can be fine, but you need to… you're interviewing the school as much as they're interviewing you.

And so you need to find out if, indeed, what your child struggles with. Or, you know, needs acceleration is, is something they can offer.

you know, one thing that, again, has been brought up, and I just want to emphasize, is there's not going to be necessarily… unfortunately, for two-wee kids, there's very few, like, bullseye schools. But you can think about what is the best for your child at the moment, and go with that.

And as… yes, so indeed, it's not necessarily a forever situation, but what's the best for this year? And realizing that priorities might change.

Gail, can you bring up the next one.

So, where to start?

I like to tell people to be a detective before you start looking at schools, really think about what kind of environment your child thrives in. Is it small group environments? Is it environments where they get to have, you know, get their wiggles out?

Is it environments where, there's a lot of creativity versus more structured?

Think about, you know, if they've… even in preschool, you can start getting an idea about where your kid is their best.

And then also think about words that describe your child, and don't describe your child. And I say this because, like, a lot of times when you start to talk to schools.

You can ask them, like, who… what is… what is one thing about your… about the kids at your school that is a must-have?

And they might say something like flexibility. They might say something like curiosity, self-starter. If these aren't your kids, it's a good sign that this isn't the best place for you. So, coming up with words that describe your child and don't describe your child is really helpful.

And then likewise, what's working with your child in their current environment versus what's not working?

So, if they, if you love… if they love how, recess and the way they structure recess works really well for your child, well, figure out why, and see if you can find that kind of thing in the…

schools you're looking at, and what's not working? Like, if there's… they're in a classroom where they don't get any breaks, that's good… good feedback.

And then also, what support do they need at this moment? A lot of times, people ask me, is this a good school when they're looking at elementary for, would this school be still good if they have a high school? Focus more on what they, you know, does the school provide what you need right now?

What kinds of schools actually are available, and also think about your family values. And when I say that, I'm talking about, like.

Are you willing to drive different places? Are you, do you want a kind of school where there's… where there's a big community? Is that important to you?

Do you, like, do you have a certain amount of money that you want to spend on education? Those are all important things when making choices.

And then also, what kind of…

children that your child gets along with.

And can you, you know, if they really get along with other neurodiverse kids, or if they really get along with sporty kids, you know, make sure that you're keeping track of who's at this school you're looking at, and that you're seeing those kinds of kids on the playground, or hearing about them.

And then, this last thing I love, I heard this at a conference recently, thinking about who your child is on their best day and on their worst day, and making sure that the school can accommodate both.

So, those are the kind of detective work you should do. And Neal, can you want to move to the next…

So there's different kinds of schools to consider, and there's overlap within these, but generally, there's schools that specifically say, I'm for the twice-exceptional child.

And then there's schools that are for specific learning challenges. There's schools for gifted children. There's mainstream schools that have accommodations, micro-schools, and kind of this online hybrid.

Those are the categories.

AL?

So, in terms of the twice-exceptional schools.

there's a lot of schools out there that say they're… well, there's not a lot. There's a handful of schools that say they're for twice exceptional, but these can mean different things to different schools. So, in some cases, it can mean, like, they just have accelerated,

curriculum. In other cases, they might, talk about everyone there is kind of like-minded in terms of, they're kind of all this, you know, they have a similar profile, and that's comforting.

In other cases, you know, there's a universal design that they've, and that there's an understanding in terms of how to communicate with the students. And in some cases, there's also support from a learning specialist.

But, it's important when you look at the twice-exceptional that you kind of go a little bit deeper, and we'll talk about this a little later, because they can mean different things to the different schools.

Next.

Now, there's also specialty schools that support specific challenges, and depending on, what your, you know, in addition to being gifted, what also makes your child twice exceptional, if that is a real need, you might explore these schools.

in these schools, you're going to get real wraparound support, whether it's a dyslexia school, or ASD, or behavioral, so that's…

wonderful. You're gonna have a community that really understands your child.

Adhd is generally a comorbid condition that always, that they all say yes and.

One of the things that's nice about these schools, too, is that the peers tend to be open-minded about differences.

So unlike, other schools where there's not, where there's more, neurotypical kids that might, see your child, as a less than, these kids all really, appreciate that they have differences and the other kids around them do, too.

And so because… and so because of that, kids feel like they belong.

Sometimes these schools, though, will be limited in classes and electives offered.

Next.

Then there's also schools for gifted children. These tend to be slightly faster-paced to be interested… interesting to the gifted child. A lot of these schools will be wary of any behavioral issues.

So, they might say that they'll take a twice-exceptional child, but they're also, depending on how your child shows up, they might not really be that receptive. And a lot of these schools, an IQ test would be also needed.

Okay, next.

And then there's these micro-schools, and these are popping up all over the place. They are small, like, when I say small, I'm talking about there could be 8 kids at the school, there could be

15 at the most. And they lend themselves… the nice thing is they lend themselves to more customized curriculum, because they have so few children that a lot of times when I talk to the people, you know, that are running these schools, they'll be like, well, if, you know, Tommy needs this, we can give him this, because they, you know, they have so many… so few children.

Generally, there's a range of ages and abilities there. They don't think, okay, we just have 4th graders. A lot of times they'll, blend, K through 2 and 3, 4, 5. If they go higher, you know, then a little middle school.

They're flexible. The nice thing is they're flexible about, students attending part-time or full-time. So if you are coming from homeschooling and want to be in a more micro-school environment where your child would have more socialization, they understand that, and it's a really nice step.

Next step.

Oops, not quite.

And there's a range of backgrounds for teachers and staff, so a lot of these schools, you'll see that parent… the teachers don't necessarily… they might have a teaching credential, or they might have a PhD in something, and just be an expert in something, and so that's lovely.

So… yeah. Okay. Yeah.

And then there's what I call, like, these nice mainstream private schools, and these are schools that aren't necessarily, created for the twice-exceptional learner, but they can work. And, they tend to be, like, just have a, like, nice

like, the people there, the teachers there, the culture is supportive and nice.

The… and it can work, but it's… one of the challenges is that it's not… a lot of these schools don't have that many neurodiverse children.

They might say they have a lot, but it, you know, the ratio is, you know, 20%, so there could be, you know, 1 to 5. So…

When you're in a private school where there's not that many kids to start off with, it might, you know, it's just gonna limit, again, your pool of kids like your child.

And because of that, there tends to be a bit more ableism, unless they've been trained otherwise.

And they're also…

can be, it's… what I say about the mainstream schools is if they have, your child's interests, they can really work. But if they don't, they can… it can be kind of a hard place for your child. They might not find their people.

Keep going.

Yeah?

And lastly, there's these online or hybrid schools, and these.

are, you know, these are nice for students who either want one-on-one support, or one-on-one kind of, teaching, or they want, an option for flexibility so that they can kind of come and go. And they're, you know, tend to be virtual.

In some cases, it's a combination of virtual and one-on-one in person. The interesting thing is that there can, in spite… even if they are virtual, they can still have a community, and some of these places will even bring people together for events.

They also, have a range of ages in the community, so, and because they… their communities aren't large, they're more like micro-schooly, you might have… the community might be 6th through 12th grade, and, like, a real combination.

People that tend to do this tend to supplement hobbies outside of the school setting, because there's, you know, the, again, the…

Electives are more limited than you'd find in, for example, a public school or even a private school.

Next.

So, when you visit, which this is, I know this is school, the time when everyone's looking for their next, you know, for a private school, here's some tips.

Get a real understanding of… from the… from them about

how they understand or don't understand what it means to be twice exceptional. And that really has partly to do with, can they communicate to these children in a way that the kids feel seen?

And that there's not… that the kids are not feeling less than, depending on what their situation is.

That there's other kids look out, as I mentioned, look for other kids they might like. You want to find teachers that look for the best in children and see whole kids.

And that there's resources and flexibility, in the class for your kids' style. Universal design is great. You want to make sure that there's a parent community that embraces all kinds of kids.

And then, as I mentioned before, that there's room for growth and blossoming, and offerings that match,

Your child's interests.

So… next, I think, yeah, that's it.

Lisa Jobe — Homeschooling: philosophy, models, examples, California options

Alright, so, I am coming to end here, and let me just say, this might be where people go, oh my gosh, I could never. So, let me just start by saying…

These are some of my kiddos in these pictures, and I am the world's biggest planner, so I used to be a corporate lawyer, so that just tells you how Type A I am.

And I admit often, that I, when my oldest was, 2 years old, I sat for 4 hours in a snowstorm, trying to get him into his private preschool so that his entire K-12 journey would be, solved.

And he's… and he wasn't… he isn't even my two-week kiddo, and we switched schools, I think, 9 times before he graduated.

So, you know, a lot of… I would say, most gifted and 2E homeschoolers are different than the average, general population when we think of homeschooling. And the…

Recent studies say that there are probably more than 100,000 gifted 2E homeschoolers in the United States right now, and that's growing because, you know, we can create these environments that fit our kiddos' needs.

So, before I get into that, I did want to just mention that with the homeschooling, and what's interesting is that I now work… I think I've worked with 300, different learners across the nation who are all in the top 1 percentile on their intelligence, exams.

Most of them 2E, and almost all of them end up homeschooling for the various reasons that we know as they are looking for these different schools and things.

So, before I lose a lot of you, I want to suggest that a lot of what we're… I'm going to talk about in the next 5-10 minutes can be applied also to those in after school, weekend time, summertime, all those ways in which we can, help our learners to grow and thrive.

So, a couple pictures here. I like pictures. I know we're handing these, to everybody. These are my kiddos with different, homeschool friends as they were, going through their homeschooling journeys. One is now 21 and a second-year law student, and the other one just graduated

from a homeschool charter, here in California is now in university. So, lots of different social pieces that gifted homeschoolers and twice exceptional homeschoolers can do.

Let me skip… oh, go ahead and, jump me, please, y'all. Yep.

So, where I come in with this, when I was doing my, beginning of my, doctoral studies, this, idea or framework really hits to me, and it's this idea coming from Dr. Armstrong of positive niche construction. And when he's talking about our 2E learners specifically.

He's borrowing from biology, and that idea that organisms and animals really thrive when they can create their own surroundings. And same thing can apply to education.

And I like this idea of, instead of creating or making our learners fit an educational environment.

To somehow make it, whether it's through advocacy, like we just heard about, or pulling them out part or full time, creating an educational environment that fits our learners.

So here, you can see, this is actually the same kiddo at different years, and he's the one who liked to learn best hanging upside down off a couch, so that was his best fit at the time.

Go ahead and switch for me, please.

So, homeschooling is really strength-based, interest-focused learning at its core. I did a two-wee conference, at William & Mary, my first one, and I, used the term personalized learning, and a bunch of classroom teachers said, that's not… that's not personalized learning, you're doing homeschooling.

And, we thought, gosh, we're using the wrong term, but there's really no… no more pure, personalized learning, than creating this a la carte methodology for our kiddos.

So we really, one of the benefits of having a little bit more of this child-centered time, or creating this environment for them, is this idea that, especially with their high abilities.

These kiddos thrive on time and space, whether it's time and space to process, or to explore, or to discover their interests.

There's a gift of time that we can create in these different pockets when we think about, the space where they can, you know, explore and discover what interests they have that are valuable.

And that they're not just, you know, able to… these interests can be valuable and not be, in those four core subjects of, you know, math, ELA, science, and social studies, right? Here's my kiddo who has insisted he's not going to be an engineer because he doesn't want…

somebody to tell him how to do engineering, but he is spending a couple weeks capturing NOAA data from a satellite, and won some national award for creating some system for fire-ravaged communities.

But again, he needed that space to be able to tinker and do something on his own where he couldn't find a class to teach it.

So, when we think about opportunities to… for our learners, whether it's homeschooling or in different environments, one of the, core frameworks for education is this idea of self-determination theory and motivation.

And when we have space, we can really help our learners to focus on intrinsic motivation, or love of learning, and not just be capturing those grades or feeling like they're identified by labels.

Which we know labels happen in life, but to take a little bit of that pressure off can be really, enlightening, especially for our 2E learners, who sometimes live under a lot of labels and pull-outs and things like that.

Page flip, please.

Thank you. So you do not have to read everything on this page, but I really like thinking about homeschooling as an a la carte model. Contrary to that image we all have of jumpers and apple pie.

Most of our gifted and chewy homeschoolers actually end up either farming out or picking and selecting what's great out there for our kiddos. And so, just like at a buffet, I might take 3 desserts and…

only eat one and put two on the side of my plate. That's perfectly okay when you're doing this a la carte type of learning.

And so, just as Lauren and Heather mentioned, between microclasses and online, and one-on-one, and tutors, and all these different ideas, you can pick and choose what works great for your kiddos.

Some of my PDA, friends who are young, some of them really thrive on online classes or in one-on-one. Others really thrive only in, you know, live, right, person-to-person.

Most of my learners, actually, who are 2E really thrive also in dual enrollment once they get to 9th grade, and a lot of them are able to do dual enrollment, under different exceptions before 9th grade.

Oftentimes, our early college or our dual enrollment fits our TUE learners better than a traditional high school. That college setup tends to work better with all that executive functioning that we think about that's really hard, especially in those middle and high school years.

So, there's lots of different opportunities here. Go ahead and flip, please.

And so, if you think about it, that you're not just buying curriculum or doing what everyone did at COVID, but you're really thinking about what is this child's interests, what are their strengths.

How do they like to learn? When do they like to learn? What would I like to teach? Or maybe I have a full-time career and my spouse does too, and what… what other opportunities do we have to make homeschooling work?

And it works really well with all sorts of different types of, ways. I had a friend who was a doctor, and her husband was an attorney, and they did a lot of their schoolwork with their learners on the weekends.

I have several families who are world schoolers. One's teaching on a yacht, as we speak right now, and others are flying between different houses in different continents. So there's definitely different ways you can make this work.

Again, I'm just throwing some slides in here. I know we're going to share the slides later, so just some ideas of thinking outside the box in what a journey of learning might look like, besides just being at that kitchen table.

So we'll go ahead and skip ahead for now.

This is a kind of a fun thought for anyone who is thinking, what the heck is homeschooling? This is one of my favorite examples of a curated science semester for a two-week kiddo who has a really specific interest, because a lot of ours do.

This kiddo knew more, he was 9, and he knew more about mushrooms than I think all of us here in this Zoom together. And so, when we think about homeschooling for this kiddo, he had, or she had, a specific curriculum.

They had a one-on-one mentor.

Which, by the way, the science museums and the parks have a lot of expert docents, many retired, who will definitely talk to our kiddos happily for free or a small cost about their passions.

This one had at-home, labs.

Some online courses through what we call MOOCs. Harvard and other schools have a lot of free online classes. Now that you can audit, you know, get credit, but you can certainly learn a lot.

Audiobooks, documentaries, and then learning outside the box a little bit with this kind of moving him into trees.

So there's ways you can kind of think about and mold and try different things with this a la carte approach to see what works and what doesn't for your learners. And again, this is something you can apply whether you're choosing to homeschool all the time.

Whether maybe you have an agreement with the school you can pull out part-time, or something to add on, extra for some of that, enrichment.

Turn the page, please.

So, benefits of homeschooling. Again, here are my kiddos. There's, the one in his makerspace, where he spends a good portion of… or he spent a good portion of his high school time. He's also a regional leader in scout, so there's lots of leadership opportunities for homeschoolers.

He's also on swim team for 15 years, and then he became a coach on the swim team.

So definitely, all those opportunities you could have in traditional school, you can have as a homeschooler.

One of the beauties for a lot of our TUI learners when they become homeschoolers is they realize that they don't need 504s or IEPs or pull-out programs anymore, and that can be very liberating for a lot of them.

This guy here, he's severely dysgraphic, but it didn't, stop anything that he did. We just didn't have as many.

Or really didn't have any worksheets and things that he would typically have needed to do in school. He also took several APs, which may have been barriers for him in traditional school.

He started college at 13, and we did go through those paperwork processes so that he could have accommodations at College Board and in college, and those are really easy to do, even as homeschoolers.

A lot of my learners are very asynchronous, and that's especially true of our 2E kiddos, where they… a lot of them are maybe 11 and doing calculus, but they're writing, like, they're, you know, in 4th grade standards.

Super normal with our two-e kiddos, and homeschooling can do that really well. Transcripts also have a little more flexibility, even in high school for that.

So that flexibility can really make it very easy. A lot of the kiddos that I work with, now that they're starting to connect, I usually don't even introduce them by age or grade, because it really doesn't define them in any way. It's the interests that really define them and help them connect together.

Let's see, and then, when they go back to school, that's usually very easy. When they go back, even in the middle of high school, it's a little bit harder, but there's a lot of ways they can do that. So you can always go back to school.

And just like with any program that we're talking about here today, your public district home school always has to take you.

So you always have a fallback when, that you can at least, you know, say… say to them on their… on your bad days, right?

It really does help our learners discover their passions and to fall back in love with learning, and that's really what we want as they head off after 12th grade, or whatever we consider to be the end of their schooling before they have, before they chart their own path.

Can you flip the page for me, please?

There are… I see a question that I… I can't read at the same time in chat, so if you ask me later, I… I promise…

Sounds great. Alright, there are 3 ways to homeschool in California, so if anybody is thinking about that, I just want to cover this super quick for you.

So, in California, you can homeschool completely independently, and I know this is pretty shocking to a lot of people, but really, you don't have to teach them, your children.

Standards, you don't have to do testing, you really have a lot of freedom.

Which means that you can also graduate them whenever you want, and that is an official graduation under the state, and officially it is a transcript when you do it. You don't have any reason to follow A to G standards.

You don't have any value in choosing an accredited school, not even for universities. It's all very, very flexible with that.

If you are currently homeschooling between October 1st and October 15th, which I think is tomorrow.

Technically, you have to file an affidavit on a state website. If you need that tonight, let me know. If you are not homeschooling as of tomorrow, you don't have to worry about that. You can start anytime during the year and just refile again the following year.

You'd buy all your own curriculum. The downside is you don't have any educational support, which is a little bit, hard for a lot of our families as they come out.

So there are two other options that a lot of families choose.

The second option is a public charter program, and so this is a non-classroom-based charter, or non-classroom-based charter program in California.

There's been some… some legal stuff going on in the Capitol on this, recently, and I believe Ocean Grove is the most, frequent charter that I see in the Bay Area that a lot of our two-e kiddos are in.

So technically, your student would be a public student, but you would be homeschooling generally at home. You would have a teacher that you would meet about once every 3 or 4 weeks who would oversee and help you with curriculum. And you would be able to get some free curriculum or enrichment activities from an approved vendor list.

So a lot of people will join the charter for that, you know, the financial piece, which can be really nice in helping you with your homeschooling. You can also get IEPs and 504s through your charter.

Typically, they offer those virtually and not as robustly as in a school, but they are available in that same way that a regular public school would follow.

Go ahead and flip.

And because, I'm here today, there's the umbrella program. This is the third program, and there are different umbrellas that are also filed as private schools, but they don't have to follow all of the requirements of a live, in-person school, so, all those,

You know, our student ratios and that are not, as regulated.

And so there's different homeschool umbrellas where you can get some educational support and not feel like you're homeschooling on your own. And so, mine is actually Sequoia Gifted Academy. It is the first umbrella school in the nation specifically for our highly, profoundly gifted TUI kiddos.

Because oftentimes, teachers don't understand our kiddos, and even in the homeschool charter world, still, sometimes they don't understand our asynchronicity or our kiddos' need for autonomy.

So, I won't spend a lot of time on the umbrella right now, but these are the three different ways if you choose to homeschool. And then also, if you were to pull out, partway from your school, some schools are starting to let our kiddos do that.

for either half a day, or a day a week, or something like that. That's something you could end up asking for, in your IEP meetings, for example. And, then you could also do homeschooling in addition to going to school for part of those times.

So right now, I'm going super quickly. I don't know how many people here are interested in this piece, but I want to make sure the slides are in here if you have any questions on that. I think there are questions, so I'm going to wrap up and go right to those yellow, if that works best for you.

Yep.

Okay.

Yael Valek — Transition to Q&A

I'm gonna stop sharing,

Kelly, I don't know if you have time to spotlight our speakers. We have a lot of questions.

I'll start with Heather,

what happens with 504 IEP plan? Or I guess this, actually, sorry, this is for Lauren and Heather. What happens to IEP or 504 plans if you switch to a private school? I know you touched on this.

Heather Johanson — Q&A: IEP/504 in private schools, redo 504, ignored private reports, public support for gifted, district-paid private school

Okay. I guess I can talk from, like, the…

that if there's kind of designations of schools, right? There's something called a non-public school, right? So if your child has moved to something called a non-public school through their IEP,

their IEP very much, obviously, kind of is dictating that placement, it's still in place, that's what's going to be happening, right? If you go to a private school.

because they are not part of, like, the Department of Education, they get to kind of play by different rules. They might have, like, a student support plan, but their IEP or their 504 is not going to be…

recognize in the same way. A lot of the time, those schools were like, oh, let us take a look, let's see what we can do, here's some accommodations.

But there's not the same legal jurisdiction in private schools as there is in the public schools. So when you kind of… if you do make that move.

Right? Your IEP doesn't, like, disappear, right? It's kind of just things like you put it in the freezer, right? And if you decide to come back to public school, you take it out of the freezer, and you say to public school, we're back, and here was our last IEP, and they kind of pick up that process from there. Lauren, I think you probably have…

A piece to that.

Yes. Basically, in a nutshell, yes. Actually, a lot of times, kind of, it's kind of, once again, those layers of support, right? You try… you had that SST meeting, things aren't working, you go to that 504, and if we're still seeing, like, things are not working, this child is still not successful, then you can put into writing a request.

for an assessment, absolutely. So just because you've agreed to a 504 does not mean you're locked in. You're never locked in, ever.

Yeah, this one, it's… this is so case-specific, right? Like, I think it's… I have found, like.

so basically, you come to a school district and say, hey, I have this report, it says my kiddo has all of this going on, I want them to have an IEP. And they say, okay, here's your assessment plan, we're going to assess them for an IEP, right? And they go through their whole assessment process.

based on, like, what we've come up with, we don't think they qualify. And then if you're not in agreement with that, you can request something called an IEE. Oh my gosh, this is where my brain just starts. Lisa, help me.

Educational Evaluation.

Thank you, I had 4 IEPs today, my brain's no longer working, no words.

And then that process kind of kicks in, and then there's somebody else that's going to kind of come in and make recommendations based on what they found. And that person, kind of, this is where you really want to find the right IE assessor. This part's really important, is you want them to really look at that past report, what the school did, you want them to really get back into the data to potentially kind of

Say, why this kiddo needs special education.

Oh, it's just… it's so complicated and nuanced, and I… that's… I really think that's why it's just… by the time you're sitting down at that IEP table.

you want there to be such a much more robust view of this kiddo, right? Like, the more you can kind of… and sometimes it's not possible, but when it is possible, that collaboration with your… if you're elementary with your teacher, or, like, somebody on a team, so they really get your kid, because once you have kind of a…

a person on that team that's really working with you. They're almost working almost as your advocate, too, because they can give that nuance.

Because that's the thing with our two-week kid, is there's nuance, right? On paper, sometimes they look really fat. They're great test takers sometimes. They're gonna blow… I've had teachers, I've heard it so many times, an RSP teacher say, I've never had a kid go this far on this standardized test before, right? And they're just blown away with what they can do, but sure, one-on-one with this teacher, and there's snacks, and it's great, and it's lovely, they're

cruising, but you put them in the classroom, they're under their desk, because they're totally freaked out, right? So I think that's the nuance we need to bring to those tables, so people can kind of get what we're asking for.

Yeah, it is. I mean, it's not… is it fair? No, but is it kind of…

Is it the reality!

there's no law around it, right? Like, it used to be we kind of had different programs, a lot of those have kind of, especially as budgets have been cut, and, like, those have very much shrunk over time. I think, honestly, this is where that first layer I talked about is pretty key, like, especially with your elementary school kiddo.

Public school teachers are pretty burnt, I'm just gonna be really honest about it, but if you show up and you have the thing for your kiddo, like, here's the tangrams, can he do these? Here's this really cool book where he's got these insane math puzzles. Can he have this? Can he do this? Like, like, if you're kind of solving the problem, you're gonna get so much further.

with that, like, that is going to be kind of the way I think you can handle some of that boredom piece in a… in a very kind of…

lower lift way, is really partnering up with your teacher, and not, like, just saying, can you do this for me? But if you kind of come in and have the problem solved, you're gonna get a lot more lean-in, for sure.

Oh, boy.

So, basic… I mean, that's… that's a really in-depth question. In… if I'm going, like, up.

If you have an IEP, and they are not making progress on their goals, they are not accessing their education, that is when a school district would be under obligation to pay for a different placement.

that's… there's a million layers within that, but that's kind of the big canned nutshell piece. It's a lot… I've had, like, parents kind of reach out to me, and their kiddo's never been in a public school ever, and they're like, we want to have our public schools pay for this private school.

that's gonna be a lot tougher than if you have gone through the public school, gone through their layers, you've given their… their… their thing a try, a real honest try. That is where I've seen placements made much easier, versus, like, well, we just want this to happen now.

So, that's a very tiny answer for a very big question.

Lauren Meltzer — Q&A: IEP/504 in private schools, mainstream fit, one-on-one schools, Bridges and 2E programs

Yeah, so, I mean, I think that the private schools, depending on which, are going to try to accommodate the kinds of things that would be in your IEP or 504, it just won't be… have the legal

legally, you won't get the same kind of accommodations, it's just that… but they do try, you know, especially if they have learning support, they're gonna try to accommodate you.

Yeah, so, I think it's,

Again, you're interviewing them as much as they're interviewing you, and so if you can get,

Someone that's their learning specialist or support, and have a conversation with them, and explain, kind of, what

you know, where your child's at, what support they need, what accommodations they need, and make sure that that is part of the culture. That's the best way, I think.

So, I think that, you know, I would think about what, like, in terms of prioritization, does this school have, would your child thrive, if there are certain interests? Like, they really want to play in a sports team at school, or they really want to do plays at school.

I think that would be something to look for. Also…

How they accommodate children that have emotional needs that, are…

you know, that a public school might not have the bandwidth to accommodate, so I would think about that, and… because, you know, it really, it just depends so much on the school and the environment, and as Lisa said, looking at the environment itself.

You know, some of these classes will… these mainstream schools will have buckets of.

fidgets. Just, you know, they're… even though not all their kids need fidgets, they kind of, normalize it, so that would be another thing I would look for, or, you know, like, your, you know, whatever, there's… there's different things that they might normalize by just having them accessible to all the students.

I do think that I have found that some of the micro schools that are for the twice-exceptional can actually give almost a better experience, because

They're small enough that you can still get the customization, but they tend to…

understand the twice-exceptional Child. The fusion isn't just for, you know, the fusion is kind of a big catch-all for lots of different kinds of learners and, you know, kids that have the, you know, challenges that… where the public school's not going to make sense.

kids that are in sports, and they need the flexibility, and… and everything. So, you know, as Lisa said, they are going to be more teach-to-the-test, if it be.

Yeah, I have also heard that Bridges is, you know, Bridges was developed with the TUI learner in mind. Some of the other schools have kind of morphed into that, because they've… a lot of times they've started small, and they've realized, wow, we have these…

issues, but then these kids are really bright, and so we'll call ourselves TUI. So, but they still can meet your child's needs.

And they also might find community there.

You just have to be discerning.

Lisa Jobe — Q&A: IEE nuance, social priorities, mainstream fit, gifted support, one-on-one/micro/co-ops, district-paid placements, homeschooling breadth, acceleration, Bridges fit, learning profiles

Okay, there you go, thanks!

to be read.

I'm looking forward to talking with families.

This actually just came up for me, last week, or a couple weeks ago, and that is, I've seen now where, it's very common for our two-wee kiddos to have that full, individualized, assessment from a psychologist.

and then go to the school, and the school might deny it, that, you know, maybe our kiddo has a diagnosis of autism from a psychologist, and then they go and they do that, child find, the, you know, I believe that my child's autism is…

affecting their, learning and want the, child fined assessment. And the school, sometimes will say, no, we don't think you… we don't think your child qualifies, your child has good grades.

So…

It's one of those, you know, I play an attorney, but I actually don't play an attorney. I have a law degree, I was an attorney, so I know the law really well, but I'm not here as an attorney. But, the Department of Education, federally, before it got closed down, has some letters called the Delisle Letters, and,

There's also case law in California that says a, 2E or gifted child's good grades do not bar them from the IEP, from the IDEA, the Individuals with Disabilities and Education Act.

So they cannot use the fact that your child's not failing, which is often something parents are told. And if they do deny it, then they do need to go back, and they need to under… they need to recognize that your child was diagnosed by an outside evaluation. So they can't say, well.

I'm not looking at anything, and your child doesn't fall into IDEA. If the parent says, my child was diagnosed with, you know, autism, and we believe it's affect… affecting them.

When the school denies them, they need to have considered that private report also, in that Before denying it.

Otherwise, yes, they might make you go through all those autism reports the parents have to do, and all those pieces that might feel redundant.

But I wanted to just throw that in. That was a little nuance in when they need to consider that outside versus when they can completely go… completely on their own in their school evaluation. Yeah. Have you seen that too, either of you, maybe?

I would first just say, especially in California, and probably all across, you know.

a gifted program doesn't usually mean that our kids' gifted needs are being met in any way, really. I don't think I've really met anyone who feels that a gifted program alone meets that.

And then the social piece, you know, that is really hard, and if that is the… again, if we go back to that framework of those five environments, if that's the leading thing for our kiddos, for this kid at this time, if that… if that's, you know, important to them, I would prioritize that.

But also keep in mind, right, build up some scaffolding, because, gosh, you know, at some point, they're not going to be in the same class. At some point, you know, chances are, especially in the Bay Area, somebody might move.

So you want to build up some scaffolding and not have that be the sole reason. You know, we can certainly do play dates outside, we can get together, we can do…

A lot of different ways to nurture that friendship, but that would be my two cents, and I'll just throw it to both of the others, see if you have anything to add.

I do a lot of school advocacy, with that, kind of profile, and I would say, especially with the anxiety and that.

You know, that middle school's a hard time because there's a lot going on, a lot of bell changes, and those kind of pieces. So definitely, you know, thinking about what the physical environment looks like can be really important for that learner, for that family.

But really, you know, different schools and different 2E things, right? My dysgraphic son would have different needs than perhaps somebody who has general anxiety disorder, for example.

So that would be my general framework. I think I lost the pin of that question.

Yeah, I'll just add in there, I know a lot of people who've tried Fusion and then gone to homeschooling, or tried schools like that. The one thing that's interesting is, you know, again, this word accreditation kind of catches people's eyes. Generally, if a school is accredited.

It usually means that they have had to go through and have their curriculum kind of standardized in some way, and so the curriculum then becomes less flexible. So a lot of families pay a lot of money to basically use what I call a canned curriculum.

And so they may be done with 9th grade in, you know, February, or what have you, but it's really a very, kind of…

I don't want to say basic level, because that's not fair, but it's a very standards-level, kind of.

curriculum that is not, modified to the child's strengths, interests, preferences, or anything like that. So, it's really a way of taking what's in most schools for the most part, and then going one-on-one with it. That's generally the model. And then again, a lot of those private schools, their teachers, really, unfortunately, the price point and what these teachers are getting paid and their expertise

not to say that about Fusion specifically, but in a lot of these types of schools that have popped up, there's a big disconnect. So it's kind of a big corporate thing, but our teachers aren't necessarily super experienced.

if they love what they're doing and they're passionate, just like everything we're talking about, they can be amazing teachers, but the curriculum generally is not going to be specialized for the child. It's just going to be presented more of in a one-on-one way, which can help around some of the 2E learning differences.

Yeah, and the micro-schools, and that gets into the co-ops, which you saw a lot of the pictures that I was sharing, microschools and co-ops.

are very similar. The kind of the main difference is a micro school is you hire somebody to teach the classes, and the parent drops off, and the co-op, parents kind of barter their time and their specialty. So, like, you can guess I end up teaching a lot of the government classes, or English classes, because those were my backgrounds.

And so, the micro schools, one thing I want to just add to what Lauren's sharing is a lot of them are very project-based, too, and that really can, be a nice fit for our two e-learners. And I know Lydie in Burlingame is actually adding some project-based learning.

pieces, which has been kind of exciting and fun. So, even if you have that kind of homeschool, and you wanted, like, a more… a thing to kind of go do, that could be an option.

Something about the a la carte, especially once they get to high school, it's like, okay, how do we put together this…

Right concoction for you.

Absolutely, absolutely, yeah.

Yeah, and I have a lot of families who have done that, and I can tell you, as a lawyer, I always say, as a lawyer, I always say, don't litigate, right? And it's kind of the same for that. By the time… usually you do need a lawyer. There's very few in California who are great. Woodsmall is really the most well-known.

But the process is very long, and it's expensive, and frankly, by the time you go through that process, you may have spent as much in legal fees and time off and all those things then.

You might come out sometimes somewhat close in the end, I would say. Would you say, Heather?

Yeah, so first of all, it's probably in your head, and second, it's actually okay in California. That's not my personal philosophy, I would say, but that is perfectly fine. You know, you don't really have to jump through all of the hoops.

really, once you get to a certain level, you really think about what their end goal is. And so, a lot of our kiddos end up going to community college, kind of, as the next step, and when they do that kind of as an early college piece that fits really well with our TUE learners, and then your university, if that's what your end game is.

will only look, really, at that 2-year degree, and they don't even look at what they did in high school, so a lot of unschoolers, or people who didn't actually go and do four years of school in high school, end up with amazing degrees. One of the young women I know, she unschooled through high school.

And then went to community college for 2 years, and then went off to Hilo to be a marine scientist, degree, and has worked for the Smithsonian since then.

So, you don't have to step through it in the same way, but by having some educational support, they can help guide you with where they can get that history, or that… whatever it is that you are not teaching. And again, most of our TUI learners do have outside, teachers and support.

I happen to know y'all has a teacher for a couple of her kiddos.

And I have a 16-year-old that I really love, who's really fun, so, among others. Yeah, so definitely, you know, and usually, I have to be honest, too, most of us farm out, I did too, because, our kids listen to other people better than they listen to us sometimes. So, yeah, no worries.

So this is almost all of my kids. Like, almost all of my 300 kids I worked with. You know, math is the most common, because it's very step-based, and it's very common to start jumping, and a lot of our kiddos, especially before algebra, can jump multiple grades very quickly. Both mine did, too.

The problem becomes, if you're not willing to grade, accelerate, you're going to run out real quickly. And that happens both at the elementary level, then it happens at the high school level. At the elementary level, keep in mind that most math teachers and other teachers are only certified to teach K-8, which means that once you hit 9th grade math.

They technically can't teach that, if he's, you know, your child's in 5th grade, or whatever they're in.

And so then you end up either having to farm them back and forth to the different schools, or you just have this huge disconnect, and usually it doesn't line up, and it becomes a nightmare for parents at some point. And then when you get to high school, you also have to think about the fact that, you know, when you look ahead to college.

There are certain, especially if they're a public school student, they need to hit those A to Gs, and, colleges will only count what's on your last 4 years, or your high school transcript.

So, at some point, a lot of our math, really mathy kids run out of math. So I have, for example, a 13-year-old who's auditing classes at Columbia, another one who's auditing classes at University of Washington, but they're kind of stuck. They physically can't get 4 years on their transcript.

because they've even run out at the community college level, and they're only 13. So, you end up kind of creating a little bit of this, so to the extent you can learn out instead of up, that can be helpful, too, in the meantime. But it's pretty… it's a pretty common problem.

So, so Bridges specifically, so I do know Bridges, I've actually done research with Dr. Baum at Bridges, with the Bridges Kids. You know, Bridges, I think, I don't know if my Bridges cohorts would say this, or my professors, but Bridges has a reputation, I think, as, generally, having a lot of autistic kiddos, and that's

probably true, but I have seen the range there, and I have seen… honestly, I do… I work with kids who have the 160 plus IQs, and I've…

seen the most brilliant, brilliant learner I've ever seen in my life, at Bridges. So, they definitely can handle, those, those, exceptional kiddos, too.

But yeah, but I, I mean, they certainly know, and their professor, their teachers are trained on, mo… you know, all from dysgraphia to dyslexia to, you know, the emotional, things. So, yeah, I think Bridges is a great fit for all that.

Some schools aren't, though, so some schools are known to be more for, like, ADHD. Schools in Philadelphia, for example, Davidson and Stanford Online take a lot of our highly profoundly gifted kiddos, and they can be a little bit more difficult for our kiddos who have, especially those EF issues.

dysgraphia pieces like that. So it's always good to talk to, veteran parents.

But there is a lot of, kids who come in and out of those programs with various, 2E, needs of different kinds.

Daniel, can I throw one more thing in?

is that both Bridges, Academy Lab, and Sequoia both do, a suite of tools assessments, which are learning profiles.

Dr. Baum actually created it with Dr. Robin Shader, and they're really great for being able to do all those things, to bring these reports and these advocacy profiles in, and really, a lot of families are successful when they're able to bring in

this full picture of how their children learn differently, and what they need in those five environments, and to have that conversation in those SST meetings and that. So, if that's something that families are interested in, either at Bridges Lab or through Sequoia, I'm happy to answer more questions about that, too.

Thank you, thanks for.

Yael Valek — Q&A facilitation and closing remarks

Kelly, I don't know if you have time to spotlight our speakers. We have a lot of questions.

I'll start with Heather,

what happens with 504 IEP plan? Or I guess this, actually, sorry, this is for Lauren and Heather. What happens to IEP or 504 plans if you switch to a private school? I know you touched on this.

Okay? I feel like I messed up and agreed to a 504 plan that is not ideal to my son. Can I get a redo?

what if the public school ignores private report data? You touched on this.

We have a ton of questions, so I pre… I'm just gonna move us along. Thank you. Best not to hide your child's struggles. What's the best way, I think this is for Lauren, to approach talking about our kids' reality in the high school admissions process?

Thank you. And then, okay, my son is happy at the school he's at, even though they don't have anything special for giftedness, etc, because he has a very good friend there. He's 9 years old, I'm worried that if I change schools, that one friend will not be there anymore, and he will be stressed. What's a good framework to reason about this?

I think… I think they're asking, so I think Lauren mentioned there are nice mainstream schools. What, what, what kind of 2E kids might fit that versus needing, like, a more specialized school?

Good points.

Can someone speak to what kind of 2E kid might find a good fit at a nice mainstream school? Detail. My son doesn't have externalizing behaviors, but he does have anxiety and can get overwhelmed and dysregulated. Looks like he's crying going under his desk. He's in 5th grade.

I think this is probably Heather. When is public school required to pay for your child's private school?

Lauren, I don't know if you… do you know of any East Bay, Berkeley, Oakland area microschools, or is there a directory of microschools? Or should they reach out to you, or…

One of the worries, I guess this is for Lisa, one of the worries that I have is if I homeschool, I will end up not teaching them things like history, art, and writing, and he's going to only learn science and math. Is that a real worry, or just made up in my head?

Sometimes.

I want to acknowledge that it's 8.30, but there's two more questions, so if you guys are okay to hang on for just a couple more minutes.

Thoughts on single-subject acceleration in public school that's otherwise a good fit for now? Whole grade skip doesn't feel right for numerous reasons, but advanced math instruction is a particular area of need.

Heather, did you want to add anything, or should we go? Okay, so the last question…

Can you speak to whether 2E programs are designed to support the full range of twice-exceptional learners? In particular, how well do environments like bridges meet the needs of profoundly or exceptionally gifted students, as opposed to those who are just one or two standard deviations above the mean?

Thank you all so much, and for everyone who attended tonight, as you can see, there's not a perfect fit, and I think REEL always recommends, like you guys all said, to pick what is your biggest priority right now, and optimize for that, and what are you able to supplement outside on your own, because there isn't going to be one school. If you find it, please tell me right away, that meets, you know, all the TUI learners' needs, and of course, everyone has such diverse needs.

So…

Awesome, thank you. So thank you all so much. This was so enlightening and helpful. I hope everyone that attended and is watching the recording, got their question answered, and if not, please reach out. Callie posted all their contact info in the chat, and we'll send it out in our email as well. And thank you all so much for sharing your expertise with everyone.